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RJE
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I have the Osborne plans and I do not have a problem with the carpentry for the illusion, but I am having difficulty finding someone who can do the leatherwork needed. Any recommendations?

Thanks.
Flying Magus
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Ask at a Saddlers. They should at least be able to put you on the right trail.
Magically yours,

Michel Fouché
Believe in the Impossible
Illusionist11
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Are the Osborne Plans easy to follow, I think I'm getting wakeling sawing plans for christmas, also...do you need to be and advanced woodworker??
davemajor
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This place below does the restraints for the sawing in half, let us know how the build goes as I'm looking to do this illusion in the new year.

sawing

Dave
magicjohn2278
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I built a Wakeling Sawing last year from plans in the Wakeling book.
There should be a couple of pictures here:

http://i418.photobucket.com/albums/pp261......wing.jpg

http://s418.photobucket.com/albums/pp261......ing2.jpg

..couple of points worth noting... I built a mock-up first to test the size and after trying it with my assistant decided to make the box an inch wider and taller than the dimensions in the book.

It was originally built with three legs to each table (as per the plans) but I found that this was a little unstable unless your assistant is very careful getting on and off it and decided to change it to four legs to each table.

The straps that hold the boxes to the table are made from the black nylon stuff that is usually associated with luggage, and plastic clip fasteners, I would have liked wider straps (preferably a different colour), but couldn't get any at the time! I might change them later.

The restraints were adapted from rather nice legcuffs and collar from an internet company that sells bondage gear! Which gave me the line "I had to do a search on the internet for these... it didn't take very long!".

I used matching red magicians rope instead of leather leads on the collar and cuffs.

A couple of "over center catches" similar to those found on toolboxes, on the top of the tables are used to hold the tables together.

I found a company (in Germany I think) that sells magnets with a screw socket that would take a screw eye... pm me if you are interested and I'll search for them again... not sure why I mention this as it obviously has nothing to do with the trick!

And finally, as I'm getting really short of storage space, the boxes are made to break-down (well sort of!) for long-term storage they can be unscrewed and stored flat... it take about forty minutes to reassemble them though!

Best of luck with your project.
RJE
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Thanks for the help and encouragement.

Dave, that is exactly what I was looking for and will place the order with Cannon's in the very near future.

magicjohn, I too was thinking of altering the design to have 4 legs as well. I thought the 3 legs might be a little unsteady and you've helped confirm it.

I actually have a friend that does the carpentry for me. He is a good friend and a retired high school shop teacher that does amazing work. He has built a number of projects large and small, from plans and custom work.

We hope to have this one up and ready to go for next summer's resort season so it will be a few months before there's anything more to report.

Thanks again for the input!

Rob
M Sini
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John,

Nice job on the illusion.

Mario
Thomas Wayne
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Quote:
On 2008-12-17 21:38, herdman14 wrote:
John,

Nice job on the illusion.

Mario


Having built a number of these - and having performed the illusion many times
as well - I have to disagree.

While I'm sure the workmanship is fine, the decision to make the boxes a homogeneous shape and color - black, no less (!) - was poorly thought out. Alan Wakeling, the creator of this illusion, had a particular genius for design and no feature of his work was ever "accidental". The reason he opted for the frame-and-panel construction of these boxes was to cause a visual effect that disguised their size - something that is totally lacking in the above photos. Those monolithic boxes look HUGE (which they are) and believe me, the fact that they are black does NOT make them look any smaller.

With frame-and-panel construction you have no easy way to tell if the frame wood is 3 inches wide, or 4 inches, or…? Is the frame wood the same width on the verticals as it is on the horizontals? Are the upper frame members and lower frame members the same width? If you needed to add an inch to the height you could easily distribute that between a 3/8” wider top frame member and 5/8” wider bottom frame member. With the solid black boxes you just have to make them an obvious inch taller!


Every aspect of the original Wakeling design serves to hide the size of the boxes. The solid wood frames surrounding the inner panels form break points on the surface(s) that greatly diminish their apparent dimensions. There’s no easy way for the spectator’s eye to estimate the size at a glance. In the same way the hinges and latches for the trap doors, the elevated lip of the tables and the WIDE leather straps all serve to deceive the eye, similar to the way that a stepped concealment base is much more deceptive than a beveled base of the same thickness.

In the Wakeling book, Steinmeyer points out that without a "strong presentation" there is literally no mystery to the illusion. What he fails to note - though it is equally true - is that the physical design of the illusion itself is also very important to its success [as a mystery].

I understand that a flat panel construction is much easier than the original design, but I think all of you out there who plan to build your own illusions would be well served to realize that the original design was probably VERY carefully thought out. Unless the change you are making is absolutely guaranteed to IMPROVE the effect you should think long and hard about making that change. If, instead, you are making changes simply because it makes the construction easier you should probably choose a different project.

