The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Latest and Greatest? » » Bob Kohler's Lightning Box (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page [Previous]  1~2~3..9~10~11~12 [Next]
davidpaul$
View Profile
Inner circle
Pittsburgh, Pa
2932 Posts

Profile of davidpaul$
[quote]On 2010-12-16 18:52, gaffed wrote:
Second point, you cannot show the Mystery Box to be empty BEFORE you place it in use if you wish to do so.
(end of edited quote)

Just wanted to mention that you certainly "can" show the Mystery Box empty before you put it into use.
Doug Brewer's "Get Bent" DVD shows a nice routine doing just that and one that I use all the time.

I don't own the Lightning Ring Box and with the reactions I'm getting from the Mystery Box as well as some simpler homemade methods I really don't see the need-(for now anyway)
If you can't help worrying, remember worrying can't help you!
gaffed
View Profile
Inner circle
So far I've managed to gimmick
1818 Posts

Profile of gaffed
Quote:
On 2010-12-16 22:27, davidpaul$ wrote:

Just wanted to mention that you certainly "can" show the Mystery Box empty before you put it into use.
Doug Brewer's "Get Bent" DVD shows a nice routine doing just that and one that I use all the time.

I don't own the Lightning Ring Box and with the reactions I'm getting from the Mystery Box as well as some simpler homemade methods I really don't see the need-(for now anyway)


Yes, I suppose you could show the Mystery Box empty first, and then with a bit of misdirection "set" it. However you certainly couldn't place it on a table, remove the lid to show it empty, and then never touch it again. By the way, the Lightning Box is not a ring box and could not be used as such. Well, at least not with a borrowed ring.
"Half this game is ninety percent mental."
~Yogi Berra~

"To one who has faith, no explanation is necessary. To one without faith, no explanation is possible." ~St. Thomas Aquinas~

Twitter"A means of proving how pathetic and lonely you are in 140 characters or less." ~Anonymous~
Cosmo Solano
View Profile
Elite user
Colorado
410 Posts

Profile of Cosmo Solano
Hey all,

Bob Kohler and I have been pals for many years and as you all know he's been generous with his compliments on my effect "Q". I was honored that Bob liked Q so much that he wanted to feature me and it on the DVD that comes with LB, and that it's the first and only item he sells that's not his own production.

Oddly enough, I haven't gotten my LB yet! I bowed out of the "front of the line" of this because Bob was so overwhelmed with orders and production I figured I could just wait...I should receive mine soon and I will be giving a review of my own and I promise a non-biased one...

I have to say that having played with the only working model in existence at the time, I was very excited to own one. And patience isn't my middle name, believe me!
I am posting here regarding a few posts I've read.

To some, the price of LB seems high, but I really believe it's because so much magic is so ridiculously "low" priced. I know what it takes to make this item, and especially one that works as well as it does, everyone of us would spend months trying to make one just right and probably fail in the end. Our time wouldn't be worth it.

I also have kept tabs on all the conversations Bob and I have had over the phone for the past several months and I know how much work he puts into it, making it right. If anyone out there would be willing to take your time, your experience and your creation (that's actually worth more than it all combined) and take it to market for much less than you'd be not only hurting yourself by losing money but the magic community would suffer too.

I know that I have a rather high priced item on the market as well, but I think most of us have NO idea the commitment and the work it takes to get something just right, the years of experience going into it, it's inception and creation.

I initially thought Q could sell for about $75 less than it does. With all the work we put into it I kinda wish I was selling it for even more than I do now. And the work is beyond just producing it, it's full time to answer emails, respond here (The Magic Café), get the word out, change design when problems arise and even just starting over when things aren't quite right. the dedication is immeasurable.

And to go into full blown production as Bob has is a whole other story. We make Q by hand because the initial cost of "factory" production is outrageous! The investment Bob's had to make to get out one little box would blow your mind!
I'm really not here to defend Bob or even my own higher priced item...
but to get on a campaign to "up" our own values for what we do. Compare it to what you (hopefully) charge for your professional time...

A person can go see the bazillion dollar production in a movie, and see the finest performers for 10 bucks or less. We charge (again, hopefully) hundreds or more for an hour of our time. As we should! but you charge so because you're time and efforts UP TO THE POINT has gone unrewarded and you've honed your craft. What you do sets you apart from an afternoon at Chucky Cheese or an evening at a movie.

