Apparently I was put into a catagory of being uncoachable, majoring in minor things, and lacked action in my business....and I paid 297.00 to be told this....Who else was told this? I wont mention, but its not hard to figure out what or who I am talking about!

p.s. I spent 27$ to join the mastermind group put on by Eric Paul, and downloaded his Zero to Sixty series...I got more out of this 27$ investment then I ever did investing $300.00 on this so called coaching program!

Thanks
Charles

Just to ad to this....I know I am a nobody magician, and most will just write me off as an underachiever but consider this...

I didn't' lack motivation, action etc....what I truely lacked was the appropriate funds $$$ to make it happen...because of this it was impossible to coach me...well at 297/month...that is a large investment in my career, and I never seen anything beneficial come from it

Think about it....I lacked the CAPITOL to invest b/c I was paying a coach....b/c I didn't have capitol to invest in this coaches products, his friend products or even projects from unrelated sources...I was coachable

What I lacked was thousands of dollars to invest into this coaches products further...Can Anyone Say MAGIC FOR SALE? I mean seriously when I went into this coaching program I went out on a limb "fiance was very upset with me" to pay for the coaching....with hopes that working with this former disney star would really sky rocket my career....WHAT A SUCKER I WAS! MAN stay away from stuff that promises big things.

here is my advice take it from someone who learned the hard way

Save that hard earned cash...invest in readable materials(its cheaper) read it and learn and apply....invest in your marketing and more importantly invest your time into pleasing your clients

Oh by the way!

You could be driving a labmo by tomorrow evening...imagine your friends eyes when they see you pull up to their driveway, the jelous look on your neighbors faces....All you have to do is text lambo to 999-999-9999 and your lambo waiting outside your garage door tomorrow! But you have to act now b/c I am only taking the first 5 text messages, and then you will have to pay full price for the car!

Guaranteed "guarnateed to break your wallet"lol

Questions for you to ask yourself.

So, what's your action plan? What are you doing to get more business? (Some / most of it can be no cost / little cost, and then you can work your way up to marketing & promotion that costs more. But it doesn't have to cost money to take action.)

What are your goals?

How are you going to get there?

Why do you want to achieve your goals?

Every person is at a certain level, and can do better. Most often we have the resources in hand, but aren't using them. We are choosing not to live up to our potential.

Yes, sometimes people need to learn more before they can take the next step. But often they have the knowledge but aren't using it. They are using "the need to learn" as their excuse for not taking action.

(BTW, there's lots more to learn free from forums, websites, the library, etc.)

- Donald

P.S. An easy action step that most anyone can do... call 10-20 new prospects each day. Then mail to them. Discipline yourself not to go on forums or play on the internet (watching YouTube, Facebook, etc.) until after you've accomplished your daily goals.

I AM sorry for your rotten experience… that sucks! I have had some bad coaches too and feels like a big-fat rip-off! (Cuz it kinda’ IS!) BUT I have also had way more killer mentors and coaches for sure that far outweigh the crappy ones! – Whoo Hoo! (Though that will NOT make you feel better or get you your money back! – Sorry!)

Truth is; there is good and bad in every arena… it’s too bad we sometimes have to figure it out the crappy by accident!

I also agree that there ARE ‘some’ good readable tools out there as well, but there are some lousy ones as well… how do we know? (With-out getting stung?) So “For free OR for Fee”, it’s true that there are really good and really crappy books all over the place! Heck, even the library as well! We gotta choose wisely!

Here is ONE simple tip I have used over the years:
Now, I usually almost exclusively invest (Time, Talent, Treasure… etc) based on a personal referral from someone I “Personally” TRUST! Even if it is a free library book! – My TIME is important as well!

Q: Is it ‘perfect’?
A: Not always, but more than if I just take what the advertiser says!

Q: Do I miss out on some good stuff too?
A: I imagine I do… but I do only have so much of my ‘resources’ (Time, Talent & Treasure) to invest (or possibly waist) with any given possible solution so HELP and guidance is so important to me!