It might be noted that many absolutely horrible versions of this illusion can be found out there. They are atrocious attempts, again featuring construction shortcuts and design simplifications that, in my opinion, completely ruin the effect:


TW
MOST magicians: "Here's a quarter, it's gone, you're an idiot, it's back, you're a jerk, show's over." Jerry Seinfeld
M Sini
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Thomas,

First, I was mostly spekaing about the build quality of John's illusion. I thought he did a good job of constructing it. After viewing the wellington version, I do agree with you that it sells the effect much better.
Mario
owln_1
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I build Saddles and Driving Harnesses, and I also have plans for the Wakeling Saw, I could construct these for you. PM me if you are interested. Owln_1
RJE
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I have ordered the Cannon restraints. Thanks all for the input and advice!

Rob
Magic Researcher
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TW;
Since you have built a number of these, why not show us pictures of the units that you built. We would most certainly be interested in seeing examples of your superior work. Even photos taken during your many performances would be fine. Thanks.
MR
Repeating a falsehood often and loudly does not make it true.
rtgreen
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Thomas,

I'm just playing devil's advocate here, but do you feel a paint job on flat panel constuction would accomplish the same deception as the frame an panel construction of the original?

Thanks,
Richard
makeupguy
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Richard:
I can answer that..

No.

it's not that hard to build it the right way.

and not much more expensive..
Blair Marshall
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BUT, it would still be better even with painted framing.

MR, I think Thomas has pointed the poster in the right direction with the Wellington photo, another 5 photos showing the same styling from him would serve no purpose.

Blair
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Blair;
Comparing something from Wellington with a Thomas Wayne item would be like comparing a wood dowel to one of his wands. I've searched all over the web for a picture of one of the number of these that he has says he has built; but found nothing. It would be nice to see one that he has built to see his little refinements in design. Surely anyone who would build these illusions would take pictures of them. So he must have a few photos on hand to share. How about it, TW, willing to share?
MR
Repeating a falsehood often and loudly does not make it true.
magicjohn2278
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Well Thomas, thanks for your input.. (scathing though it was!)

Quote:
On 2008-12-18 18:09, Thomas Wayne wrote:

I understand that a flat panel construction is much easier than the original design, but I think all of you out there who plan to build your own illusions would be well served to realize that the original design was probably VERY carefully thought out. Unless the change you are making is absolutely guaranteed to IMPROVE the effect you should think long and hard about making that change. If, instead, you are making changes simply because it makes the construction easier you should probably choose a different project.

TW


I would just like to point out that I didn't actually make any changes to the original design... the sawing that I built is virtually identical to the details given in the book!

Before making it, I did consider various alternative designs for the top and sides, including panel construction similar to the Wellington version. ($7500!!!??) However, it was obvious that a "true" panel construction (with recessed panels) was only going to result in a physically larger box.

Once the construction was finished, I had great difficulty deciding whether to paint the outside of the boxes (and what colour)or to finish them in clear varnish. It may be that I made the wrong choice... but comparing mine to the rather fuzzy pictures of "the original" in Steinmeyer's book, I can assure you mine looks considerably smaller!
Thomas Wayne
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I didn't think my input was "scathing" at all. All I offered was honest criticism that I sincerely believe to be spot on.

As for the "details" in the Steinmeyer book, let's not mistake the facts; Steinmeyer's illustrations are often minimalist and, as such, usually leave out finish details. The sketches in the book were obviously meant to convey dimensions and proportions - nothing more. The photos of Wakeling's original prop are more than adequate to convey the proper construction technique.

I agree, however, that the photos in the Wakeling book are "fuzzy", but the photos from the Wellington site are not. If you truly feel that your monolithic black boxes look smaller than Wellington's rendition, then I guess we are at an impasse; I leave it to others to decide whether you are right or simply a victim of cognitive dissonance.

But on one other note, what makes you think that boxes built with frame and panel construction must necessarily be larger than what you built? Remember that only the OUTSIDE of the boxes benefit from the F&P look, and if that should add an additional 1/4 inch to the overall size it would be very much worth if for the camouflage effect it achieves, in my opinion.

TW
MOST magicians: "Here's a quarter, it's gone, you're an idiot, it's back, you're a jerk, show's over." Jerry Seinfeld
makeupguy
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Why pick on someone who is so obviously trying his best to make sure that people put the best prop possible on stage for their performance. It will only make them.. and the profession as a whole .. look better.

I know that Thomas has had some problems on other boards..but his comment here are not out of line

If everyone took the time, even as home builders, to do their research, and use every design trick possible to them at their skill level.. there would be more deceptive illusions out there.. and far fewer illusions that look like SNAP illusions
IDOTRIX
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It's about his attitude. the illusion doesn"t make the performer, the performer makes the illusion.
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