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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » All in the cards » » Stupid card tricks (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

J.G. the magnificent
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I hate it when someone wants to do a trick and they lay out a bunch of piles in paterns of various sorts counting them and such. don't get me wrong self working card tricks are great at times but their are certain ones that are just too well known and old and tired. They just getting you thinking get on with it I get it you have a lot of cards that you are doing some math to find my card. Yet laymen love those self working tricks even though they are not only lengthy but easy. I recently did some things for a party and one of the kids wanted to work the deck and they did the old piles dity and everyone loved her as well. Why do people sometimes love stupid card tricks? Those people don't have any respect for fine tunned skill presentation or a nice deck.
Jeremy Gates
Phaedrus
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Unless someone is interested in card magic for its own sake (and I think that would make them magicians), I believe that what they love is being entertained. This issue has been discussed many times here, but the bottom line is that people will respond to an entertaining presentation, regardless of how difficult or easy the trick itself is. From your description, it sounds as if the audience got a kick out of seeing a little girl doing a card trick; I would imagine that the trick itself was irrelevant. If you are expecting people to be impressed by how difficult a trick is, you're missing an important point: people want to be entertained, and that can happen with a "stupid" self-working trick or the most finger-busting display of sleight of hand skill. The important aspect here is the performer; not all material works equally well with all personalities and performing styles. A little girl can get away with a mathematical procedure, because just seeing a kid do a trick is fun, while an adult will probably have to do something a little more demanding to get the same reaction. The bottom line is: if you focus on being entertaining, you will find that people will respect your "fine tuned" presentation much more than a display of skill and dexterity.
J.G. the magnificent
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That last part is baisically what really is annoying a self working trick that is done with little if any presentation. Yet they eat it up. Also you mentioned how people like being entertained more that they to someone clever. I know the impacts are bigger if you can do both. I used to be more of a entertainer though. Back when I just did anything to get a grip on the vastness of the art. I had no skill but people liked the entertainment of it all. Lately I have been focusing and getting better forgetting that. Even with that knowledge though knowing that people will occationally prefer self working tricks over difficult ones will still frustrate me.
Jeremy Gates
warren
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Depends some self working tricks are amazing but as someone else said presentation is everything,when you watch the likes of bill Malone or aldo colombini work the fact they find your card is just an added bonus.
Mr. Mystoffelees
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People are also courteous, especially with a child. They may have seen the trick many times before, but they will still try to enjoy seeing it again. Later they will remember and discuss that it wasn't new magic.

One advantage of skilled card magic is most people likely have not seen it before- a huge benefit to the magician. Relish that you are doing something few can do- there will always be someone doing the 21 card trick.

Of course, whenever possible avoid "being on the same bill" with a child (or animal)!

One other thing I have noticed is the number of "skilled" effects these days that forget the need to be quick, logical, easy to follow, etc. Some are so complicated they fail to entertain even though the skill needed to do them is at a high level. I look for a combo of skill and clarity.

Jim
Also known, when doing rope magic, as "Cordini"
Rennie
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As everyone seems to be stating in this post "People just want to be entertained"
I firmly believe that learning too many sleights with cards is really not necessary, since most of your audience are not aware you are doing any difficult moves to accomplish the effect.
I am a firm believer in the quote from Ted Annemann "The Effect is the Important Thing, How you Achieve it, IS NOT!"
The effect is the important thing, how you achieve it is not.......
Vlad_77
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Quote:
On 2010-05-01 11:59, Rennie wrote:
As everyone seems to be stating in this post "People just want to be entertained"
I firmly believe that learning too many sleights with cards is really not necessary, since most of your audience are not aware you are doing any difficult moves to accomplish the effect.
I am a firm believer in the quote from Ted Annemann "The Effect is the Important Thing, How you Achieve it, IS NOT!"


Rennie!

THANK YOU!! Seems I have been having to repeat this a LOT in the last few weeks here. While Stewart James and Nick Trost have of course use sleights, each used only what was necessary to accomplish maximization of effect. Yet, BOTH have created some of magic's most mind shattering miracles through subtlety rather than what James referred to as "muscle magic".

I commented the other day on a post Caliban made some time ago in which he stated that The Card Magic of Nick Trost is (paraphrasing here) good for people who are afraid of/cannot do sleight of hand.

I really want to know WHERE this strange paradigm has come from that seems to say that if an effect isn't chock full of sleights it is inferior. THAT type of thinking makes NO sense. Think of effects that would be considered inferior that are STRONG. For example:

Intuition (Trost), Miraskill (James), Prior Commitment (Aronson), Impossible! (Jennings), Overkill (Paul Harris) .... ahhh, there are HUNDREDS.

I do sleight of hand, but it is only ONE means to an end, and the END is what is important, E F F E C T.

Good to see a post from you Rennie!!

Ahimsa,
Vlad
Rennie
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Vlad,
I could not agree more. As for The Card Magic of Nick Trost, if you have it here are a few of my favorites:
1-Matched Picture Cards - pg 49
2-Seven Card Draw Prediction - pg 123
3-Subtle Location (Gilbreath) - pg 137
4-Intuition - pg 161 (which you noted)
5-Reset - pg 172
6-Nick's Stranger in Paradise - pg 189
Also from Stewart James, "Further than That"

I agree on sublety and a minimum of sleights.
Rennie
The effect is the important thing, how you achieve it is not.......
J.G. the magnificent
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Quote:
On 2010-05-01 10:46, mandarin wrote:
People are also courteous, especially with a child. They may have seen the trick many times before, but they will still try to enjoy seeing it again. Later they will remember and discuss that it wasn't new magic.

One advantage of skilled card magic is most people likely have not seen it before- a huge benefit to the magician. Relish that you are doing something few can do- there will always be someone doing the 21 card trick.

Of course, whenever possible avoid "being on the same bill" with a child (or animal)!

One other thing I have noticed is the number of "skilled" effects these days that forget the need to be quick, logical, easy to follow, etc. Some are so complicated they fail to entertain even though the skill needed to do them is at a high level. I look for a combo of skill and clarity.

Jim

Ya I agree a trick should be done quick not boring them with a lot of slights. I don't like it when magicians do tricks so quick you cant follow what they are doing even if you are really concentrating. A logically planned easy to follow effect is good. A good example of what not to do is this guy in my opinion anyway. My grandma sent me the video by email and I explained my opinion but she said it was still great. I don't see how because I just see him babling to fast for me to follow after a while and while he deals cards to fast for me to comrehend what is amazing about it looks like he just had cards in a certain order. I loved the thumb thing though and the what the &*%# card was brilliant. http://biggeekdaddy.com/humorpages/Humor/BestCardTrick.html I also agree slights are unique and perhaps it is simply that cute children can get away with things more. I was thinking though and when I made this post I think I was just a little upset about being outdone by a child that and I havent done a performance that bad since 9th grade I don't know what came over my performace that day. I couldn't seem to focus on the audience and make eye contact being focused on interaction with the individuals volunteering, the slights were off my patter was to quite, I was not myself that day. Self working tricks can have their place I just don't like the dealing piles ones. Certain ones if done correct cant be caught and are so curiously amusing can be repeated.
Jeremy Gates
Oyama
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Stupid is as stupid does.

Make those "stupid" tricks into something amazing using something called Presentation.
"it's better to live one day as a lion, than a thousand years as a lamb."
foolsnobody
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I'm not sure of this, but I believe (from what I've seen in print) that Marlo loved the 21 card trick and the Piano trick. Of course, he didn't leave them alone, but made magician-foolers out of them (and thereby made the effects more fooling for laymen as well.) See also his Poor Man's Linking Ring routine using Adams sets where you can see the weld and he points it out. Or his work with the Tel-a-Color trick. But I think he always had a love in his heart for the simple tricks that impressed him as a kid new to magic. He referred to Hatton and Plate, Magicians' Tricks and How They Are Done, more than once in his writing.

Subscribe to Racherbaumer's site and get his exhaustive treatise on the 21 card trick.
J.G. the magnificent
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I am know and perform the card piano taught with toothpics in Tom Mullica's Expert Impromptu Magic Made Easy! Volume 17. Not sure which one you are speaking of is the same version though. I should look into the things suggested though.
Jeremy Gates
MrGreggy
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I teach magic at the Circus Camp here in Atlanta every summer (and winter). Invariably I will be shown the 21 card trick at least twice a week by an enthusiastic kid. Usually the presentation is slow, boring and often done wrong. As much as I dislike that trick, I don't want to discourage the child. So I set it up as a homework assignment. I explain that it's a rather boring trick. The counting, laying the cards out, picking them back up, etc etc. Their assignment is to figure out how to present it in such a way that it's quicker and more interesting. Sometimes they will merely speed up the moves, or develop a background story. Fair enough. One student was really thinking and figured out how to reduce it to 9 cards instead of the 21.

The point of this long-winded posting is that you're correct in assuming that the mere fact a child is doing a trick is entertaining. It's also a great chance to increase that child's interest in magic and plant the seeds of the importance of presentation.
J.G. the magnificent
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I like what you said MrGreggy and I forgot about this post. I don't know what I was thinking when I posted it. Looking back I realize how bad my grammer was in the post. Also those tricks are not neccesarily stupid but really only good in certain environments unless presentation is right. Like you said presentation is important. Thanks
Jeremy Gates
MaxfieldsMagic
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One trick definitely worth checking out is Pitt Hartling's "Chaos." It purposely starts off looking very much like the 21 card trick, with neat orderly piles and counting, but pretty soon you're swapping cards around and exchanging piles, and then the swirl the whole thing up into a big mess. At the end you find two selections after about two seconds of looking through the deck. Might be a good effect to show someone after they inflict the 21 card trick on you.
Now appearing nightly in my basement.
Harald
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There are several effects which are appropriate to follow a boring original 21 card trick. The best I know is by Jim Swain from his book 21st Century Card Magic. I even floored magicians with it.
J.G. the magnificent
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Thanks guys
Jeremy Gates
satellite23
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You know what the stupidest trick is?

"See this card. Okay, now close your eyes...."
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