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rcad Loyal user St-Eustache 211 Posts |
Hello everyone,
Although this is my first post here and that I practice magic only as a hobby and that I have just recently come back to it, I thought my reply "may" interest some of you. My professionnal experience lies primarly in writing (but in my mother tongue, French to be exact, not English) and I have published numerous articles and short stories. So creating a theme for a show is really up my alley... I won't go into stage, table-hopping or street magic since in my opinion, they have serious limitations as far as storytelling goes. For this, one mostly has to create a persona. But if on the other hand you perform magic for small groups, where you can all have them sitting and where they can even hear you whisper, you are all setup. Think of it as a story you are going to tell around a campfire. It doesn't have to be scary though but when magic happens, it should move the story forward. We could compare this task to moviemaking. Magic is to the show what are the special effects to the script. There are movies with great special effects and no story. If the special effects are REALLY good, even with a badly written script, you may still attract a crowd big enough to justify a sequel (as "Tomb raider" did for example). But "Tomb raider" will be forgotten in only a couple of years. Compare this to "Blade runner" for example which has a powerful script and that I still consider as one of the best SF movies ever, even if the special effects look outdated by now. If your magical special effects for the show are wonderfully executed, the audience will be pleased. If you come out as being an interesting character yourself, you'll be remembered. But if on top of that you manage to convey a story that will involve and move your audience, that "magical night" will never be forgotten... How can it be accomplished? It is because it is so simple that it is so difficult: you have to reverse your thinking! Again, think about how they create good movies. A good director (or producer) will try to find the best script and only once the story has been completely revised and rewritten several times will the special effects people come in and figure out how they will create such and such a scene. The effects must "serve" the story, not the opposite and yet, it is so easy to fall into that trap when magic is concerned. We always have a tendency to ask ourselves "What patter could I use for this trick? How could I link it in the show?" When we should be asking ourselves: "What story do I want to tell?" And only after that should we ask ourselves "What tricks should I perform then?" I could still expand on this but maybe what I'm saying has all been said before and I am boring you all to death . But if this post only helps one fellow magician out there, I'll be happy! Richard
"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious." Albert Einstein
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Richard:
Nicely said and a great post. We magicians try to take the easy road too much of the time. People do not want to be creative. Why? Because it takes too much effort. That is really sad but is often the truth.
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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DJ Trix Inner circle 1197 Posts |
Well I have tried to give justification for everything, but it doesn't always happen. Any more tips on getting a theme going?
I also like what you gave us, Richard. thanks |
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RandyStewart Inner circle Texas (USA) 1989 Posts |
I have a copy of Cardini's 1930 performance (cards, cigs, and "borrowing" of past out fellow's pipe upon exiting stage). Some of you know which I speak of. It's my ALL TIME FAVORITE!
I've had several people watch the act and an hour later asked them to describe what they saw. Bare with the language but here's the most common response: "Some guy who made cards appear and smoked a lot!" Trust me, being a card manipulator, I cringe at the description myself! I also asked what the condition or appearance of the performer was. Not one person has described him as a "elegantly dressed and tipsy Englishman who marvels over the unexpected appearance of cards, billiard balls, or cigs. They just marvelled over the strange production of those cards. I often wonder if a no theme act, with similar talent, would be remembered the same way. Perhaps a theme act with little magic or skill is even worse! Nothing worse than excessive stage fluff. Again, Cardini's performance is one of my favorites but I'm burnt out on much of today's thematic performances void of skill or talent. Now regarding justification of effects, I doubt most audience members fret over what they've just witnessed. Do we question ANY moment of a Cirque du Soleil performance? Despite their thematic performances, they provide 1001 reasons to ask "why?" I'm sure some of you scream "artform!" I can't give you a single reason for bending in a way that lands your toes on your forehead but I'll pay to see it. Go to the movies and watch an audience witness say "Matrix". No paying customer mumbles "Oh I'm so sure he could do that....but most importantly why?!". I doubt they patiently wait for the justification. Instead they just sit, question nothing, and take it all in. If anything they find ways to justify what's just assaulted their senses. They continue viewing expecting more of the same and better! Yes very strange....or is it? Pasha has a great Black Art performance that could beg the question "why!?". With the appearance and vanishing of people on stage and the beheading of his son while seated in a chair, no one in the audience dares think "why and to what end?". IT'S THAT GOOD! I think that's what makes the difference. There's not a single good reason for him to do any of what transpires on stage despite great costuming and music. Excluding opponents, if what we just witnessed is alien to our understanding of the world, it will be honored, tolerated, and maybe given a standing ovation in a stage setting. Go to a art gallery showing and see my point. Don't forget to spend a minute with the artist to see what I mean. Just don't ask why. |
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Tor Egil Elite user Norway 495 Posts |
Take Lance Burton for example. He has taken up this form of a guy producing all these objects. You kind of wonder why he does it. If you can do it that well, it's worth it.
Blog on baby
http://crazymanic.blogspot.com/ |
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Yes, but even Lance has a well defined character and he even has a theme going for his act. He gives reason for doing what it is he is doing.
When you look at his act you can see a debonaire-type character on the streets of Paris. He is all things stylish and suave. This carries over to the way he dresses and the way he acts on stage and even in the flow and moves he makes. It gives reason for the lamp post and the creation and production of candles. The idea is to try and theme your act and develop a character on stage for the manipulation act you are going to do. This does not always have to be done, but I do feel strongly that a well defined theme and character makes for a much more entertaining experience for your audience. It becomes much more then a "see what I can do" type of an experience and brings it in a magical play.
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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zombieboy Special user Connecticut, USA 889 Posts |
There is a difference between a theme and justification. Justification is giving your magic a reason, i.e. Salvano's act. He wants a drink, so he produces one. A theme is like Lances act, or Topas. Lance's theme is a dark street in paris. Topas' theme is an eighties rock 'n' roll routine, and sunglasses become the running theme. There is no reason for them being there, but they keep with the theme.
I like a theme over justification. I'm all for giving your magic meaning, but having it serve you a purpose is just thinking to much into it. |
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Very nicely said Zombie. Thank you for posting that. Also thanks for some really great posts from others. This has been very insightful.
I guess my point is that too many magicians simply go out on stage with the wrong idea. Their ONLY reason for being out there is to simply show the audience all the great skill they can do and you can't. Not that skill or a show of skill is a wrong thing, BUT I feel an audience deserves more then just pure skill. Why not give them skill, but give them skill mixed with a good storyline or skill mixed with great music and choreography. Make it something more than what you see too much of today. Instead of an audience member only remembering some guy doing some way cool moves, I would much rather the viewer describe the act in terms of how it made them feel or describe the act as they would after seeing a great movie.
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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maylor Loyal user england 231 Posts |
Lots of talks about themes and justifications. I just always try to remember one thing:
An act must be entertaining. If it's not entertaining, what's the point? And don't just think that because it contains magic, it will be entertaining. You need to make it so! If the audience is entertained, that's enough for them. They won't start asking deep, meaningful questions about your justification. Indeed, you could have all the justifications in the world for your act, but it still might not be entertaining! |
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Maylor brings up a very good point. The bottom line really is entertainment value. Do you leave your audience smiling and laughing and feeling good. That really should be the only level of success a magician or entertainer really needs to evaluate the act that they are performing.
A perfect example of this is a gentlemen who I saw perform at Cirque de Soleil. He was not really a clown and not really a magician. He did some of the best pantomine I have ever seen. With the simplest of props and the help of audience members, he did the funniest and most magical act I have ever seen. The point I am trying to make is this guy had the audience rolling with laughter and smiling really big. But, he did it with the least bit of props and did not say a word the entire time. His "entertainment value" was out of the roof. I think the reason being was that the audience just learned to sit back and enjoy what was being presented. They were not being shown a feat of skill or being forced to watch some guy with a "look what I can do" attitude. I think something could be learned from that.
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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rcad Loyal user St-Eustache 211 Posts |
I do agree with you both, but I think that the difference between "method" and "results" and our role as entertainers are being confused here. Whatever you do as a performer, you are in control.
Kyle, that clown controled the audience. You said it yourself, they sat back and enjoyed. As a performer being in control of yourself comes first, then controling your performance and finally, controlling the audience. Maylor, I know it "may" look like the audience is passive and pretty much receptive to anything you say or do but that's probably because you are doing a very good job at following a theme during your act. I have a communication degree and I am a writer by profession. I have studied the way communications of all kinds and especially stories, work. Sure, most people in the audience won't bother themselves to understand how we do what we do as performers and creators. They won't analyze the show. But they will react, either positively or negatively. Compare this to cooking. You serve a dish to your customers. Most of them won't be able to name all the ingredients that went into their dish and much less be able to describe how you arrived at that result. But they will either like it or not. We are cooks too! Aren't we always trying to cook up something (pun intended) that will really amaze them? We create elaborate menus when we prepare a show, write a story, make movies, etc... Our audience may not need to know what are the best ingredients and how to cook them, but "we" do! We are the cooks! That is why we must completly understand what we are working with, either consciously or unconsciously. Magic is based on the unexpected emanating from the expected. The audience doesn't expect us to switch decks of cards. They do not look for threads before anything moves "unnaturally". They don't expect the guy on stage to carry doves under his jacket... To process information about everything that happens around us, the brain stores billions of images, sounds, facts, expectations (everything falls down for example), etc. That information won't be questionned unless something that contradicts it happens. Much in the same manner, we are also conditionned to expect certain "rules" and "structures" when we come in contact with any kind of communications. Even a good lecturer should have a structure, even one as simple as an introduction, a development and a conclusion. Any show should follow the same basic structure. Aren't plays often based on three acts? That's why a magic show should have a structure and having a theme helps us to put it all together. If you go completly against the audience's expectations, they won't be entertained, that is a fact. We all know instinctively how communications work, but analysing what we do as communicators removes some of the guess work. That at least, is how I work when it comes to magic as much as when it comes to writing because I think that theory has its "raison d'être" in any artform. Whoa! Sorry for that long post! I should cut down on the theory if I ever want to get to 50 posts before next year, haha! Richard
"The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious." Albert Einstein
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Richard:
WOW! that was one really long paragraph. hehe Very nice stuff here and great information. Thanks for posting it. You are right. The magician should always be in control of the act and show and overall performance. I think you are right on the 3 levels of control. You must have control of yourself first, then control your performance and I think through the first 2 comes a control of the audience. I think control of the audience happens a lot easier if the first 2 are set into place. I think your anaolgy of cooking is a good one. I think an audience will not analyze a good meal and is prepared right and tatste wonderful However, I think they will analyze more a meal that is not prepared right and just taste wrong or out of place. I think the same thing goes for a show or act.
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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fatkochi New user HongKong 2 Posts |
Today I went to a convention in Japan...
there was a Taiwanese magician who had a very cool idea about card production... during his act, he received a phone call from a girl...but he cannot remember who the girl is, so he just produced the girls`s photos instead of cards... it is a very nice idea .. to me
making magic making friends
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Clever idea and shows how cards can be changed into something else to add a bit more interest to an act.
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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maylor Loyal user england 231 Posts |
I know I keep banging home this point, and we can try to analyse this topic until the cows come home. But I truly do believe one rule overides all others:
ENTERTAIN an audience and they will be happy. They wont need to think any deeper about your act/purpose. Give them what they want/need, ENTERTAINMENT. Rcad, good points. You're right, my act is highly themed, and it does keep the audience hooked. However, all acts should have a unique theme. This is what gives ou you're IDENTITY. And if you haven't got a performing identity, then it's unlikely you're act will ever be entertaining. Perhaps we should spend less time thinking about the theory behind it all and work more on the practical side of being different and entertaining!! It's a simple point but I'm sure its the key. I've see too many boring acts who may have all the reason in the world for doing what they're doing, and they may be control, but they haven't delivered a drop of entertainment. I really don't want to be one of those! All the best!! |
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Yes, entertainment is the key and one of the ways to get entertainment value is through a themed type of act. Is this the only way, certainly not but the key should be on your presentation to your audience. What are you giving them. Hopefully it is more then just pure skill alone.
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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zombieboy Special user Connecticut, USA 889 Posts |
My manipulation act is done with mirrors. What I did was coated blank cards with mylar, and then they look like mirrors, but can be backpalmed. The whole act is based on "Is it all done with mirrors?"
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Zombie:
That is an interesting idea and theme. I wish you much luck with it. It could lead to a lot of possible creative ideas. Imagine walking on stage with a hand held mirror. You're looking suave and cool and you produce a comb magically to comb your hair. You look into the mirror and it cracks (gets a chuckle from audience). You take one of the pieces and do magic with it. Just an idea.
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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zombieboy Special user Connecticut, USA 889 Posts |
That is a great idea! HOW DO YOU DO THAT? You come up with excellent ideas, and it seems effortless. I hate and admire you at the same time...
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magic4u02 Eternal Order Philadelphia, PA 15110 Posts |
Don't hate me; just take my ideas and run with them. Make them your own and have fun with it. =)Ideas are effortless for me. They have always been that way. I just let and allow ideas to pop into my head. Not sure how it all works. lol
I appreciate the kind words. I guess being an artist, I have a different way I think about my magic. I have trained myself to not see the magic first in an act. I always see the bigger picture, which is the presentation, theme or story being told. I try to relate what the magician needs back to a central theme that makes sense to the audience. This then allows for the magic to be much more powerful and enjoyable for the audience to watch. If you want to use that idea, go for it and enjoy it. Stem off of that and you could really do a cool act. For example you could even come out and pick up the mirror, but before you do you wait, hesitate and go oh no not yet... magically produce sun glasses and put them on first, then lok at mirror and have mirror shatter etc. This will add a bit more comedy to the storyline. Just a thought. The sunglasses can then be used further into the act. Take the ideas and enjoy.
Kyle Peron
http://www.kylekellymagic.com Entertainers Product Site http://kpmagicproducts.com Join Our Facebook Fan Page at http://facebook.com/perondesign |
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