The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » New to magic? » » Classic Force Practice (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

Mimix
View Profile
New user
The Land of Aus
17 Posts

Profile of Mimix
To me, the classic force seems to be the least suspicious way to force a card. But how do you get the practice in? I don't want to mess it up performing and my Mrs is ready to get an automatic weapon if she hears " quickly pick a card". Plus she knows what Im up to. Any hints?
The simple things in life are often the best
tom_stamm
View Profile
Loyal user
Los Angeles
248 Posts

Profile of tom_stamm
Just perform it in your normal act, with an "out" ready when you fail. When I was learning it I was working pizza parlors and I just did it every night for 2 or 3 hours a night.

For Example: Force a card and you miss. You still know what the card is so cut it to the bottom. have the person place her card on top of the deck and cut anywhere the use the failed-forced-card as a key card. Then use your favorite method to astound and amuse.

Eventually, you will use the "out" less and less.
Just Some Guy.

"For Seven Tons of the King's Tea,
Six Fine Ladies to Fight a Great Jackass -- me."
spycrapper
View Profile
Loyal user
Indonesia
295 Posts

Profile of spycrapper
The best way to practice Classic Force is to do it whenever you do a pick card trick, even if the trick doesn't require you to do a force. If you fail forcing a card, then it's not a problem (the trick doesn't require it), and if you succeed, you will become more confident.
Magic is life

Ario A.
visit my blog:
http://amagicblog.wordpress.com
ryan8406
View Profile
New user
Elkton, Maryland
88 Posts

Profile of ryan8406
I wanted to mention that you might want to check out Paul Greens video on the classic force. It helped me.
scody
View Profile
Loyal user
232 Posts

Profile of scody
Hey Mimix!
I do a faceup classic... which misses occasionally... but I have several outs... that is... all of the tricks that I do that don't require a force.

ACR
Think Touch Turn
Card to Wallet
Card to Box
Paperclipped
etc.
etc.
etc.

Could concievably go into any effect at all that doesn't require a force, like Three Card Monte if you wanted to.

The thing that takes experience is the way you go about your force. Don't tip the trick before you do.

You can casually lay a red backed card on the table... classic it's dupe. If you miss, who cares... go into something else. If you hit it... you have your miracle.

Let them change their minds even!!! That really blows them away. If you classic, hit it, let them change their minds... and they do... go into a non force trick. But... if you classic, hit it, let them change their minds, and they don't... the effect is much... much stronger.

I think the thing is... you just gotta go out there and start getting that psych experience with your tricks. ALWAYS start with a classic, if you hit, great, if not.. break out a sharpie and have them sign it for the ACR.

Good luck!
qureyoon
View Profile
Loyal user
Singapore
269 Posts

Profile of qureyoon
Quote:
On 2008-09-23 14:02, Mimix wrote:
.... Any hints?


Card College Volume 1, page 217-222, the same advice that Paul Green give on his dvd.
Bill Thompson
View Profile
Elite user
Mississippi
422 Posts

Profile of Bill Thompson
Classic force practice? Learn Whit Haydn's Chicago Surprise.
"To let understanding stop at what cannot be understood is a high attainment.
Those who cannot do it will be destroyed on the lathe of heaven." - Chuang Tse
Dynamike
View Profile
Eternal Order
FullTimer
24107 Posts

Profile of Dynamike
I agree with getting Paul Green's DVD. He is the master with the Classic Force.
Glenn Morphew
View Profile
Elite user
Chicago
480 Posts

Profile of Glenn Morphew
Mark Mason has some great work on the classic force as well.
Visit www.povmagician.com for
The Rub-a-dub Deluxe Suite
The Morphew One Hand Top Palm
Bob's 3 Shell Boot Camp and more...
PaulGreen
View Profile
Inner circle
1130 Posts

Profile of PaulGreen
Hi everyone,

First, I want to thank all of those above posters that have touted my DVD on the Classic Force. It is most gratifying to hear that one's "work" has been helpful in learning how to do something. The DVD is available through your local dealer or directly from me.