I realize it’s not easy, but if we go with the proven results of those people we each TRUST and they say it’s was tested and good for them… THAT is a good place to “start”. THEN I do all my own due diligence to see if it is a right solution for me…

It is not the ONLY way I invested over the years, but it is the best and most reliable that I have experienced if you can take advantage of the mistakes and experience myself and others have made over the years growing our own respective business and success outcomes.

Hope that helps a small bit at least… and again, I am sorry you had a bad experience. I know what that feels like… not lately, but those are the things we never forget somehow. Sad.

Food for thought.

Best of luck to you and all of your success endeavors!

I am at your service and in HIS Service,
Deano in Reno
<><

Thanks for the encouragement guys, and It has been made right with me! I am going on 24, and hate to look at at 50 and say "man why didn't I pursue magic as a full time occupation"

It really is disappointing to hear that you cant succeed without a reasonable amount of investment involved. Time I have a lot of, and will put it to better use!

When its all said and done I will look back and be proud of what I have accomplished....and this will be remembered as a roadblock that I was able to hurdle over!
Thanks Again

So what have I learned here?

Roadblocks...just something to hurdle over and look back on.. use it as fuel for future success

So here I am at 50... wishing I had pursued magic as a full time occupation. God Bless my parents, but they were vocal about a conventional job and I tried to be a good son. Instead, I spent five years in radio, and 25 years in video production with magic as a hobby. Now I'm looking at magic as my second (retirement) career.



Generally, the energy you put into a project will be returned in the quantity or quality of the final product. Your most available resource right now is time. Invest time in building your business.

Life is a constant learning process. Learning where to go for information is part of life. Donald and Dean both make very good points. As a member of Eric Paul's group, you have a support system and a tremendous source of great marketing info.

Best of Luck.

Dave

I also had drastically different experiences with coaching.

I first started with an organization named after one of the top motivational gurus of today (how could you go wrong!). I wasted months waiting for this coaching to help me but...I just wasn't taking action to the degree that I had imagined. I didn't understand and it seemed like we were just chatting and talking without really making progress.

Then I tried coaching with......the person you are alluding to. It was the free coaching call. I couldn't believe the results I achieved after the first 30 minute call. He really did help take me into a new level of success with record breaking months starting right away.

I dropped out of the other coaching program to go with him. The hidden penalties of getting out of that other contract were enormous and the mis-communication was horrible which resulted in months of complications. Boy, did I feel ripped off! I think I ended up spending something like $1500 for very little benefit. Luckily, my new coach had no such yearly contracts AND provided the benefits to back up my investment.

It is important to note that, while I am featured on the top of his site as a video testimonial, I am in no way paid or connected with him as personal friend or otherwise other than being an appreciative client. My comments are sincere.

It should also be mentioned that I am no longer a coaching client. I gained such knowledge and have achieved such a momentum (as a result of this process), that I no longer needed the services. I spend about a year in the program and stopped this past April or May (can't recall right now). My 2009 "big" goals - financial and otherwise - are already met and I am now setting my sights on planning and marketing for 2010. Things are going very well and I am glad I went through the process. But, hey, that's just me.

Don't give up on coaching. There are many individuals and organizations out there (magic and otherwise - it doesn't have to be a magician helping you) and feel free to search them out. Just like any relationship, you need to find the right fit for you.

I also disagree that you have to spend a lot of money to start your career. My first year full time in this business was spent being very careful with my money (wife and kids to support). I've steadily invested in my materials etc as time has gone by. I certainly wouldn't have been able to afford coaching my first year of full-time performing.

First of all, I don’t see any problem with you mentioning the person’s/company’s name you had a problem with. Both Charles and Scott attest to hidden fees or an unsatisfactory experience. How many beginning magicians are reading this thread and will read it in the future. You are not saying don’t do business with them, you are saying be careful.

