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stephane_arnow Loyal user 283 Posts |
Hi oliver
Maybe it can change if the creators propose the licences to them. Good europeens builders ( not dominik; I spoke about good europeens builders) are trying to save their business, and if they are able to build perfectly an effect, I don't understand why they can't ask for a licence. Maybe a diffusion of the information to them about that can be done, and I 'm sure that they will play the game. But nobody propose them the rights, or never accept when they ask for. Explaination is : they build ripp off... So it can't never stop and it is without end. It can be change but.... But ...I think that simply american builder protect their business (I understand that but I notice it, and I respect that). If it was not so big and so expensive to ship (and so complex to deal maybe), Jan Rouven or Christian Farla for example wouldn't own and present THE DRILL OF DEATH made in germany. Licence would be propose; it is better to make it build in Germany with rights paid than let it build in germany without fees paid ? And the prop is excellent at the craftmanship point of view, nobody can't say the contrary. And with the price of such an apparatus , additionnal cost for shipping would absolutly awesome. You can be sure that if Drill of death was invented in Germany, americans magicians interested by this effect would have bought the licence to build it in USA. Not sure they would import it. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't speak about small props. I speak about the Drill of death, not a minicub zag size trick..and even for a minicub Zag, there is licence in USA! So I 'm not here to give reasons or justify something. Just to say my opinion, and the little hypocrisy in the business... And I propose that the creators give licences to 1 or 2 USA builders, and 1 or 2 in europe (north europe, middle europe), and 1 in others locations in the world, where we can found excellent workers . Specially for props very heavy . Prices will the same , but magicians will ok to pick up the apparatus themself and easily. For others props original and not too big, it will even not affect the sale from USA which will continue without problem. |
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RVH Magic Special user 877 Posts |
Stephane,
The problem is that most of the illusion builder in Europe (about 95% of them) make or sell knock offs of American illusions so why would a illusion designer or builder from the USA trust them ? |
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Oliver Ross Inner circle Europe 1724 Posts |
You baught it up to the point Rafael !
I think it's too late for the exising illusion builders in Europe. There might be a little chance for newcomers in this business, but they must first proove theirs own creativity in design and their own professional craftmenship in building classic illusions. Oliver. |
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bp Regular user ENGLAND 168 Posts |
Hey Guys....some illusionists in Europe do pay for the rights and do the right thing...Rafael does and so does the twins from England... for example I heard this story about them...the twins did this snow section in a show and paid Kevin James just to use a two themed snow stools they made to fit into the set...if they can do on something this small....it why can't you! Its someone elses idea so pay them...its the right thing to do!
BP |
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Oliver Ross Inner circle Europe 1724 Posts |
Bp,
Your comment is a very good idea for the individual performer. On the other hand, paying to get the right to get an illuson build doesn't tell us where this illusion must be build and if you get the plans with them. I know that Gary Ouellet did this in the past for some of his creations. Maybe Rafael and / or the Twins can tell us what and how they did to walk the correct way and for which illusions ? It would be interesting to know. Oliver. |
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jamieallan Loyal user 215 Posts |
Hi....All
If you cant pay for the shippping cost, you should not be using that illusion! If you want to know who has the rights a illusion DO YOUR HOME WORK!!!If you do want to buy one email Bill Smith but don't waste his time ask him he knows! Or why not take this idea from the twins get mark parker to design you an illusion judging by the twins web site that what they do and its put them at the top of the game....www.thetwins.co.uk Just think if you came up with a brand new idea for your show and no one yet yet thought of it how would you like me coming to watch your show and NICK your idea....I don't think Jan Rouven or Christian Farla paid the rights for the death drill BUT I may be wrong perhaps I will email them? I heard a new company will be starting up next year in England building effects and illusions? All the best............ |
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Oliver Ross Inner circle Europe 1724 Posts |
JamieAllan,
I think you didn't really followed or read the different posts on this thread. We're not talking about doing our home work ? We're neither talking about "nicking" somebody elses work or idea. Please re read before posting. Thanks for your understanding. Oliver. |
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stephane_arnow Loyal user 283 Posts |
Maybe illusion designers need try to regive their confiance, cause I'm sure that Europeen builders need licences, and will accept the rules (not all but some of them) . Trying with one to see how it works .
When a magician live only with magic, and when he present a show (with lots of clients, producers and new contacts ) with lot of apparatus which are ok but not legitimate (fooled by magic shop in europe, without knowledge in ethic)it is impossible to stop his activity ''only'' because of that. It is a fact. One after one, when possible financially, he will upgrade his props. |
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andyleeroy New user 51 Posts |
Daniel summers did a good start and is selling some of his ideas and props in europe / germany! so you have a chance to bye original illusions without the expensive shipping and taxes!!
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magiquemaker New user 69 Posts |
I think it's so funny that someone won FISM using a bunch of rip off illusions. That goes along way towards some peoples argument about why bothering being ethical?
Apparently there is no repercussions to being unethical in your prop purchases. You can purchase or build rip off props and still win a FISM world championship! Amazing. John |
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Oliver Ross Inner circle Europe 1724 Posts |
Andyleeroy,
Could you tell us who s the illusion builder n Germany authorized to build Daniel Summers illusion ? Thanks. Oliver. |
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stephane_arnow Loyal user 283 Posts |
Yes, I want to know too. Is it a sure information ? If yes, I wait this information ! Is it props in importations, or props build in Germany under summer's license?
Posted: Oct 28, 2008 7:13pm Ho I think I have found myself : Beltempo world of illusions. Is it ?It seems an importation, but not sure..? |
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jamieallan Loyal user 215 Posts |
Hey here is a thought why not contact Daniel Summers.........
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Oliver Ross Inner circle Europe 1724 Posts |
Thanks for this hint Jamie. That's what I was about to do.
Oliver. |
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RVH Magic Special user 877 Posts |
Daniel Summers builds them for Beltempo.
No licence to build them in Germany was given! |
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Oliver Ross Inner circle Europe 1724 Posts |
Thanks Rafael,
I've send already a mail to Daniel before your post, so I guess I'll get the same answer. Oliver. |
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stephane_arnow Loyal user 283 Posts |
Ok, and I read that he give to Beltempo a special price which give the possibilities to resell . I haven't calculate if it is interesting of not to order for us in Germany or directly to Dan Summers. Do you know if it is only for the 2 props on their site , or others too. It is a good news in all case. Even for the second hand market, it seems that we will find in the future original versions for sale instead of copies. Try to find a real Windshare for sale in europe : good luck . I have never seen one .
It is a good start, no ? I will calculate. The top would be that the price of the prop sold by Beltempo = near to the price in the USA without shipping charges and tax. |
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bp Regular user ENGLAND 168 Posts |
Stephane-arnow if you are looking for illusions the people I had a list from the twins they are selling lots? All rights paid some good stuff! I seem to remember they have just bought a fan? Hope that helps?
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stephane_arnow Loyal user 283 Posts |
What are they selling?
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bp Regular user ENGLAND 168 Posts |
Email them... look on web site for address http://www.thetwins.co.uk or http://www.theilusionists.com
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