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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
You know that is not what I am saying, but ok whatever. If you think it is ok to try to duplicate another professional magicians act, and want him to respond in a polite manner then go for it.
Using your theory the guy asked "Can I know how you did that part of your act? I would like to put it into my act without putting in any sort of work creating it myself." Take the same tact you just did with my words, and use them on the OP and tell me what you end up with Skip. I think it would be a facinating exersise.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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silverking Inner circle 4574 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-01-08 14:25, Skip Way wrote: The guy didn't ask to buy a DVD or a book, he asked if he could buy lecture notes which contained the methods used in the show he'd just seen the guy do on video. |
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noble1 Special user 651 Posts |
Ruaturtle should clarify specifically what was said in the "rude" email he found offensive.
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Skip Way Inner circle 3771 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-01-08 14:52, silverking wrote: Quote:
I simply asked if any of those "secrets" might be available among the NOTES and VIDEOS HE HAS FOR SALE. I'm moving on, now. Ciao!
How you leave others feeling after an Experience with you becomes your Trademark.
Magic Youth Raleigh - RaleighMagicClub.org |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
I also would like to see exactly what he asked, and what the response was. Would be fun to see what the "rudeness" was and how it was prompted.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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Mr. Mystoffelees Inner circle I haven't changed anyone's opinion in 3623 Posts |
I'm with Danny. Let's have the EXACT exchange so we can understand what took place... don't know so much about "fun"...
Also known, when doing rope magic, as "Cordini"
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Xpilot Elite user Florida 464 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-01-08 14:52, silverking wrote: Clearly he should have just hit the internet and tracked down the secrets for free. Why offer to pay for lecture notes when you can find almost anything in places like this? Actually I agree with those who have withheld judgement since no one knows exactly what what said by who. |
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phaddad2 Regular user 171 Posts |
I am not judging but, if you meet someone that has produced DVD's for sale can you not ask them if their current material is on it? It may not have been the proper time or place to ask but I don't think the question is all that wrong.
Pete |
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gaddy Inner circle Agent of Chaos 3526 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-01-07 19:31, DerZauberer wrote: Wow... Glad that happened to you, and not me -as I'd hate to be barred from the Castle for making a scene. What a jerk. Quote:
" Really?" Scenarios like this bring out a side of me that I'm none too proud of...
*due to the editorial policies here, words on this site attributed to me cannot necessarily be held to be my own.*
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ruaturtle Regular user Gastonia, NC 113 Posts |
Ok... Just got back on and saw everything. As again... I will not say who but I quoted my question. Sorry but I am not going to quote word for word his response. That is not what my question was about and I would NEVER embarrass a performer even if they really deserved it. I went looking through his "for sale" section and saw nothing that suggested that the knowledge I was seeking was within. Seeing that he has plenty of stuff for sale, I asked if parts of this specific performance are available somewhere. I would not copy his performance... but upon watching it, my mind automatically went to how I could use the same thing in a different way. Tons of people use the same "secret" to make someone disappear, for example, but present it in such a different way. There is NO WAY that what I asked could be construed as asking for knowledge for free. I was willing to pay if it is available but I am not going to guess that somewhere within his $1000's of dollars of "sale stuff" that what I was looking for was within. I like what was said before "sorry too new but thanks for asking" I am far from a big time professional performer. I have been on TV as a clown but not as a magician and have NO plans to ever perform in Vegas but just like making a little cash and wowing people.
Dannydoyle: My thoughts are if you offer some of your secrets for sale , then you have to be prepared for someone asking that something specific you do is available somewhere amongst the stuff you sale. Silverking: I hope the next time you go into Walmart to buy fishing line, you are spoken to in such a way that you don't deserve being able to buy instead of saying that sorry, its not available And as others have stated, I am southern. My definition of rude will be different from a New Yorker. But I believe in saying please and thank you and think it rude if you don't... But I will never buy anything from this performer now nor attend a show if he comes to town. There is nothing wrong with being nice even if you say no. But no one has the right to strike out at me and be condensending... Crap, I have a Masters Degree LOL. Peace all.
I have found that I do not suffer from insanity... instead I rather enjoy it! : )
Poodle... the other white meat. |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
I am from the south as well, and to me asking me how I do my act so you can duplicate it is rude as can be.
Perhaps if you spent a lot of time creating an original act, it would be a bit more obvious to you why this is sort of out of line. The Wal-Mart example is just crazy. He was DOING A SHOW, not selling things. Is it that you can't see the difference or don't want too? Had you approached him after a lecture and said the same thing, he should be prepared to answer in a polite and curtous manner. Since you had seen him at a show, this is a different matter completly. Sorry this is not the way you think.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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ruaturtle Regular user Gastonia, NC 113 Posts |
So just so I understand (and I have no knowledge of you whatsoever Danny), if you are selling TONS of your secrets on dvds, notes, or however, I am totally wrong for asking if parts of a specific performance are available amongst your sale material? Man, if this is true, then I will never buy another magic secret again. And I thought I was taking the higher road for asking to buy rather than looking it up on youtube...
I have found that I do not suffer from insanity... instead I rather enjoy it! : )
Poodle... the other white meat. |
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Skip Way Inner circle 3771 Posts |
I'm not getting back into this mess...but, Rua needs to clarify a point that Silver and Danny seem to be missing - This wasn't a live performance. Rua's original statement was that he had just watched this performer's PERFORMANCE VIDEO. At least acknowledge the facts.
How you leave others feeling after an Experience with you becomes your Trademark.
Magic Youth Raleigh - RaleighMagicClub.org |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
Yea Skip A PERFORMANC VIDEO! It seems as if I have it right. It was designed as a PERFORMANCE PIECE not to be disected and sold.
A nodding aquaintance with the facts does seem in order. And YES I think it is wrong to try to duplicate parts of another magicians act for your own. Just because you do the "less wrong" thing does not make it the right thing now does it? "I thought I was taking the higher ground by only stealing $100 instead of $200" is an example of where that is wrong thinking. Not the same as you are not trying to steal anything I understand, but whether you look it up on You Tube is not relevant.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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Skip Way Inner circle 3771 Posts |
I give up, Danny. I usually agree with you...but ASKING ain't STEALING. I'm done. Ciao.
How you leave others feeling after an Experience with you becomes your Trademark.
Magic Youth Raleigh - RaleighMagicClub.org |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
I NEVER SAID IT WAS STEALING SKIP, but it does not make it RIGHT EITHER!
Why do magicians have some sort of sense of "entitlement" to other people's acts again? Where is it written that we are entitled to everything and when we ask a guy and he is offended we call them rude on an internet chat board? Magicians have an odd sense of entitlement and I have no idea why. PLUS my main point is until the time at which I see the exchange, I am not comfortable with "oh all I did was ask" and "he was rude". Let us see what was written EXACTLY because some of what I have seen people call "all I did was ask" and "rude" are not what I would say they are.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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silverking Inner circle 4574 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-01-10 00:05, Skip Way wrote: OK Skip, which part of my post, which contained the words "the show he'd just seen the guy do on video." is it that's giving you the difficulty? At least acknowledge the actual facts as they're stated rather than imply that I said something I didn't say in an effort to artificially strengthen your weak case. |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-01-08 14:52, silverking wrote: Here is what Silverking said. "which containst the methods used in the show he'd just seen the guy do on video." Skip, it seems as if the only one with a blind spot seems to be you. WE both knew it was a video performance, we both knew what we were saying, aparantly you do not understand the point. In which case with all due respect you should not tell US we do not have the facts straight, perhaps it is more your problem than ours? I do not think you should "give up" while you still don't seem to understand what is being said.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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ruaturtle Regular user Gastonia, NC 113 Posts |
So if I am to understand, no one should ever sell an instruction video and anyone that buys such is wrong??? wow.... Glad I have been enlightened, I'll save my money from now on. No more buying ANYTHING magical since I am "stealing" someone else's stuff even though it is freely offered up for sale. Sorry everyone that is selling, I now see the light... *snicker*
Posted: Jan 10, 2010 4:31pm Danny, A specific question to you and your answer will clarify... cool? I do not know you at all. I come across a performance video you made. There are certain parts that I love the "jolt factor" and even though I would never copy your performance, I would love to know how it is done because I LOVE MAGIC! AND I see some other possible uses that being able to do what I saw will be a COMPLETELY NEW VISUAL ACT. So I go to your website. You are selling TONS of YOUR secrets. I take the time to read through all the sniplets and I get the impression that the knowledge I seek is not anywhere within. I then write you and ask about this specific performance I saw of yours and ask if amongst the TONS of your PRODUCTS I might gather the instruction I want. Your answer? Like I would ever tell you... Yes, I consider that rude. Would I post your name here? No. Would I post your exact response here? No. Would I ever buy any of your products? No. Would I recommend you to any of my magician friends that might be thinking about buying from you? No. The part I do not get of your argument is this: You are selling, what is wrong with me asking? There are plenty of performers that I love what they do but they are not SELLING so I would never ask their secrets. But if you are willing to sell "oldies" then what is wrong with someone inquiring where the oldies end and the newbies begin?
I have found that I do not suffer from insanity... instead I rather enjoy it! : )
Poodle... the other white meat. |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-01-10 16:04, ruaturtle wrote: Please post for me where I or Silverking said this. Perhaps if you read your email with the same sort of twisted logic you have read our posts, this is where you are thinking it is rude. Posted: Jan 10, 2010 6:15pm IF you have gone through MY WEB SITE and have not been able to find the trick I did available, it is obviously not for sale right? Where is all the confussion coming from then? It is not for sale, you have just said it. SO now you ask how to do the trick or where you can learn to do the trick? Is he selling tricks from his current act, or from days gone by? See you give us only half bits of info and want us to make judgements. Not cool. If you are asking for things out of his act that he does right now and feeds his family with, well then it is a pretty clear line to me. It would seem pretty obvious to me if he wanted to sell the stuff on a PERFORMANCE video it would not be a performance video now would it? Magicians have a sense of entitlement to secrets and it amazes me constantly. Go ahead and spin things like you just did above. It shows me a lot about you.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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