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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Ever so sleightly » » Cup and Balls routine (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

afinemesh
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Senseless gibberish that amounts to
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Hey Guys,
I've only been doing the cups and balls for about a year. I do your basic Vernon routine and get great response. But, there's so many fancy moves and routines out there, it's hard to know if I should change it up or not. Lance Burton, Michael Ammar and Mike Rogers all do the Vernon routine. For them "simple and effective" works. So, why would I want to learn a hopped up version when the "old standard" is still good enough for seasoned pros? It can't be as simple as personality or performing style, can it?
"I've always been mental, I'm sure of it" Boris Pocus Smile


"Someday we'll look back on this and it will all seem funny". . .Bruce Springsteen
walid ahumada
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I believe they took vernon's routine and work with it until they came with their own vernon's style routine.

keep working on yours until you feel comfortable.

Walid.
“Magic becomes art when it has nothing to hide.” BEN OKRI quote
Bill Palmer
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Take a look at Rafael Benatar's routine from his Elegant Cups and Balls DVD. It started out as the Vernon routine, but he removed parts that he didn't feel were necessary.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
Lawrence O
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Possibly you want to be credited for more than just performing. Possibly you would like to be credited for creating and performing your own magic as well. This is a good motivation. Follow Bill Palmer's advice and take one phase out and replace it by another phase from another routine.

You may want to look at the new book on Fred Kaps' cups and balls written by Pete Biro (you can find it at Joe Stevens' Magic Emporium). It's different enough to plant ideas that will have to be original to be able to do some blending.

Another rarely studied routine is Dick Biow.

Sam Leo Horowitz also had a very different approach which can be a source for some phase.

When you will have looked at these for inspiration, there is more... and it's fun to keep on thinking over the years.

Now if you want to be really original, think side magnet, think invisible thread, think hold out, think combining what modern technology offers with our traditional approach, not opposing them using one to reinforce the other...
Magic is the art of proving impossible things in parallel dimensions that can't be reached
funsway
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old things in new ways - new things in old ways
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Also consider alternative cups whose construction allows for new sleights and moves. Check out my "Scout Around" or PM me for ideas from pending eBooks.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst



ShareBooks at www.eversway.com * questions at funsway@eversway.com
afinemesh
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Thank you Lawrence,
I am fascinated with the cups and balls. At this point it's the only effect I have significant time to give to. I tend to want to find something inside the "box" and get that down. Sometimes I see doing something many different ways (outside the box)as confusing. As opposed to opening up different options. I appreciate everyone's comments.
"I've always been mental, I'm sure of it" Boris Pocus Smile


"Someday we'll look back on this and it will all seem funny". . .Bruce Springsteen
Dougini
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Thank you Lawrence O!

I've always known you were brilliant, and this just proves my point! I copied and pasted your post into a folder, that I keep the best ideas and thoughts from the Café.

I'm so thankful you are here!

Doug
kentfgunn
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Spent the last four days doing the cups and balls for a bunch of different friends and listening to their feedback.

Humility is key, even if you find a small improvement. Thousands and thousands of magicians have done the trick before us. I suspect the greatest performances occurred long before any of us were ever born. The greatest performance of all could well be yours if you simply look hard enough within yourself!

We have a tradition, especially with this trick that we must keep alive for those who follow us. The basic plot, as I've chosen to interpret it remains the same. You convince your audience that moving the balls between hands and cups is your only purpose. All the while you're loading up, before their very eyes.

Please,
Find something new. Don't blindly parrot either the words or sequences of others. Their path is not necessarily yours. Find some concept or mechanism to move into our favorite piece of magic. Find two, find half a dozen.

There are no rules during the creation of new sequences. The number of cups or balls is not engraved in stone. (For some it is engraved in silver!)

Some people tell me that not all magicians can be inventive or innovators. If you're telling yourself that . . .

Stop it! You are limiting yourself.

If you're listening to other people telling you that lie, believe in yourself a little more today. Tomorrow, break out your cups and some objects you never thought of as balls before. Go to a toy store and look for loads all over the store. Go to a Wal-Mart and look for a set of cups no one else is using. Put magnets places no one else has ever thought of. Go to Uncle Bill's museum. It inspired me to find a great set of cups, imbued with their own magic. Find your inspiration. Read Ammar's grand book. Find Bob Farmer's Cyclops. Read the sequences in Tarbell.

Without new gaffs or innovation? Find a story you believe in. Tell us that story.

Do not follow . . . Believe in yourself. That really and truly is where the real magic is hiding.

KG
Bill Palmer
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Kent speaks the truth, and he does so from experience.

The Vernon routine is an excellent place to start. But let me quote Vernon and his opinion about magicians.

"Don't try to be another Doug Henning or Mark Wilson. There is already a Doug Henning, and there is already a Mark Wilson. You will never be as good at being Doug Henning as he is, and you will never be as good at being Mark Wilson as Mark is.

"But neither of them will ever be as good at being YOU as you are. So be natural. Be yourself."

I don't know if that's written down anywhere. It should be. But that was as close as I can remember to what he told us in Arlington, Texas at the $1000 lecture.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
dcjames
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So much wisdom posted here. I'm loving this thread!


Best,

Doug
“Magic is very easy to do - poorly.”

Tommy Wonder
The Books of Wonder
Volume 2
Dougini
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LOL, Doug, you should see the folder I have with just Bill Palmer's posts! I had to burn an entire CD, with all the great tips and advice I've acquired from the Café over the years!

I'm on CD#2!

The "other" Doug
Dougini
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Ya know...you REALLY know you're addicted to magic, when you find three Dixie Cups, wad up paper napkins, and start playing Cups & Balls with them. I think I need therapy...

Smile

Doug
kentfgunn
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Dougini,

A CD holds over 700MB. That's seven hundred million characters/letters. Now Bill is quite a character, but still if every one of his 21,000 posts were preserved for posterity they'd each have to be 30,000 letters long. Nope . . . you're not really on a second CD.

I'm all for complimenting Herr Palmer. Let's not wax all that enthusiastic though.

Now if you put all of Jonathan Townsend's posts together . . . That would fill up something, we just don't know what it is.

On a completely unrelated note . . . the entire print contents of the library of congress fit into about ten terabytes. You can walk into Best Buy and buy that much storage space for about 700 dollars.

http://searchstorage.techtarget.com/

But I digress . . .
Bill Palmer
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Quote:
Now if you put all of Jonathan Townsend's posts together . . . That would fill up something, we just don't know what it is.


But there has been some conjecture. Smile
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
Alex Rapattoni
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This is a great thread! A lot of good advice. I am still working on my routine and am always happy to find great advice. I am trying not to learn any one routine, but to learn all the moves I can and put them together in an entertaining way that makes sense for me.
Weird is part of the job.
Dougini
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Quote:
On 2010-08-07 16:56, kentfgunn wrote:
Dougini,
A CD holds over 700MB....Nope . . . you're not really on a second CD.

I'm all for complimenting Herr Palmer. Let's not wax all that enthusiastic though...


Kent, do not tell me I have not started a second CD. I dislike being called a liar. No problem, though. Read my post again. I should have started a new paragraph. MY error. I should have been more specific.

It should have been written like this:

"You should see the folder I have with just Bill Palmer's posts!" Folder, Kent. Period.

Then, my next sentence starts a WHOLE new thought:

"I had to burn an entire CD, with all the great tips and advice I've acquired from the Café OVER THE YEARS!" Do you know how long I've been here?

You have no idea how MUCH I have acquired from this Café! Websites from LINKS take up a LOT of space. Entire pages of HTML (Hyper Text Machine Language, or something similar, LOL) from the Café. I have started CD #2. Simple as that. Did I use 700MB? Do I HAVE to?? I like things ORGANIZED.

I don't really like dignifying that post with a response. But maybe you meant well. Maybe I didn't get the humor. Or maybe you think I'm a goof. I don't know. Maybe Bill laughs and thinks I'm a goof. I was paying him the respect I believe he deserves. That's all. Maybe I do that too much. There are MANY here in the Café, like Bill, that I depend on for valuable info. "Magicians Helping Magicians".

I'm not in a very good mood, due to a recent catastrophe I have had to endure. Forgive me if I'm being a bit harsh. You are forgiven in advance for your error. I will stop there.

You are right, Alex Rapattoni, this IS a great thread. And the Café is FULL of info like this. I see you are 5 posts away from being allowed into The Banquet Room, and there is SO much more there. A belated welcome to the Café!

The "Goofy" Doug
Bill Palmer
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Doug:

I don't think you are a goof at all. I'm honored that you would have a folder on your CD full of things I have posted.

I hope you get your situation resolved quickly.

Bill
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
kentfgunn
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Dougini,

I didn't mean to come across so harshly. I'm glad you find the Café so informative and useful in your life.

I genuinely thought you were being funny or sarcastic about making a CD. I never occurred to me that someone would find what is scribbled here worthy of collating, when the posts are are search-friendly and available on the Magic Café servers. The Café and it's information is obviously very valuable to you. I won't poke fun at your sincerity again.

I underestimated the value of the Café to you. I thought I was being tongue-in-cheek funny with a co-conspirator. Instead, you took my feeble attempt at humor as an attack on your honor. I am sorry for that.

Whatever catastrophe has befallen you, I hope you can deal with it without too much sadness.

KG
Dougini
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Not a problem, Kent. At 54, I can be a crotchety old fart, sometimes! LOL. I was wondering if that was humor or not. My bad.

As far as my misfortune...I'm hangin' in there. There has been an outpouring of real love here in the Café. That, to me is invaluable. So many friends, and I really don't know how to thank each and every one of you. I think there are people MUCH worse off than I am. I've never been homeless before. Nor lost every penny I had, and that was considerable. I've never lost my entire collection of (four trunks full) magic before, either. But ya know, I'm realizing just how trivial it all is.

If you have your health, you are WAY ahead of the game. Thank God I have that. I can still make a coin vanish! LOL! I am blessed to have all my friends here at the Café. I guess that's why I wax so enthusiastic!

Best,
Doug
gaddy
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In situations like this I find that it's best to take a blind shot across the bow in the dark as well.

:devilish:
*due to The Magic Cafe's editorial policies, words on this site attributed to me cannot necessarily be held to be my own.*
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