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mindpunisher Inner circle 6132 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-07-28 09:54, Dick Christian wrote: Of course its exposure. You are pointed to a video of a gimmicked lock then given a link to buy it. If you never buy it you now know there are such things as gimmiked locks Its exposure |
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Dave Scribner Assistant Manager Lake Hopatcong, NJ 4849 Posts |
Mindpunisher, I don't think knowing the name of an effect and where to buy it is anywhere near exposure. It's is no more exposure than mentioning "thumper" in your signature and providing a link to an area that describes how it can be used and where it can be purchased.
Where the magic begins
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pete Loyal user Finland 207 Posts |
Are you guys serious about this? Routine is Max Mavens, not anyone else. If you buy a trick or apparatus that does NOT MEAN you can do someone elses routine with it without permission.
Thank you for those who understand this. And those you don´t, think about it first. Please! PP |
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Sven Rygh Inner circle Oslo, Norway. 1945 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-07-29 04:21, pete wrote: Seconed! ..and mind me; - it is very easy to go wrong here. People copying one of other performers' personal pet routines, do that all the time. Max Maven created this routine for Max Maven and his style, - not for anyone else. That is important to remember, in addition to the moral and ethics of course. (if there is a point to mention this at all here) Sven
WWW.SVENRYGH.NO
"Keep it as simple as possible, - but no simpler" http://www.svenrygh.no/sven-rygh/presse/nrk-forst-og-sist/ http://www.svenrygh.no/video.html |
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Garrad Elite user 446 Posts |
I have read something very much like this but with pictures, I think it was in MM&M but I'm not sure.
You might say reality is the result of complex negotiations between the observer and the observed. But that is simply a point of view.
Many Thanks Garrad |
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pete Loyal user Finland 207 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-07-29 07:05, Sven Rygh wrote: Excactly!!! Easy to understand if we want to. PP |
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Mentalist Sam Regular user 173 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-07-29 04:21, pete wrote: Pete, I think you're overreacting a bit. The original poster just asked about the routine. He didn't know whether it was available or not. Max has a lot of material on the market, so it's a natural assumption to think that maybe this too was available commercially. In this day and age with so much material being released, it would be almost impossible to know unless you ask. Unfortunately what happens in this forum is that as soon as someone asks about a routine, everyone jumps on him and accuses him of wanting to steal the routine. Again, how would you know unless you asked? The OP never stated he was going to do the routine if it wasn't available. Personally I don't think you can do the routine without knowing some strategies because it looks like it can go in a number of directions. So it doesn't matter what method Max used, it's doubtful the presentation can be duplicated just from watching the video. So to the original poster, the core effect is Seven Keys to Baldpate. It's a classic. There are many methods to accomplish it, some using special apparatus, and others that do not. If the plot interests you, you now have enough information to study it, buy different versions and knowing that what you saw Max Maven do isn't commercially available, find your own twist on the plot. It's a great effect, no matter the method. |
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mrmagic0 Inner circle Ron Frank 1606 Posts |
It is indeed Key-R-Ect and as Mentalist Sam states it is possible that in Max's version things could go wrong if not performed correctly. But only Max could perform it in this manner and do such a great job. There is an interesting history behind Key-R-Ect, at least as I have been told, but this is not the forum for this. I have used this effect off and on for years in many different types of routines from serious to comedy. It is a classic.
Ron |
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pete Loyal user Finland 207 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-07-29 08:42, Mentalist Sam wrote: You maybe right. Apologize if you understood me wrong. Anyway that routine is one those that Max has not published. And I was only worried attitude that you buy some gimmick or trick and you think that´s the same thing than buy a routine and presentation. PP |
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tincture Special user 587 Posts |
That may be the prop used, but that certainly isn't the effect.
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marklock Regular user 151 Posts |
Max's presentation clearly demonstrates the level of thinking that goes into an excellent routine. I dare say many have toyed with the workings of various methods, but few have created presentations like this. When a performer of Max's caliber shifts a paradigm on a familiar plot, it is hard not cop it. It seems so obvious now that we've seen his routine. But it wasn't prior.