In addition, I would like to direct you to many of the sources listed above as well. Paul Gertner's booklet is great. Card College is great. Mark Mason's work is great. Royal Road to Card Magic is great. The Eddie Tullock book is great. Everyone of these books will make your attempts to learn about the Classic Force easier, and better.

Enjoy the search.

Regards,

Paul Green
Lawrence O
View Profile
Inner circle
Greenwich (CT)
6799 Posts

Profile of Lawrence O
Quote:
On 2008-09-26 22:08, PaulGreen wrote:
Hi everyone,

First, I want to thank all of those above posters that have touted my DVD on the Classic Force. It is most gratifying to hear that one's "work" has been helpful in learning how to do something. The DVD is available through your local dealer or directly from me.

In addition, I would like to direct you to many of the sources listed above as well. Paul Gertner's booklet is great. Card College is great. Mark Mason's work is great. Royal Road to Card Magic is great. The Eddie Tullock book is great. Everyone of these books will make your attempts to learn about the Classic Force easier, and better.

Enjoy the search.

Regards,

Paul Green


Hi Paul

Thanks for these references which I would agree with, if they are placed on perspective.
You're not in the best position to say that but your DVD is by far the best way to learn the ropes and the subtleties on the Classic Force and to feel at ease with the sleight.

It should be added tht the reason why magicians keep coming with new way of forcing cards is that the classic force that they feel unsecure with is the best force for it replicates the natural way of selecting a card.

Now for magicians to want to practice it, if they want it to work like a charm, they must feel dead confident about their force. It seems like a vicious circle and actually somewhere it was. Magicians shy away from doing it because they don't get 100% success with it, and they don't get 100% success with it because they are unsecure with the moves.

Here is how to gain confidence because you get a certainty of result. Have two force cards in mind for your effect to work (if the trick does not allow you an alternative between two cards, have a dupplicate of the card to force in your deck). One of them is the card to force and the other one is your parachute.

Bring the parachute card fourth from the top and keep control of the card to be forced as tught by Paul Green
Cull the parachute and force the force card. If you miss, interrupt the force half way yhrough requesting the spectator to leave the card protruding in the deck, and switch that card for the culled parachute card using the Jack Parker Slip Slide Force. (Antinomy magazine issue # 7 with filmed demo)

The point here is not to replace the classic force by Jack Parker's interesting Slip Slide Force (with its selection process starting like the Classic Force), it's to gain sufficient confidence for the classic force to work 100% of the time.

We dare more when we know that we run no risk, and we succeed more when we dare more (it has always been true in magic whether with the palm, the pass, the top change...)

Learn teh classic force from Paul and learn the Jack Parker's parachute to avoid hesitating using the CF under fire.
Magic is the art of proving impossible things in parallel dimensions that can't be reached
Mr Roy
View Profile
New user
56 Posts

Profile of Mr Roy
I love the Classics they are one of the most difficult things to do yet the most convicing when executed correctly like the classif force, classic pass and classic palm(coins). And like what Paul Green Said on his DVD don't do it to someone who is close to you. ANd practice it even you don't need to force a card.
Josh the Superfluous
View Profile
Inner circle
The man of
1881 Posts

Profile of Josh the Superfluous
When practicing on your own, place a book on a table, with one corner pointing toward you. Force the card in between the pages. Not perfect, but helpful in timing the approach.
What do you want in a site? "Honesty, integrity and decency." -Mike Doogan
"I hate it, I hate my ironic lovechild. I didn't even have anything to do with it" Josh #2
Mr Roy
View Profile
New user
56 Posts

Profile of Mr Roy
Josh that seems to be a great idea will try it. thanks.
The Amazing Noobini
View Profile
Inner circle
Oslo, Norway
1658 Posts

Profile of The Amazing Noobini
Quote:
On 2008-09-27 15:05, Josh the Superfluous wrote:
When practicing on your own, place a book on a table, with one corner pointing toward you. Force the card in between the pages. Not perfect, but helpful in timing the approach.


That's a nice idea! (And the only suggestion that actually answered the original question, I think.) Smile

My own problem is that when I spread the deck and ask people to pick a card they command me to stop spreading so that they can choose. Then they hold a flat hand over the fan as a shield and sneak a card out beneath it. I've actually only done pick-a-card type effects a couple of times but this behavior has been reoccurring. Well, that is another topic I suppose.

