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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » Woman Executed (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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LobowolfXXX
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Ah, the ol' reliable capital punishment thread.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
Dannydoyle
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I am shocked it is still here.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
MagicSanta
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I am in favor of women who have their husbands killed executed.
Ray Tupper.
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Quote:
On 2010-09-24 13:36, gdw wrote:
Quote:
On 2010-09-24 13:06, Ray Tupper. wrote:
At an earlier behind closed doors trial,judge Teresa Lewis,meted out the death penalty to two innocent people.
Apparently she wholeheartedly agreed with the death penalty.Even when no crime was committed.


Yeah, so that makes it ok to do it to her? Do we really base our morality on what others do and think?

No "we" don't.
Which is why I don't base my morals on what "you" think and "you" do.
To each his own.
Living and dying and swords and such.
Ray.
What do we want?
A cure for tourettes!
When do we want it?
C*nt!
MickeyPainless
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Quote:
On 2010-09-25 03:02, critter wrote:
I'd like to know how borderline she is.


WAS!
LobowolfXXX
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Current chance of recidivism: 0.00%
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
magicfish
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Quote:
On 2010-09-25 01:42, Brian Proctor wrote:
She had it coming. Her peers decided she was wicked enough to have her life snuffed like she had her family members. You don't want to be executed, don't have your family killed.

Hear hear.
Markymark
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Problem is the death penalty does'nt seem to work!
It should do but it does'nt seem to stop a criminal determined to kill.
And if Iran and China do it maybe we should'nt!

[Anyone hear about the Linda Carty case?]
''In memory of a once fluid man,crammed and distorted by the classical mess'' -Bruce Lee
rossmacrae
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I despise capital punishment.

She deserved it.

Read all the details of her crime and see why.
tommy
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The old art of having someone killed by ones servant, which leaves the master free from prosecution, is an art she obviously did not practice very well.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On 2010-09-26 06:37, Markymark wrote:
Problem is the death penalty does'nt seem to work!
It should do but it does'nt seem to stop a criminal determined to kill.
And if Iran and China do it maybe we should'nt!

[Anyone hear about the Linda Carty case?]


Not to pick nits, but this is absolutely wrong. I don't care how determined John Wayne Gacey is to kill, he will not do it any more. As Lobo points out above with his post.

In fact the best thing that it DOES is to stop people from killing again. I am not making an arguement for or against mind you, but to say it does not work is just wrong. To say it may not stop someone ELSE from killing is probably true.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
silverking
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Life in prison with no chance of parole also stops killers from killing again......the state doesn't have to kill them in order to stop them.......there is a second choice available.

But oh that revenge tastes sweet.

Regardless of my personal opinion, I live in a country where the death penalty has been abolished for a few decades now.......and for the most part, we don't miss it.
There's always some case (usually involving kids) where folks go into revenge mode, and wish the death penalty could be brought back for just this one case.......but overall, nobody really pines for its return.

I think the argument goes somewhat off the rails when folks try to balance the concept of somebody doing something horrible to somebody else, and therefore must formally have something horrible done to them...........with the possibility of making an error, and executing an innocent person.

Folks do realize (don't they) that there have been quite a few "mistaken" executions?
Folks proven innocent, after they've had the government murder them in cold blood.

Aside from the somewhat distasteful concept of formalizing the murder of another human being,
the lingering possibility that innocent people could be (and have been) executed seems to indicate that the process is flawed enough to suggest ending it.

Of course abolishment of the death penalty won't happen in the States, there's no support for the concept.
Alluded to above, places like Texas simply accept the risk of killing an innocent person along with the many guilty ones they kill each year as part of the cost of doing business.

I guess the bottom line is, as long as judges are human, and prone to errors.......and as long as juries can only render their best guess in light of the evidence presented for a conviction..........it will remain a fatally flawed (and fatal) system of justice.
Dannydoyle
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I am not sure I know that a person who should not have been executed has been. I hear the claim made, but I never see it backed up.

I do know that life in prison will stop people from killing. No doubt. I am sorry if I implied otherwise. I certainly did not mean to. I was simply saying that the idea of it not being a way to stop someone from killing was just wrong.

I am not certain it is the job of a government to kill its constituants. Yes the process is flawed. It must be for it is administered by human beings. This is also a pretty good arguement against it.

I don't want to take a hard fast position either way but this is definately a case where each side seems to have a point.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
silverking
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Danny, I have an opinion like most.........but don't have any answers.

In my neck of the woods we've had this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clifford_Olson

and more recently, this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Pickton

If you were to ask me, I (like most folks here on the Coast) would say quite clearly that both men deserve to be executed.........I'd pull the handle for either of them.

Of course.........I've just rebutted my entire post above.

No easy answers to be found within this topic.
Woland
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Life in prison will not stop a murderer from killing . . . in prison. And "life in prison" rarely means just that anymore. Now that the Europeans have ended capital punishment, there is a group started up in France agitating to end life imprisonment as too cruel . . . Honestly there are people who think that the criminals are the victims and that their victims somehow deserved to be victimized . . . It seems to me that failing to execute deliberate, first-degree murderers shows disrespect of the lives of their victims . . . Capital punishment is not really punishment, and it is certainly not revenge . . . When the community accepts responsibility to remove from this world a first-degree murderer, the traditional cycle of revenge is short-circuited . . .

The apparent leniency towards crime that we see in Scandinavia seems to me to be an interesting outgrowth of their traditional law . . . if you read the Icelandic Sagas, now available in an excellent Penguin translation, you can see how a society evolved without written laws and without any government at all . . . murders were committed, and every summer a gathering of all of the people was held, called the Thing . . . at the thing, both parties to the dispute would argue their cases, and the elders and leaders of the people would make a decision . . . often decided on the basis of which side in the dispute could muster the most powerful support . . . in any event, the punishment for murder was outlawry, meaning that the "convicted" man was given a chance to get out of the country and go somewhere else . . . with the provision that if he overstayed his preparation-time, anyone could kill him, plunder his possessions, and there would be no retribution . . . Reading the Sagas gives the impression of a violent culture dominated by willful men who were trained to be irascible from an early age . . . and yet I think Iceland has evolved, after 1,000 years of Christianity perhaps, into a rather nonviolent place where major violent crime is practically unknown . . .

Woland
tommy
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Yes all criminals should be executed for any crime whatsoever especially those who do not seem to love the dear leader for they are the scum of the earth.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
Woland
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Well, Tommy, that's how the socialists usually play it, but that's not what most of the folks here are talking about. The case that prompted this discussion was not "any crime whatsoever," nor failing to "love the dear leader," but recruiting with money and sexual favors two villains to carry out the cold-blooded, premeditated murder of her husband and his son. Which most folks here, even if they object to the death penalty, recognize to be a truly heinous crime. You don't see it that way?

Woland
balducci
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Quote:
On 2010-09-26 13:46, Woland wrote:

yet I think Iceland has evolved, after 1,000 years of Christianity perhaps, into a rather nonviolent place where major violent crime is practically unknown . . .

Woland

Perhaps. Then again, the woman who was executed being discussed in this thread was a devout Christian who attended Church services two nights a week.

So perhaps the nonviolence in Iceland has more to do with Iceland's relatively homogeneous population? Or its strict gun laws? Or its socialist traditions / institutions?
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
Woland
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Balducci,

The evolution of the Icelandic character is an interesting phenomenon that may admit many interpretations. It probably took a long time. One factor was the imposition of an actual government, first by the Danes, and then by the Norwegians, if I am not mistaken. There may be many reasons.

That being said, I'm not aware that the imposition of socialism has reduced violence and criminality anywhere else in the world.

Respectfully submitted,

Woland
balducci
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Quote:
On 2010-09-26 16:27, Woland wrote:
Balducci,

The evolution of the Icelandic character is an interesting phenomenon that may admit many interpretations. It probably took a long time. One factor was the imposition of an actual government, first by the Danes, and then by the Norwegians, if I am not mistaken. There may be many reasons.

That being said, I'm not aware that the imposition of socialism has reduced violence and criminality anywhere else in the world.

Respectfully submitted,

Woland

A number of countries with socialist traditions and institutions have remarkably low levels of violence. E.g., Canada.

However, I think that "imposition of socialism" (your words) is something different than what I mentioned, i.e., a country freely electing to have some socialist traditions / institutions.

I do agree with your larger point that there are many interpretations and reasons as to why Iceland evolved as it did. Indeed, that is why I cited several other possible explanations, as you mentioned only the one in your earlier post.
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
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