Few can appreciate the time it took to develop it to the level it currently is. That's what so many of us lack, the willingness to do the hard work. |
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Miraclemakers Special user INA 685 Posts |
Quote:
On 2010-07-28 19:08, Dave Scribner wrote: I agree with you.... |
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Gianni Special user WILMINGTON, DE 993 Posts |
Here is a question for this group.
I ordered a key effect from an on-line dealer. The effect was listed on the website as "Key R Rect." The product I received was called "Three Key Monte" and requires the performer to touch the lock. I complained to the dealer that this was not the product "Key R Rect" even though you could perform the "same" effect. The dealer told me that there was nothing he could do for me. The product was mine. So the question is: if you see an effect on a website called "Key R Rect" are you justified in assuming that it is the product associated with that effect (requiring no performer contact) or just that you will get something that can perform the effect, albeit with different limitations? Gianni |
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aligator Inner circle Canada 2044 Posts |
You should get a refund and should accept nothing less.
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Bennettjc Loyal user Brooklyn, NY 257 Posts |
Gianni:
I am sorry that you were taken advantage of by an immoral merchant. Suffice it to say that the purchaser should always expect to receive the product they ordered. Nothing less, nothing different. Would you be willing to share with us which website this was, so we can avoid that seller in favor of one who respects the buyer and understands the value of customer service? Thanks, Bennett |
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Gianni Special user WILMINGTON, DE 993 Posts |
Bennett:
I might be willing to share that information, but have not decided on that yet. My first goal was to determine how others on this board felt about the situation. In order to provide an opinion, respondents would have to be familiar with the particular effect, Key R Rect. They would have to understand how that effect works (i.e., does not require manipulation by the performer), and how it differs from a gravity device (does require manipulation). Of those in the know, the question is whether advertising the effect with the name "Key R Rect" refers to a specific, marketed item, or is it fair game to call an effect "Key R Rect" referring just to the illusion that can be created irrespective of the method. I feel very strongly that in advertising an item as "Key R Rect" a dealer is advertising a very specific product, not a generic description of the ultimate effect. I want to get opinions from this board. Has the name "Key R Rect" become the same as Kleenex, Xerox, Coke, i.e., that if one says they are selling you a Kleenex, they can deliver any tissue to you; if they sell you a Coke, it is fair game to deliver any cola, etc. If this board thinks I am wrong then it would be unfair to besmirch someone. Gianni |
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s3rg3 New user Belgium 72 Posts |
Key R Rect is not as general as "a Coke" to me...
Key R Rect is like "Coca Cola", you would expect a specific item. I don't think it makes any difference, but I wonder if there was a picture in the product description ? If there was a picture, was it the one of the product delivered ? IMHO the dealer should know that this was misleading and should refund without any other questions asked. Rgds Serge |
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Dick Christian Inner circle Northern Virginia (Metro DC) 2619 Posts |
Gianni,
Here is what I posted when you asked the same question in your "Key-R-Rect Question" post to this forum: Seems to me that if "Key-R-Rect" is what is advertised and what you paid for, but what you got is NOT "Key-R-Rect" you are the victim of an illegal "bait and switch" scam. If the transaction (i.e., payment and delivery) was conducted by mail then "mail fraud" -- or if over the Internet, "wire fraud" -- may be involved; however, I am not an attorney and if either purchaser or seller is outside the USA US law may not apply. In any event, it seems to me that you are entitled to redress. Having said that, "entitlement" and "satisfaction" are tow different things and it may well be that getting either a refund or the "Key-R-Rect" you purchased may be far more difficult and costly than chalking the whole thing up to "lessons learned." Whatever the outcome, you should certainly let the world know (via the Café and every other Internet magic forum you can access) the identity of the dealer who ripped you off so that others can avoid him.
Dick Christian
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aligator Inner circle Canada 2044 Posts |
I am certain that the apparatus used in the MM video is Correct Key, formerly Key R Rect. The routine only uses 4 of the 8 keys and belongs to Max, I believe. It is not difficult to figure - just think psychology and audience manipulation. It's not 100% but should work out nearly every time if done properly. However, one can build in a viable out to cover a miss.
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