We all need folks like Bob creating these things because we all use them to make money or to build our reputation etc. And to think something of this nature should cost much less is discounting our own vocation/profession. And c'mon! YOU are performing an effect from the mind of a long time respected pro, who's ideas and work has years and years behind it not to mention that rare genius we all hope to achieve.

Would you have come up with these products on your own?

As a full time performer for almost 3 decades I have to say, good magic sells for way to little! And not because I don't want hobbiests owning them, but because good magic props and ideas are priceless! I sure wish we could all start looking at this stuff from an "effect" point of view instead of prop verses cost.

I've seen the box compared to others and honestly it's not that Bob's box is too high, it is what it is for reasons... it's that the others are too low!
Seriously, the MB is pretty ingenious! I was out of magic for about 5 years and when I was only introduced to JK's box in the past year or so, (because of Q) and was honestly FLOORED at how LOW priced it was. Too low! My thought was why would someone sell their own genius for so little!

I think EVERYONE here can make up their mind if the EFFECT is worth their own money or not since a buck is easier to acquire for some than it is for others. Some of us charge more and some less, so the cost is relative to each. Whenever someone makes their review about the cost it's misleading since we all have different incomes etc, and you could be talking someone out of a gem based on your own personal budget. Many of you can afford a $200 prop more than I can! (my neighbor can afford a BMW I drive a Kia!)

What I really feel these forums are for is the effect, our reviews of the props and our sharing of the results we get. So that the rest of us can have some evidence of whether the item does what it claims and functions properly. Its also so valuable to hear the reactions and the work involved.

If I were talked out of buying any magic strictly for price, I'd be hurting myself. In fact I thought it ridiculous to pay over 1200 dollars for a highly recommended effect until I finally got it and performed with it.
It will serve me for years and at first performance was worth every penny and more. (Believe me it seriously taxed my budget too!)

It just seems that some of us have lost our own respect for the art and the value of what we do. I guess this is why its so easy to find age old secrets posted by little kids on youtube.

The cheaper the magic gets, the cheaper MAGIC gets. It kind of sad.

Sorry for carrying on, but when someone says magic is overpriced I just cringe, really? Over priced by who's budget? I feel like you should state your annual income and expenses before you say that! Smile the cost of the item is the only thing that really has no place in these reviews, since I have no way of comparing what you can afford to what I can afford. I think it's great that everyone's comparing the different props to each other. THAT'S so valuable!
We all know what we can afford, help us out by posting the important stuff we really need to know to help make our decision.

Hope I haven't ruffled feathers... I'm not into that.
Sorry so long...
coz
Steven Conner
View Profile
Inner circle
2468 Posts

Profile of Steven Conner
Hey Coz, I couldn't agree more. It seems most want the effect but don't want to pay for it. So when a cheaper model comes in, what a deal. Golfers don't want to pay $3300 for a set of clubs when they can buy a knock-off for $600.00. It boils downs that this has become a way of life.
"The New York Papers," Mark Twain once said,"have long known that no large question is ever really settled until I have been consulted; it is the way they feel about it, and they show it by always sending to me when they get uneasy. "
martysh
View Profile
Elite user
Greenville,SC
464 Posts

Profile of martysh
No matter the price it sure earned it's keep for me last Friday night...a small church gathering at a small resataurant and I just showed this to a table of 4 ...and this senior type gentleman wanted to look at the box and I put it in his haand... and then I proceeded (you never do a trick ...twice) to do it a second time ...no build up just went right to it but this time I let him open it up no more than a few inches from his eyes.. and there was the signed card again in less than a second back in the box which he openned... he couldn't believe it ..I blew him away.. he gave me his card to show he was a city councilman of my town. I would have paid anything for that moment...
the box just paid for itself last Friday nigth.


Marty
Cosmo Solano
View Profile
Elite user
Colorado
410 Posts

Profile of Cosmo Solano
Here here Steven! I don't even think it's about the cheaper model, I think it's most about how price is purely relative, like I said there's no BASE for it. What I find affordable is probably common only to my wife's opinion!
It would be nice just to keep to the important things, we'd do each other a favor!

When it comes to buying the knock offs, well your just asking for the creative ones out there to stop sharing. Ironically, those who buy the knock-offs are the ones who need the creators the most! (bite the hand that feeds you!)
Its getting worse and worse, I know of a top pro who has so much to offer us, and would like to, but won't release a thing, because of it. He'll probably go to his grave with his ideas. What a shame. If we could all just NOT support that market...

