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IAIN
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Though, you'd have hoped the booker of the hypno-sheep would check to see what kind of act they had if it was a family pub? you wouldnt book chubby brown to open a children's sports day would you...

meh...this is why, despite my interest in hypnosis - I've just never taken that final step...i'll stick to suggestion and just telling lies and faking it I reckon...
I've asked to be banned
Anthony Jacquin
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Quote:
On 2010-10-01 07:17, mindpunisher wrote:
Show me one letter from a council that says its ok to do street hypnosis withut a license?


I have exactly that letter from a major council. I will show Bobser when I next see him. Somehow I suspect that will not shut you up.

Anthony
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Shrubsole
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Quote:
On 2010-10-01 18:09, IAIN wrote:
Though, you'd have hoped the booker of the hypno-sheep would check to see what kind of act they had if it was a family pub? you wouldnt book chubby brown to open a children's sports day would you...


Exactly! The landlord of the family pub should not book acts of an adult nature and/or explain clearly to anyone being booked that it is a family pub (whatever one of those is) and that no adult material is acceptable. That is their job and to see that it is carried out.

Kids in restaurants (especially chain ones) is one thing but in a adult environment like a pub they should never be. That however still makes it the responsibility of the parent and/or owner, and not the acts.
Winner of the Dumbringer Award for total incompetence. (All years)
bobser
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Okay, I didn't want to go here, but, since MP has brought it up, let's get it over;
The hypnotist is a member of The Café. It was an adult evening in Hampshire and had been advertised as such. A couple entered from far left of the lounge just as the hypnotist took to the stage. They had been travelling and wanted something to eat. The landlord explained what was going on and that while legally it was okay it would be better for the two kids (girls aged about 8-9 ish) if they left. The mother said that she'd keep they're backs away and argued that from there they wouldn't see too much anyway and that they (mum & dad) would quite like to see the show. The landlord said "ok". The show started and suddenly the father decided to volunteer....
Later I asked him why he would want to do that and as crazy as it sounds he said to me: "I didn't want my wife to volunteer so I said I would in order to stop her from volunteering" (go figure).
So we discover he's a natural somnambulist and yes he ends up with a plastic sheep.
Yes the hypnotist carried on, arguably doing what he was hired and paid and licensed and insured to do.
The girls looked over they're shoulder and when they saw their father 'dancing' with the sheep and heard some of the comments from the drunks in the crowd they got upset and their mother took them out to the car park.
Personally I was kind of horrified but, although I might not have done it myself I can understand the performer continuing. His argument was that he suggested that the guy "do what comes naturally to you" with the sheep.
But the point I would make is that this story doesn't have a lot to do with the heading of this thread. Having said that I don't think anything else has either.
From now on I'm only going to talk to hypnotists doing hypnosis. Whether that be therapy, stage, impromptu or street. I personally don't care and find discussions in here about licensing and insurance extremely boring. Actually I think everyone else (well nearly) in here feels precisely the same.
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
catweazle
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Really this thread should be titled ' health and safety risk assessment advice for stage hypnosis performances' not 'dangers of hypnosis'

bad parenting is probably best left with other forums, I cant see how the hypnotist should take any blame for the supposed upset.
mindpunisher
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Quote:
On 2010-10-02 11:30, Shrubsole wrote:
Quote:
On 2010-10-01 18:09, IAIN wrote:
Though, you'd have hoped the booker of the hypno-sheep would check to see what kind of act they had if it was a family pub? you wouldnt book chubby brown to open a children's sports day would you...


Exactly! The landlord of the family pub should not book acts of an adult nature and/or explain clearly to anyone being booked that it is a family pub (whatever one of those is) and that no adult material is acceptable. That is their job and to see that it is carried out.

Kids in restaurants (especially chain ones) is one thing but in a adult environment like a pub they should never be. That however still makes it the responsibility of the parent and/or owner, and not the acts.


When it comes to licensing hypnosis shows both the performer and the venue get vetted and are given guidlines. Its not just for the hypnotist.
mindpunisher
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Bobser you told me he wasn't insured or licensed? If it had been then there is a good chance the pub owner would've had a more responsable attitude to the show. But then perhaps I picked you up wrong.

Catweazle: health and safety are put in place because there are dangers.

There are hypnotist who do believe they don't need insurance or comply with the law. Its up to them if they want to take that risk. But I feel newbies with little or no training should know about the risks then its up to them what they do.

But to deny the risks exist is just plain stupid. And if your selling a product and not making it clear or blatantly denying there may be risks then to me that's criminal. Its either money or just plain ignorance or perhaps a bit of both that would motivate someone to do such a thing.
catweazle
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Yes I know, but they are just health and safety dangers relating to stage hypnosis, which is a concern and should be addressed professionally within that context and I'm all for threads like this,for the benefit of knowledge.
It really is no different to risk assessment of any activity at the end of the day, and that's how the powers that be view it.
health and safety in the workplace is no different, take a look here http://www.hse.gov.uk/risk/fivesteps.htm

Its not rocket science, and most people with a thoughtful nature and a bit of life experience can easily grasp it.
I work in an industry that has recently been regulated, I can assure you that the cons outweigh the pros, if you believe hypnosis is an art, keep it that way otherwise you may find yourself out of a job if your not into forced academic study, and high expenses.
mindpunisher
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I was pushed out of a job because of the problems regarding unsafe hypnotists. that's what screwed up the industry in the UK in the first place...if it had been better regulated that may not have happened.

But you won't find screwups from your job all over the news and on tv. I can assure the powers that be and the media over here view things a lot differently.

You are with respect comparing apples with oranges.
catweazle
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Quote:
On 2010-10-02 14:03, mindpunisher wrote:

But you won't find screwups from your job all over the news and on tv. I can assure the powers that be and the media over here view things a lot differently.




Actually you are quite wrong on that point, screw ups from my profession ( as it now is) do get in the media, and cause grief for all, I have had to fight for my job and so I can relate to some degree and probably more than you'd think.
BTW I am 'over here' assuming you mean the uk.
I would gladly tell you more in person, this forum and thread is not the place.
I agree with you on the risk assessment, just pointing out that you will be better off if you keep things simple.
catweazle
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Talking about sheep http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Q_4knWAPak

My 7 year old daughter just watched it and was quite mortified, now who's fault is that?

Ban YouTube and the irresponsible people that put adult content on show for all?

Or is it my fault for my lack of foresight as a parent in letting her watch?
mindpunisher
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Well you shouldn't volunteer should you? Then months later show your daughter...
catweazle
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Smile
O.K put you get my point.
mindpunisher
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Not really I don't see any 7 years olds in the audience? ID was checked and under 18s were turned away. And I could be wrong but were you one of those on the stage? If so I want to thank you for the great work you did.

Plus if what you said were true I would want to know what else you showed your daughter online?

Although I agree that the parents have some responsability the hypnotist should've stopped when he realised what was happening. And that the young children were watching their dad. They shouldn't have been admited in the first place with kids.
catweazle
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The point is you have put up that video with no warnings about adult content, yet at the same time your condemning a fellow performer that accidentally found himself in a 'situation' through the actions of unthinking parents.

If the government started to get into hypnosis with all claws the chances are you would not want to jump through the hoops they would impose, In fact due to the field I work in there would be more chance of me being allowed to perform hypnosis than you, as you have previously stated that you are not into 'academia'.

Keep it art, keep your job, keep it simple.
mindpunisher
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Youve lost me...

I do climb through the hoops the goverment does impose. It took me over a month to get the license. Even then in the final few hours before the show we had to allow them in to check the stage had been set up properly, the seats were safe and that there was provision for wheelchair access etc etc etc. Bare in mind this venue does at least four five shows every week and NEVER has to go through all this. It is only because it was a hypnosis show. You see the council want to cover their asses too. They recognise the risks and dangers to them if they don't.

As for the kids...
You really have no idea. But you seem to forget my main point. It wasn't that it was adult content. It was that the kids were very distressed at seeing their father. That puts a whole different slant on it. They were hysterical because it was their dad. They were too young to understand the adult content just that something was wrong. They feared for their dad.

It just goes to show

a) you haven't done big venues ( if any at all)so you don't know what hoops must be jumped through. Even getting the insurance I had to jump through hoops that took me two months..

b)You don't really understand the sutuation and the kids. It wasn't the adult content - they were to young to understand it. It was clear to everyone including the hypnotist that the kids were distressed but he continued. According to the story I heard. It was the fact he carried on that bothers me.

Now before you go on about how much you know about the hypnosis industry go o ut and do a few shows preferably high profile ones. Then I will value your opinion. Better still work through a period where there has been anti media stories in the press. Go through the stress then you might have something of value to say.

Until then like most on here you open your mouth and talk out of your backside with no idea. You should be thankful that there is somebody here with experiencwe willing to share it for free.
catweazle
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Quote:
On 2010-10-02 16:09, mindpunisher wrote:
You should be thankful that there is somebody here with experiencwe willing to share it for free.


I am, its just you seem very insular in your opinions and very quick to be offensive, as I have previously mentioned I have jumped through many hoops for my job, pm me, ill give you my phone number and I will explain the last 4 years of my life that involve regulation and scaremongering.

at the moment you may think that your doing a good job of informing people about the dangers of hypnosis, all your really doing is alienating yourself from everyone here.
it may of worked to some degree financially for royal, but there's no room for two.

BTW I have 'performed' using all the NLP/hypnosis skills I possess in the highest arena the uk has, just not quite in the same context as you. I was in fact very successful and am quite famous/infamous within certain circles of my profession.
IAIN
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I remember you catweazle, you were great at wrestling...ea-SAY! ea-SAY! ea-SAY!

kendo makasaki was my favourite though...
I've asked to be banned
catweazle
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Big Daddy, Giant haystacks, those were the days
mindpunisher
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Again it just goes to show you know nothing about the stage hypnosis industry if you compare it with NLP. You have never been through the process of applying for a license or stage hypnosis insurance for a centre of town theatre or any other venue. And you have no idea of the real risks and dangers involved or how the media work. Unfortunately some poor idiot is likely to find out the hard way.
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