In society today we equate large investment with success and place little value on things that are free. I would suggest spending a night or two reading the Tricky Business section right here at the Magic Café. This might be all you need to really put your career in high gear. At the very least you will come out of it with an excellent “to-do” list. You can use a priority system to narrow it down to the most important tasks and the ones only cost a very small amount. (Charles’s .27 cent Eric Paul investment is a GREAT example of this).

As far as being uncoachable, Ha! Most of us are when we are young. I thought I knew it all when I was young. What a bitter sweet moment it is when you find out you need others to help.

Re coaching:
Do watch Penn and Teller's !@#$%^&* on the subject of Life Coaching (season 3 IIRC). See if you still want coaching after watching that.

At first I wasnt going to say anything but then I thought... why not..

I've been burned as well MANY TIMES

had one group sell me something for THOUSANDS just to find out it was the sales pitch to the real products.. GRRR (CHARGEBACK)

but don't let this deter you from growing..
for things out there I have had WONDERFUL success

even have had a life coach with TONS of success
the life coaching was stuff I already knew but was not implementing
the coaching process helped me implement and move forward on knowledge I already had..

my life coach has even just put out a ebook that she is giving away for free to signup for her news letter

http://begintoshift.com/landpage/LifeOnPurpose.htm

(hehe so proud, she listened during the boot camp, she is one of my students as well)

her course on "Becoming the CEO of your own Life" is what I took and loved it..

----
On a different note..
google now has a (SHOW OPTIONS) link on search results pages..
one of the new filters is (REVIEWS)

great feature to see if something is worth buying

Ken,
Scott had a GOOD experience with this individual. He had a BAD experience with some "National Guru"....lol.

Thanks for the correction, I think I read through Scott's post too quickly. I apologize for that. I still think my point about we only seem to value what we pay for and not what is for free is a valid one.

YES, he LIKED the Eric Paul Experience for only $27. bucks and got frustrated with the other coaching guy at nearly $300.00... TWO different experiences as I read it anyway.

PS
I was referring to Charles ORIGINAL post. Sorry if that was confusing.

Brad Ross's program costs $297 a month.....

I've noticed that Brad now asks for his coaching students to purchase his "It Factor!" course before taking coaching.

I can understand why that might be a good foundation. Then you are talking on the same page.

Charles, did you explain your feelings to Brad, and ask if perhaps he could put your coaching fee (part or all) towards your purchase of his course?

- Donald

P.S. I don't own the "It Factor", and I've done a free trial call with Brad. The call was helpful to me at the time. I've also had help from many others over the years: Dean Hankey, Eric Paul, John Cooper, etc.

P.P.S. A neat e-newsletter that I like to get each week is by Philip Humbert. He's not a magician, but is a life coach. http://www.philiphumbert.com/ It's free, and he also has some free ebooks on his website.

I coach, I’ve coached actors and magicians for twenty-five years,
and many of my mentees have done well in the art as well as the business.
I don’t coach over the phone or over the internet, only face to face.

I’m tough, really tough, but I’d NEVER say anyone is un-coachable or past hope.

If I had a studio, in the hall, floor to ceiling, in huge letters I’d write:
“Preparation” on one wall of the hall
and “Discipline” on the other side of the wall.

These are to me the foundations that support “art”, “talent”, “skill”, and “business savvy”.

If you are a good performer, and an ORIGINAL performer,
if you are entertaining, if you know who you are, and why you perform,
and have a track-record of preparing your art and being disciplined in your craft and business, then you can in time make a good living as an entertainer.

There will be ups and downs, a lot of them.
So it comes down to how MUCH do you want it.

There are fine teachers, coaches, and courses out there,
but make CERTAIN they put their experience where your money is,
and that you’re READY for the journey,
before you pull out your Visa Card.

My thoughts,
Walt

Brilliant brother Walt!

Dead ON!

Thank you!
Deano in Reno
<><

Thanks guys for all of your positive insight! I have learned a lot from this experience, and will continue to learn through life experiences....its the best way to learn!

Brad has worked out a proposition with me, and has offered a handshake via the internet with no hard feelings....what a great guy!