Marty what a great testimony for this, but more-so for the power we have at our fingertips and what performing magic really is about! It proves what most of the experienced pros know... the effect can and should FAR outweigh the method. With the right presentation and proper timing, you should be able to direct every ounce of their attention! With all the emphasis on the impossibility of it all, you left that guy with nothing to think of but... WOW! (Box? what box?)

This box is simply a prop, and the discrepancies, the look, the mechanics are really a matter of how YOU handle it. It sounds like Marty works with enough confidence that doing this twice really is no risk at all for him. If that doesn't say something about the reality of using this prop, nothing does.

Bravo Marty!

I'm watching the DVD right now... can't wait to play with the box in the real world.
Cosmo Solano
View Profile
Elite user
Colorado
410 Posts

Profile of Cosmo Solano
Okay here goes...
I was afraid to review this being friends with Kohler and all, but I promised myself I would be as honest as possible.

I can see where some have felt a little uncomfortable with the handling and discrepancies, which I have to say are actually very minor once you actually try it.
Bob points out the professional viewpoint on this, which everyone should take seriously.
On the DVD he says that the "revelation" is not when the cards is unfolded and shown, but when the lid is removed and the card is in the box.
This is HUGE! And it provides all the inherent misdirection you could ask for when you set the box down.

After doing it several times yesterday, often for the same people, you'd have to actually TRY to get someone to notice anything sneaky.

The reward, (for that little discrepancy, which really only is a problem for an insecure performer) is that you can make a strong but subtle point of the box being empty before, and then casually show it empty after, which in fact removes all suspicion from the box. I can't emphasize enough that Marty's post about repeating it says SO MUCH!
Also, to be able to use ANY billet or card here is a big plus. I have another "box" effect which I have to be honest I do love to use, but one night some folks spilled drinks on my cards and I ended up using the wrong color cards, this great effect in the little wooden box was never seen by my audience because of the limitations. Interchangeable billets make this prop MUCH more versatile. (I saw a post somewhere about someone using it for Newsworthy!!! I'm honored! And how awesome is that!) Who knows what effects you may purchase in the future that can be used with this!

Regarding the price: As many of you know I create most of my own magic, I have played with so many different ideas for a similar prop, so many hours put in, I've spent 10 times the amount in time and effort, probably 100 times working on similar ideas. The LB cost is a fraction of what I've already spent in effort and time, and my time is valuable.

As far as the DVD goes Bob leaves out NOTHING! I was surprised at the amount of tips and info he provides. from history, to how to do the fold, to angles and timing, psychology etc. All concerns are answered and a less experienced magician should trust Bob's advice and can learn much by listening carefully.

All in all, I really like it! Actually more than I thought I would... As I said I was a little reluctant to even offer to post a review, I was afraid of what I thought might be problems. And Bob was so gracious to feature Q on the video that I felt a little pressure!
I promise you, these opinions of mine are as straight up as I can be.

I guess the only thing I can say about it that isn't high praise, is that I had heard it was a box that "looked" like something common (before seeing it).
Not too sure I can agree with that but it doesn't look so strange as to invite suspicion either!
It looks like a round plastic box! You can give it a purpose, saying whatever you want that it was used for, but when you see really good magic, these over complicated explanations muddy the waters. Keep it simple and all that will be remembered is the effect, which is what we all want. Seriously, who in the world would see a folded card appear and ignore it because they want to know what the box was originally used for or where it came from?

The MB doesn't look like a common object and that's NEVER caused an issue and I'm sure the lightning box will fare the same.

There are SOOOO MANY advantages that LB has to offer, the almost "invisible" minor discrepancy is worth the payoff. It's like trading in a penny for a crisp new hundred dollar bill.

Bravo Bob, Its awesome to have such a great accessory to use with Q, now I have a new favorite way of performing it!

Coz
MJ Marrs
View Profile
Inner circle
Los Angeles
1109 Posts

Profile of MJ Marrs
One of my best buddies is a physician. I was in his office recently and inquired about the cost of one of the pieces of medical equipment which he uses. The amount of money he spent on the apparatus was staggering. Of course I knew that it was money well spent, and I'm sure his patients are very happy that he invested in top-of-the-line "props." I wish more magicians would take the same perspective on our wonderful art.

Even though one doesn't need to go through ten plus years of higher learning at the university level to become a magician, there are working pros (magicians) who spend an equal amount of time and energy learning and honing their craft and working out the details of running a business which supports their family. Magic isn't providing the cure for cancer, but quality entertainment has its place in the grand scheme of things. Finally, while we all know that props (or even effects) don't make the magician, working pros can't afford cheap props. I applaud guys such as Kohler and Solano who put the time and energy to make sure that the products they create are top notch. Thanks guys!
gaffed
View Profile
Inner circle
So far I've managed to gimmick
1818 Posts

Profile of gaffed
Quote:
On 2010-12-22 19:40, MJ Marrs wrote:
One of my best buddies is a physician. I was in his office recently and inquired about the cost of one of the pieces of medical equipment which he uses. The amount of money he spent on the apparatus was staggering. Of course I knew that it was money well spent, and I'm sure his patients are very happy that he invested in top-of-the-line "props." I wish more magicians would take the same perspective on our wonderful art.

Even though one doesn't need to go through ten plus years of higher learning at the university level to become a magician, there are working pros (magicians) who spend an equal amount of time and energy learning and honing their craft and working out the details of running a business which supports their family. Magic isn't providing the cure for cancer, but quality entertainment has its place in the grand scheme of things. Finally, while we all know that props (or even effects) don't make the magician, working pros can't afford cheap props. I applaud guys such as Kohler and Solano who put the time and energy to make sure that the products they create are top notch. Thanks guys!


While I whole heartedly agree with your sentiments on the high cost of quality “props” for a magician, I’m afraid I’ll have to draw the line in your comparison to medical equipment! Comparing the high cost of medical equipment and placing them in the same pigeon hole of “props” as to what a magician uses is a tad overreaching don’t you think? Medical equipment is not “props” by any stretch of the imagination! Smile
"Half this game is ninety percent mental."
~Yogi Berra~

"To one who has faith, no explanation is necessary. To one without faith, no explanation is possible." ~St. Thomas Aquinas~

Twitter"A means of proving how pathetic and lonely you are in 140 characters or less." ~Anonymous~
Douglas Lippert
View Profile
Inner circle
E Pluribus Unum
2339 Posts

Profile of Douglas Lippert
Quote:
On 2010-12-22 20:53, gaffed wrote:

Medical equipment is not “props” by any stretch of the imagination! Smile


They are if they're being used on a movie set. hehe. Smile
Douglas Lippert
Former I.B.M. Ring #8 Secretary
http://www.facebook.com/Doug.Lippert
MJ Marrs
View Profile
Inner circle
Los Angeles
1109 Posts

Profile of MJ Marrs
Quote:
On 2010-12-22 20:53, gaffed wrote:
Quote:
On 2010-12-22 19:40, MJ Marrs wrote:
One of my best buddies is a physician. I was in his office recently and inquired about the cost of one of the pieces of medical equipment which he uses. The amount of money he spent on the apparatus was staggering. Of course I knew that it was money well spent, and I'm sure his patients are very happy that he invested in top-of-the-line "props." I wish more magicians would take the same perspective on our wonderful art.

Even though one doesn't need to go through ten plus years of higher learning at the university level to become a magician, there are working pros (magicians) who spend an equal amount of time and energy learning and honing their craft and working out the details of running a business which supports their family. Magic isn't providing the cure for cancer, but quality entertainment has its place in the grand scheme of things. Finally, while we all know that props (or even effects) don't make the magician, working pros can't afford cheap props. I applaud guys such as Kohler and Solano who put the time and energy to make sure that the products they create are top notch. Thanks guys!


While I whole heartedly agree with your sentiments on the high cost of quality “props” for a magician, I’m afraid I’ll have to draw the line in your comparison to medical equipment! Comparing the high cost of medical equipment and placing them in the same pigeon hole of “props” as to what a magician uses is a tad overreaching don’t you think? Medical equipment is not “props” by any stretch of the imagination! Smile


Hey buddy, of course the comparison is overstretched! That's why "props" was offset in quotes. However, magicians, as a collective fraternity, should look our chosen field with the same mindset that professionals in other disciplines look at their life's work. Doctors, lawyers, engineers, and other professionals don't think twice about investing thousands of dollars on their education or materials which will help them peform well in their field, but magicians complain when they only get five tricks on a thirty dollar DVD! Taking a more serious attitude towards our magic props and all the other behind-the-scences things which go into a magical performance would probably go a long way towards elevating the way magicians are perceived by the mainstream public.

Respectfully,
MJ
edh
View Profile
Inner circle
4698 Posts

Profile of edh
No, MJ. Magicians complain when they get ONE trick on a $30 DVD.
Magic is a vanishing art.
Cosmo Solano
View Profile
Elite user
Colorado
410 Posts

Profile of Cosmo Solano
I think the main point I was trying to make is that the cost of the effect is subject to each of our own personal situations... 'nuff said!

SO! Now that I am also a proud owner of the Lightning Box, lets get back to a discussion of the ideas and use for this thing!

I did it several times over the holidays and "In their hand" is very strong, and provides a ridiculous amount of misdirection for the "discrepancy move" as you pull away and set the box aside. Psychologically you're saying "this box isn't important, what's important is what just got dumped into your hand." And it all plays out perfectly.

No one has yet even mentioned the box which I set down sort of behind me or off to the side on the nearest table.

Awesome reactions!
Xcath1
View Profile
Inner circle
2411 Posts

Profile of Xcath1
Cosmo, what do you mean be "in their hand"?
Cosmo Solano
View Profile
Elite user
Colorado
410 Posts

Profile of Cosmo Solano
Oops sorry I just read my post and realized I wasn't very clear...
Put the box in their hand instead of on a table etc. then when you dump the contents out into their (same) hand the box just gets set aside. Unfortunately the only video I've seen of this was a bootleg video I believe has been removed. I don't want to promote that so I won't say where I saw it!
Bob Kohler
View Profile
Special user
703 Posts

Profile of Bob Kohler
Happy New Year!
www.bobkohlermagic.com

Home of the BK Pro Line
Bob Kohler
View Profile
Special user
703 Posts

Profile of Bob Kohler
I've recently had a couple of folks ask me about switching the objects inside of the box during a show. For instance starting with a signed card to box routine then later in the show using a billet or money.
It is totally possible but you have to work out the details of the way you work and your situation.

First you may want to consider using a different type of adhesive. Double stick tape is pretty strong. You may want to try using Blu-Tac or one of the soft putty type adhesives. I think they are a little easier to remove.

I personally use an old doctor's bag to hold my show. It's pretty easy to do the first routine, put the Lightning Box away and while I'm getting other props out I have quite a bit of time and reason to simply remove the card and put in the billet or money. It's very easy, just work out a simple choreography.

Used this way the Lightning Box can actually become a thread that runs through your show.

Another idea I've used is this. I made a solid Lightning Box. During the show I perform a watch steal and load it into the solid bottom. After the routine for the signed card I switch boxes and put the Lightning Box with the watch inside in plain sight. Much later I reveal the watch is gone and have the spectator retrieve the watch and open the box. Pretty strong stuff...
www.bobkohlermagic.com

Home of the BK Pro Line
Cosmo Solano
View Profile
Elite user
Colorado
410 Posts

Profile of Cosmo Solano
Okay so get to work making some solid boxes to switch out already that we can purchase! Smile
Wizard of Oz
View Profile
Inner circle
Most people wish I didn't have
5292 Posts

Profile of Wizard of Oz
Bad news for Bob, but good news for me... I just purchased a slightly used Lightning Box right here on The Café... but not from Bob. (Sorry Bob...no offense).
Great news for Bob, and great news for me... this thing is frickin' awesome.

I love the way it looks, as you can play it down as something utilitarian, or play it up as something mysterious and dark. A perfect design in my opinion.
I love the way it handles. Just the right size. Just the right weight.
But most of all, I love the advancements this prop makes possible to this now classic effect. Showing the box empty first...genius. Being able to toss another object into your hand along with the card, billet etc....genius.

Basically, this effect is great news for all of us.

Oh, on a side note, because I purchased this used, the special something in a tube from Japan was not included. Bob, I looked on your site and couldn't find how to buy a tube. Can I buy one from you? Or, can you send me info on where I can?
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.
rowland
View Profile
Inner circle
1316 Posts

Profile of rowland
I don't think you get a special something in a tube from Japan. I certainly didn't with mine.
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Latest and Greatest? » » Bob Kohler's Lightning Box (0 Likes)
 Go to page [Previous]  1~2~3..9~10~11~12 [Next]
X
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2020 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.26 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL