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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The workshop » » Spring-loaded Harbin style Table (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Flying Magus
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Has anyone out there built a spring loaded folding table? I'm in the process of doing just that, but cannot get spring hinges. (or for that matter, spring wire with which to make some). Are there any other ways of spring-loading it that people have gotten to work?

Basically I want to start with it folded, then as soon as I release it, it pops open.
Magically yours,

Michel Fouché
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Donal Chayce
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Billy McComb had a version of the Harbin table that used strips of elastic to spring and hold it open. You can find a diagram of exactly where the elastic goes in "The Table Book"--it's at the end of the section on the Harbin table. It's an old book, but I believe Magic Inc. has kept it in print.
Flying Magus
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Thanks. I'm currently hunting around for my copy of it. I completely forgot I had one.
Magically yours,

Michel Fouché
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AGMagic
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I don't remember where I read about this, (probably Paul Osborne) but you might consider using mousetrap (or their heavier brother rat trap) springs and modifying them for your use. They are inexpensive and durable and can be added to regular hinges to make a spring hinge.
Tim Silver - http://www.facebook.com/pages/Magic-Woodshop/122578214436546

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Michael Baker
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Mousetrap spring are good for some applications like flaps for Dove in Balloon Trays, because they are strong and fast. If you find them to be too strong, you can make lighter tension springs.

Good hobby shops carry the music wire that I use to make my spring hinges. Look first for a shop that caters to builders of model airplanes, R/C cars, and such, not crafter stores.

I make the spring hinges for the Card Stars that I make (and couple other things), and most often use .025 wire. From the hobby stores, they usually come in 36" lengths, which is enough to make 3 springs, by my method.

You can also order piano wire on spools, but it will be a lot more than you need.

If all else fails, don't overlook steel guitar strings, but you'll pay a lot more that way.

Here is a little webpage I put together a couple years ago that shows how to make them.......

http://themagiccompany.com/sprg_hng.html
~michael baker
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AGMagic
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Quote:
On 2010-05-16 13:45, AGMagic wrote:
I don't remember where I read about this, (probably Paul Osborne) but you might consider using mousetrap (or their heavier brother rat trap) springs and modifying them for your use. They are inexpensive and durable and can be added to regular hinges to make a spring hinge.


Then again, it might have been Mr. Baker's website. It looks very familiar. Thanks Michael!
Tim Silver - http://www.facebook.com/pages/Magic-Woodshop/122578214436546

I know you believe you understand what you think I said, but I am not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.

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Man Ray
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You can also use the springs from women's hair clips for finer work.
Bill Hegbli
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If I remember correctly the working, Billy McComb's Harbin table was made by Repro Magic in England. Now defunct. They use quarter inch wood and only used one of the heavy duty hinges found in the hardware stores. The others were regular hinges as gravity let it fall. The the stop was heavy fishing line, to keep it at a right angle to the other leg.

The top folded, off center, in half. The legs had some kind of leatherette material on each side. The top was covered with velveteen and gold braid on the edges.

The company that purchased the rights to Repro Magic is to lazy to inventory the 5000 products and put them on their web site, can you believe he says it is to much work. So the products set in a warehouse. Go figure!
The Magic Ref
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Get a hold of Gene Anderson, he has the complete plans to make it, including the spring, in his letcute notes called "Perceptions & Deceptions". I think it is exactly what your looking for.

Mike
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profl
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Quote:
On 2010-05-16 15:54, Michael Baker wrote:
Mousetrap spring are good for some applications like flaps for Dove in Balloon Trays, because they are strong and fast. If you find them to be too strong, you can make lighter tension springs.

Good hobby shops carry the music wire that I use to make my spring hinges. Look first for a shop that caters to builders of model airplanes, R/C cars, and such, not crafter stores.

I make the spring hinges for the Card Stars that I make (and couple other things), and most often use .025 wire. From the hobby stores, they usually come in 36" lengths, which is enough to make 3 springs, by my method.

You can also order piano wire on spools, but it will be a lot more than you need.

If all else fails, don't overlook steel guitar strings, but you'll pay a lot more that way.

Here is a little webpage I put together a couple years ago that shows how to make them.......

http://themagiccompany.com/sprg_hng.html


Great info & web page directions! Thanks for sharing. In winding I have difficulty keeping the tension on the wire constant while winding with pliers. I use the jig, from 1920s Popular Mechanics, in the attachment. The TENSION BOLT allows me to reproducibly adjust the winding tension and keeping it constant during the winding.

Click here to view attached image.
Dr. Solar
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I've been trying to make a spring suitable for the flame to dove pan. Any ideas? I bought some torsion springs from Granger, too weak. I tried making my own with the links provided here. Even after setting them in the oven, they don't recoil to the position needed. I tried a mouse trap spring but even it once the lid is opened fully, does not snap back to the fully opened position.The lid remains at a severe angle due to the springs give.

Any one know where to get such a spring?

Doc
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Bill Hegbli
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Dr. Solar, you left out if you are winding the springs before you are setting into place. Like the springs you purchased from Granger, did you rotate or wind them to create more tension. Even the hand made springs will recoil a little and you have to re-wind the spring around the pin hinge until proper tension is found.

Yes, it is difficult, but not impossible.
The Magic Ref
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No need to do all that... Just get Anderson's Notes,,, But if you like doing all that extra work, go ahead...
Be Young...Have Fun!
calimagician
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Here is a little webpage I put together a couple years ago that shows how to make them.......

http://themagiccompany.com/sprg_hng.html



Thank you, Mr. Baker!
Michael Baker
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You're welcome. I hope it helps.

You can also find information regarding heat treating the springs. This has not been necessary for me and the small springs that I make, but may be worthwhile for your applications. That process was discussed at length in another thread. You might be able to search "springs" in the workshop and find it.
~michael baker
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Bill Hegbli
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Quote:
On 2010-06-12 22:40, The Magic Ref wrote:
Get a hold of Gene Anderson, he has the complete plans to make it, including the spring, in his letcute notes called "Perceptions & Deceptions". I think it is exactly what your looking for.

Mike


They do not seem to be available any longer!
http://www.geneanderson.com/products.html
Bill Hegbli
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Actually, I had a Japanese Harbin type table, it only folded in half, and how they solved the problem of spring hinges is they just used a long spring to connect the 2 sides. The length of the spring was the distance when open. Under the table top they put small eyelets that were used as stops.
Bill Hegbli
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Has anyone been successful in makng spring hinges for a Harbin Table?
hugmagic
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I make springs all the time on a hand drill (non posered). I I make them with a preload and heat treat then.

Bill, tell what you need and I will try and wind some for you..

One note, the pin must be small enough to allow the spring to decrease in diameter as it tightens if the pin is too big, it will straighten the spring and take the tension out.

Richard
Richard E. Hughes, Hughes Magic Inc., 352 N. Prospect St., Ravenna, OH 44266 (330)296-4023
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Bill Hegbli
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Richard, I believe the hinge designs I seen they cut a little notch out when they cut off the center pin section. That allows for the spring to be bigger/wider and loose when relaxed. As this only has to go from 180 degrees to 90 degrees, that is not that large of a travel distance.

I have searched the Internet and only find 4 inch spring hinges. There is a smaller design, but it is to big at the axis, with a cover. Then I found one that is maybe workable, but it is only a drawing, and one has to order and have them made, with a quanity limit.

Repro's design of the Billy McComb only used 1 or 2 standard larger spring hinges, as they are so powerful that it can control each section with only one. If wanting to make an actual Harbin multi section table, these would not fit the design. Repro's design stopped at 90 degrees with a heavy weight fishing line at the top under the tabletop.

I believe the Harbin spring hinges have to be more powerful then the type of hinges for smaller magic tricks. Meaning it may need a heavier wire thickness to snap the table open.
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