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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Finger/stage manipulation » » Back palming help (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

cardphreak
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orange county CA
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I'm currently creating a card manipulation routine. I've got a lot more work to go. I need some help. I can back palm and produce up to 8 cards. But, I can't seem to do more. Are there any exercises or tips that can help me learn to produce more than 8?
Michael J. Douglas
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WV, USA
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Practicing will build strength. I also used to put about 1/3 to 1/2 of a deck into backpalm position and squeeze my index and pinky together.
You can also check out manipulation cards (not fanning decks). There are several out there, but I have Norm Nielsen's. You can find them here.
Michael J.
�Believe then, if you please, that I can do strange things.� --from Shakespeare�s �As You Like It�
Anatole
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What type of cards do you use and how do you prepare them? Lewis Ganson in his book _Card Magic by Manipulation_ gives three methods for preparing the cards to make them thinner and/or more pliable for manipulation from the back palm. However, there are cards available from magic dealers that are much thinner than the cards you buy in "ordinary" stores, and the fact that many of the finest card manipulators in the world use them speaks highly of them.

For many years, I preferred stripping the backs off cards to make them thinner, as explained in the Ganson book. I haven't done that in years because of the "convenience" of buying the "professionally made" decks like the Nielsen and Murphy manipulation cards. But in some ways I think the stripped cards are better. They need to be treated with fanning powder of course, but they were a joy to work with.

Many years ago there was a set of paper-thin cards that were marketed along with a book explaining how to use them and routine an act. I don't have my copy handy to cite it, but maybe someone else on the Café will remember what I'm talking about.

----- Amado "Sonny" Narvaez
----- Sonny Narvaez
Bill Hegbli
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Eternal Order
Fort Wayne, Indiana
23046 Posts

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Another advantage to the manipulation cards sold on the market is that there is no prepairation to use them, other then a little fanning powder and wiping off if they land on the floor.

When normal cards are split, two cards are split and the thinest parts of each is glued back together. Neil Lester use to do this, http://www.cardsbymartin.com/store/ His family may continue his business.
Daveandrews
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London, UK
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Neil made me a pack of double-faced, digits in four corners, cards for continuous fan productions from one hand. He smilingly (I could hear it in his voice) told me that he was an elderly person and it would take him some weeks. I told him I could wait.
They were with me in less than a fortnight and work superbly - I will treasure them always.

C/phreak, as people have said, the manipulation cards are fantastic to handle, but even with those, the secret to back-palming (all card manips, even) is practice.
I wish you all the best in your endeavours.

Dave
http://[URL]www.partymagic.org.uk" target="_blank">www.partymagic.org.uk" target="_blank">http://[URL]www.partymagic.org.uk

Winner of KIDabra International's 'People's Choice Award'
Winner IBM British Ring Dittia Shield for manipulation
Levent
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Hi Anatole:

I think I know what you are referring to. It was called "Manipulative Production and Card Routining, Exclusive Card Productions" by Justin Branch and was released in 1977. I think Mr. Branch called the cards "fan units".

Best regards,
Levent
http://www.LeventMagic.com
markis
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James Tong gave me the tip to roll each card individually around a pencil in all directions. Bee cards that is. This makes them very supple. I like this better than the ruler scrape. However it does leave lines on the cards that aren't visible from a few feet away and they don't last as long. Mine starting getting small tears eventually.
cardphreak
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orange county CA
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Thanks for all the help. I think I'm going to get some manipulation cards.
DJ Trix
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I would like to suggest consistency with your practice. With card manipulation the body must be familiarized with constant practice so as to keep the kinetic memory fluid and progressive. When I first started working with card productions and manipulations, I would practice inconsistently, and I came to terms with the fact that during each session, I would only reventure the tracks I had previously traveled, always coming back to the same space. There was no progress.

You need not act in monotony. What I mean is, you don't need to practice bp singles for multiple hours, rather, daily practice over extended periods of time will render heightened results. It takes time.

I have found that a plethora of perpetual practice of the same moves creates unnatural habits. The mind becomes bored, and when you familiarize yourself with this state of action, and allow it to solidify, your presentations will be rather stagnant feeling, rather then crisp and majestic. Practice when you are alert, and break when you need to revivify your attention.

Allow yourself to work from a clean state. And there is always more available for you. If you move within the lines others have set fourth, your magic will feel robotic. It isn't just about creating new moves, necessarily. It is about unifying with what is occurring within your hands, and becoming what you dream. Open yourself to that which has never been, and in doing so you might just locate magic. By magic I mean anything extending unhindered from nihility, untainted by intellectual pursuits. Right from the source.
Anatole
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Levent,
Yes, the product I'm thinking of was the Justin Branch set of "fan units." As I recall, the advertisement had some endorsements by well-known manipulators to the effect that "I wish this had been around when I started out." Yeah, right.

I'm reminded, too, of the time that Jack Chanin lectured and peddled a deck of manipulation cards. He took a sample card and showed that it was so thin and pliable that he could wrap it around a pencil. I bought a deck, and when I opened it, found one and only one card prepared like that. The rest of the cards were totally unprepared. As Hugard and Braue might say, "There is no royal road to backpalming."

Then there was the weird contraption in the Howard Thurston book on Card Tricks... a card with two clips on a track to facilitate the back and front palm transfer. I also remember a flesh colored card catcher similar to the cigarette catcher but with clips to hold a stock of cards.

----- Amado "Sonny" Narvaez
----- Sonny Narvaez
DJ Trix
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Anatole and Levent,

Im interested in the booklet you describe. Were the moves and manipulations unique in relation to other methods available?
Anatole
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As I recall, the moves in the Justin Branch book were not terribly different from the moves in Ganson's _Card Magic by Manipulation_. The main advantage was the predominantly , nearly paper-thin cards which allowed for holding more cards in the backpalm, permitting more fans to be produced from a single stock.

Both Ganson and Branch subscribed to the theory that the original "classic" method for producing card fans was flawed because the first fan might be composed of, say, 20 cards; the second fan composed of 15 cards; the third composed of 10 cards... which meant that an astute observer would notice the discrepancy and possibly intuit the method. Personally, I think only a magician--and even then only a card manipulator--would notice the difference.

The discrepancy may indeed be noticeable if one uses one stock of 20 cards to produce four fans. But if you restrict the production to 2 (or maybe 3 at the most) fans, then the discrepancy is negligible. Another work around would be to produce one fan, discard it, produce a few cards singly, and then produce the remainder in a fan.

It is interesting to note in the Cardini video clip on Youtube that the maestro produces three fans from one stock of cards. Any discrepancy between the first fan and any of the rest from a single stock is minimal. I have mentioned before in this forum that the discrepancy in the number of cards in the fan seems to be a contention with magicians more than with audiences. A way around the discrepancy would be to produce a single fan, split it, produce 5-6 cards singly, and then produce the remaining cards in a final fan that is tossed away.

----- Amado "Sonny" Narvaez
----- Sonny Narvaez
Bill Hegbli
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Eternal Order
Fort Wayne, Indiana
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As there is another theory on the production of fans of cards, that over comes this discrepancy mentioned above. All fans are the same size and approximately the same size.

Ed Marlo also wrote a good booklet on card Fan Productions, available from Magic Inc., Chicago,Illinois
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