Thanks for the book tip!
"Talk about melodrama... and being born in the wrong part of the world." (Raf Robert)
"You, my friend, have a lot to learn." (S. Youell)
"Nonsensical Raving of a lunatic mind..." (Larry)
The Burnaby Kid
View Profile
Inner circle
St. John's, Canada
3107 Posts

Profile of The Burnaby Kid
With a bit of creativity, it's possible to routine a trick to have a plot where it doesn't matter too much if the classic force misses. It means that you have to change the nature of the effect a bit -- you can't use an effect that requires a 100% hit rate (eg: you painted the prediction on the side of a building), but your options aren't as limited as you might think.

If you've got the Royal Road to Card Magic, the Insidious Dr. Fu Liu Tu has within it a means of getting information even if you miss the CF. The trick to it is routining it so that all the actions are properly motivated.

Here's an example. You pull out an Invisible Deck and plop it straight in the middle of the table, saying that you've got something special there that you don't want to explain just yet. You have a spectator select a card. If you hit, you just move into the ID to show that you had a dream last night about them choosing a card (or whatever).

Let's say you miss. They show the card to everybody, you take it back to the deck, shuffle the cards, show that you didn't do anything sneaky such as control it to the top or bottom, and say that it's not that kind of trick anyway. You point at the ID in the middle of the table and say that last night you had a dream about them choosing a card, and you took that deck out and reversed the one card, saving it for today. Get rid of the cards in your hand, pull out the ID and finish your trick.

If you know the Insidious Dr Fu Liu Tu you'll instantly know how you can accomplish this trick based on the choreography above (perhaps writing "Dream Cards" on the card box will help out a little bit -- again, if you know the routine, it's self-evident as to why). Incidentally, the technique is excellent, and much better than it reads. If you don't have faith in the text alone, then get your hands on R Paul Wilson's RRTCM DVDs and have a look at how he executes it. It's really something in his hands, it's executed at the perfect time, and there's no sense of there being a "bad" move. The above description matches the timing and motivation, including only a different shuffle and the convincer that you didn't control the cards (and quite frankly, it's optional).
A screed for scams, sorcery, and other shenanigans... Nu Way Magick Blogge

JACK, the Jolly Almanac of Card Knavery, a free card magic resource for beginners.
Bill Thompson
View Profile
Elite user
Mississippi
422 Posts

Profile of Bill Thompson
Thanks for sharing that Andrew... I will certainly be digging out my copy of Royal Road. And I agree with you about practicing the force using an out if the force fails.

For example, I earlier said that Whit Haydn's Chicago Surprise is a good routine to use for force practice because of the built in out of the routine. In the first part of the routine, The Chicago Opener, uses The Classic Force, if you miss you have an out by using the trick I Have A Surprise For You for the final phase.
"To let understanding stop at what cannot be understood is a high attainment.
Those who cannot do it will be destroyed on the lathe of heaven." - Chuang Tse
MR2Guy
View Profile
Regular user
Nashville
179 Posts

Profile of MR2Guy
This has to be my favorite sleight. It's all in the attitude that it does not matter which card is chosen, and timing the spectator. I classic force every time I offer a card selected, but as advised, I always have an out if the force card is not selected, usually another effect. This leads to confidence, which improves the sleight. I would say it works 95% for me now. And it's fun.

Jason
Question every rule.
There are no absolutes.
rjthomp
View Profile
Regular user
Pasadena
194 Posts

Profile of rjthomp
Try it with a few duplicate cards at first to increase your odds. Then gradually reduce the number as you get better. But be warned that one problem with the classic force is that even when spectators take the right card they may have a hint that something was not quite fair about the force. I've noticed that I've often got better reactions with other forces (even ones like the criss-cross force that really shouldn't work as well), than I have with the classic force. This may be a problem with my body language--its hard not to relax a bit when they take the right card...

-Rob
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » New to magic? » » Classic Force Practice (0 Likes)
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2021 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.16 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL