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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
I'm looking forward to seeing the golden parachute their CEO gets when he exits.
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Magic Spank Veteran user Las Vegas 320 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-07-24 05:01, Magic Spank wrote: I called it. http://abcnews.go.com/WN/bp-oil-spill-cr......11254252 They can't clean it up as fast as mother nature. We really need to stop giving ourselves so much credit. We can't even ruin the earth properly. |
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
Magic Spank, I am with you (though they shouldn't wait for the ten years), during world war 2 there was a looooot of oil and other fuels spilled into the ocean with no attempt to clean it up at the time and I doubt ever.
Now, ladies and gentlemen, we await the arrival of the links about ww2 oil! |
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Chance Inner circle 1385 Posts |
Are you 2 guys really that stupid? Umpteen millions of gallons of oil just don't vanish overnight. It might sink to the bottom, it might sink 200 feet and stay suspended before floating back to the surface, it might be sent on the gulf stream 1000 miles away -- but it does not simply vanish into thin air like it never happened. The ONLY way for oil to "disappear" once released into the ocean is for microbes to digest it. And it takes a lot of bacteria to eat up and poop out all of that oil. Valdez oil is still washing up more than 20 years later. This has become 20 Valdez'. You do the math.
The oil itself is barely anything compared to the long term effects it has on the local fishing beds and the like. Even if the oil does completely, 100%, disperse within 10 years' time, it will take 50 more to restart all of the life that has been lost underseas -- if it ever does. There are no guarantees it ever will. You apologists need to get your heads out of the dark smelly places and see this mess for what it is. Which is to say, an ecological equivalent of Hiroshima. |
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
You know Chance, I might have my feelings hurt if you were someone I wasn't convinced was nuts and lacking a bit upstairs in the thinking area.
The ecological equivalent of Hiroshima....what? You gotta problem with Nagasaki? I mean more people died in Nagasaki than Hiroshima, so wouldn't the better equivalent be Nagasaki? Just so I can make the right calculation how many fish equals one Japanese person? I need to know in order to calculate the number of dead and injured fish and shrimp. Exactly where are you genius? I mean, I recall you weeping about oil at your door when it wasn't anywhere near land yet, are you even in the region the oil is or are you imagining it must be smelly and icky? Of course it is a disaster and needs to be cleaned up, show where I ever said otherwise....go ahead....find it. Copy and paste it, you have my permission. Of course considering the unbelievable lack of response maybe it isn't considered a disaster by everyone. Now scurry off and complain about this post. |
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landmark Inner circle within a triangle 5194 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-07-25 18:08, MagicSanta wrote: About $1,000,000 a year. More here.
Click here to get Gerald Deutsch's Perverse Magic: The First Sixteen Years
All proceeds to Open Heart Magic charity. |
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
Yeah but you know he is getting a lump sum to boot. I'm betting around $20-25 million.
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Chance Inner circle 1385 Posts |
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
Shouldn't you be packing?
I read that article about the BP dude then last night on the news they said he was going to head a division in Russia.... |
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EsnRedshirt Special user Newark, CA 895 Posts |
Spank and Santa, I'd like to invite you to head on up to Prince William Sound in Alaska, and see how well it's cleaned itself up. The Exxon Valdez spill happened more than twenty years ago, so, if your theory is correct, everything should be hunky-dorey.
(Spoiler- It's not.)
Self-proclaimed Jack-of-all-trades and google expert*.
* = Take any advice from this person with a grain of salt. |
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MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts |
Let me explain this to the unthunkers out there. Yes if given time nature will take care of itself. At no point did I say that we should just let nature take its course because I am not an idiot like those enviromentalist who believe reforresting should be a natural process. I have been more vocal than the libs about getting things going and cleaning up even if it means BP is a financial wreck because of it. Got that? Humans need to clean it up, the response was not quick or efficient enough, they need to get the sand picked up and clean the marshes and the water and all that stuff. Hopefully that is very clear.
By the way it isn't a theory about nature eventually cleaning up things itself but it just takes too long. Are there any questions or does anyone else think that I believe clean up efforts should stop? |
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daffydoug Eternal Order Look mom! I've got 14077 Posts |
Here's what I found recently:
Capping the Riser for the Cameras For some time the official report was that there was no oil beneath the surface. Scientific groups came forward to say they had found many miles of crude plumes beneath the surface extending to the sea floor going east, west and south around the tip of Florida and up the east coast. We have been consistently lied to. What is being hidden now? Capping the riser has had no good effect on stopping the oil. BP’s own video footage shows a blowout of the well casing underneath the sea floor which burst through the surface of the sea floor. Other videos confirm leakage from the sea floor. Even though the national news seems to be ignoring this in favor of celebrating the capping, it seems to be well known on the Internet. Research vessels have discovered many fissures in the sea floor miles from the well head with oil and methane escaping from them. Scientists say that the methane concentrations in the Gulf are 100,000 to a million times more than normal. BP knows and has confessed that the well casing has been breached. With so many other leaks, the capping of the riser amounts to a publicity stunt. The admitted low test pressures in the capped well prove there is a breach in the well casing. When the well blew out BP would not reveal the normal operating pressure, so we don’t know now whether their expected pressure is being low-balled to make the low test pressures look better than they really are. The fact that their scientists have admitted to be disturbed by the low test pressures should really make us sit up and take notice. On top of that, pressurizing a damaged, eroded well is dangerous. Capping the riser only makes the threat worse. If one had a hole or holes in a garden hose and the end of the hose was open, only relatively small amounts of water would escape through the holes. However, if a nozzle was closed on the end of the hose, much more water would be forced out of the hole. In the well’s case, all that escapes goes under the sea floor building a bubble that is cracking the sea floor and could soon erupt and explode sending a tsunami into the coasts. We have been told by scientists that methane leaking through fissures, formed because of a bubble beneath the sea floor is the sign of an imminent methane explosion. Now we are seeing these signs and they are being ignored. In the distinct possibility that the relief wells fail to stem the leak, BP has gathered scientists to perfect a small nuclear bomb to focus energy to fuse the rock and seal the well through the relief wells. Meanwhile, the oil is continuing to gush out of the fissures and toward the rest of the world. It has been reported that the government is taking the threat seriously by moving naval ships out of the Gulf to Costa Rica and by ordering U.N. troops 100 miles north of the coast. Would that the rest of us were that valuable in their eyes. UPDATE Here is a portion of Paul Jablonowski’s newsletter sent to us on 7/21/10. If Matt Simmons is correct, they cannot tap into the casing because it has been eroded away and a nuke is their only hope of sealing the well. It is with a heavy heart and a serious tone that I am writing this update to my last newsletter # 9 - "ALERT to Leave the Gulf of Mexico Oil Spill." Last month I wrote regarding the toxic gas dangers in the air around the Gulf of Mexico oil spill. Today this problem is even more dangerous and yet the U.S. government and BP Oil still refuse to tell the whole truth of what is really happening with this methane volcano on the Gulf floor. The six inch wide "riser pipe" that was recently "capped" is totally irrelevant, and the open cauldron, which is miles from where BP's cameras are focused, continues to spew 120,000 barrels per day. This information comes from Matthew Simmons who is not only a leading expert in the oil industry, but also a previous National Energy Advisor to US Presidents! Matthew says, "this is the biggest cover up and con job we've ever seen." He also said, "the riser pipe is built into the the rig floor like a man hole cover," but this is the cover up! The real problem is the huge gaping well bore hole that has no casing or blow out preventer (BOP), so relief wells will not work! PLEASE listen to this 17 minute interview with Matthew Simmons on National Public Radio KPFK by Ian Masters. The waters in the Gulf are NOT safe to swim in. Here is just one independent study done by WKRG Channel 5 News in Mobile, Alabama where they took samples of water from seven different places on the beaches and all of them tested far above the 5 parts per million that the EPA recommends for a safe toxic level of oil in water. One of the samples even exploded upon testing! They figured the presence of either methane (methanol) or the chemical dispersant corexit in the water sample is what caused it to explode. Also read Matt Simmons -- BP Cap Is Absurd
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
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EsnRedshirt Special user Newark, CA 895 Posts |
BP will never release any actual numbers- they would let scientists figure out exactly how much oil was spilled so we'd know how much to fine BP.
And in this case, call me anti-corporate, but a company with that lousy a safety record (700+ violations in the same timespan that Exxon had just one single violation) deserves to be fined into bankruptcy. Their stockholders may lose money, but they should have known to diversify, and to not invest in a company with such poor ethical practices. To them, it's only about the money. The worst part- the CEOs and corporate execs who are actually to blame will bail out with their golden parachutes, and never have to worry about, pay for, or even look at the flaming wreckage they left behind.
Self-proclaimed Jack-of-all-trades and google expert*.
* = Take any advice from this person with a grain of salt. |
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
Ummm pension plans have BP as part of a diverse portfolio. I love the way liberals think that fining them into bankrupsy is just ok practice.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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smudgedj New user Cochabamba, Bolivia 82 Posts |
Will they not just write all the fines off as a tax loss? In the end the tax payer will foot the bill.
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EsnRedshirt Special user Newark, CA 895 Posts |
Danny- if they weren't obfuscating the amount of oil they've spilled, and the latest official estimate is accurate, they could pay over $25 billion in fines. (They won't, of course, because of politics.) The damage the spill causes to our coastline and tourism industry will likely exceed even that, though. Even more- there's a possibility of criminal negligence involving the death of those eleven rig workers. Should they just be allowed to just get away with it?
Also, you're generalizing again. I do not speak for "all liberals". And some liberals don't think BP should be fined at all- the more radical ones out there ones think the entire company should just be dissolved, and have all its assets seized and auctioned off. (Nevermind that it's a multinational corporation, and attempting to do so would be a legal and political nightmare.) As for your pension plan defense, that's why I said diversify; any investment is risky- diversified pension plans won't lose all of their value. If you invested in a company that had a record of dumping toxic waste illegally, on a regular basis, that wouldn't be a smart investment, now would it?
Self-proclaimed Jack-of-all-trades and google expert*.
* = Take any advice from this person with a grain of salt. |
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Cyberqat Inner circle You can tell I work on the net from my 2209 Posts |
Actually...
SOME arch liberals believe that the culpability goes far beyond BP and extends to all of us for allowing our society to become so hooked and dependent on oil that we are willing to look the other way when our oil companies take such risks. And that vilifying BP is just a combination of the politicians and oil companies handing us a scape goat so they don't have to change, and individuals getting off on acting morally superior.
It is always darkest just before you are eaten by a grue.
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daffydoug Eternal Order Look mom! I've got 14077 Posts |
I just don't know WHAT to believe anymore. Now I found this:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ynews_excl/ynews_excl_sc3270
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
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EsnRedshirt Special user Newark, CA 895 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-07-28 18:38, daffydoug wrote: You can believe that BP has very deep pockets, and, like the tobacco industry, is very willing to buy an army of scientists to suit its needs. So you can also believe nothing without checking your sources and getting some independant verification. Bacteria can't handle all the spill. Plus there's the sheer quantity of dispersant that was used, which is in and of itself, incredibly toxic.
Self-proclaimed Jack-of-all-trades and google expert*.
* = Take any advice from this person with a grain of salt. |
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Cyberqat Inner circle You can tell I work on the net from my 2209 Posts |
Mostly you need to believe that journalism is dead, because it has been for a long time.
In particular this rather sloppy article contradcits itself frequently... ", a scientist with the environmental group Oceana, told the New York Times that as much as 40 percent of the oil might have evaporated when it reached the surface. " Followed by... "federal scientists [have determined] the oil [is] primarily sitting in the water column and not on the sea floor." Followed by... "some researchers suspect, is that the oil has been devoured by microbes. " So clearly the headline should have been... "Nobody knows what the hell is going on in the gulf, not even us!" Ill just add that, according to people I know in the gulf, the news *and* the government are sitting on any photos of the horrible damage and death in wildlife for fear that (a) it will destroy what little tourist trade is left and (b) it will galvanize the public to call for change far deeper then anyone in industry or government wants.
It is always darkest just before you are eaten by a grue.
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