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Christian & Katalina Elite user 407 Posts |
The other night while performing at a college, the person who booked us asked if someone in the audience was with us. Puzzled by the question we said no.. but why would she ask. She said that someone had been videoing the entire show and were acting suspiciously while doing it.
She had thought that they were with us and that is how we were getting our information. As it turned out it was another mentalist who was simply trying to tape our show for his own use. We confronted the secret taper during intermission. He denied everything. I did not want this to get ugly…but I did not want him taping our show either. The booker was stunned that someone would do this and told them to stop. When we confronted him he was looking at the video on his I-phone. He got quite indignant and stomped out of the theater. During the second half we saw him sneak back in by a back door to finish his taping. Talk about Gall..!! This is not the first time this has happened but it is the first time that the person was so bold. The booker told us she had seen the movie “The Prestige” and was amazed that this stuff really goes on. The best part of event was sitting with her after the show at a restaurant and seeing her stunned expression and her talking about the movie “The Prestige”. A bizarre night for sure.
Milbourne Christopher Award for Mentalism 2011
The Annemann Award for Menatalism 2016 Author of "Protoplasm" Close-up Mentalism |
parmenion Inner circle Switzerland/Zürich 3988 Posts |
It's happend often to me, except they don't use their iphone to film my show but to watch movie during it.
Yesterday, a guy watched Ben Hur, so my show received 11 Oscars !
“I love talking about nothing. It is the only thing I know anything about.”
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Christian & Katalina Elite user 407 Posts |
Sorry about that Parmenion...of course that will start a whole other thread...lol
so I take it this has not happened to anyone else here?
Milbourne Christopher Award for Mentalism 2011
The Annemann Award for Menatalism 2016 Author of "Protoplasm" Close-up Mentalism |
LukeB Loyal user 294 Posts |
I guess unless you ask people prior not to film,with the proliferation of camera phones its going to happen more and more...Not sure how you new this guy was a mentalist but that sure is gall to keep filming after you've identified him and asked him to stop.
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TonyB2009 Inner circle 5006 Posts |
I have not had a rival tape a show, but I had an idiot climb onto the stage during a hypnosis gig and try to film everything, blocking the action for the audience. I asked him a few times to sit down, but in the end I took his phone and dropped it into a pint of beer. That solved the problem.
A friend of mine, a very talented comedian, has had it happen a couple of times. And some of his very strong material has made its way into other performers acts. The funny thing is that my friend is a part-timer, but some big names have stolen his material. Perhaps because he is not a big enough name to argue the toss.
Check out Tony's new thriller Dead or Alive http://www.amazon.co.uk/Alive-Varrick-Bo......n+carson
http://www.PartyMagic.ie |
AttnPls Special user 554 Posts |
I saw a show just this week and 2 different people sitting near me were texting throughout the entire show. Life must be horrible for these people who are unable to actually live their lives "in the moment". I asked the performer about it after the show and he said that it happens all the time. There was not much you can do about it -- they paid for their seat and it was up to them to pay attention or not. I wish live performers would start setting a precedent insisting that electronics be turned off and, if people do need to turn them on, that they leave the theater to do so. Perhaps mentalists should insist that phones "disrupt the psychic energy in the room" (because they do!).
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Yannou Veteran user 381 Posts |
Some people aren't even embarrassed about copying other people's show. I was present at a convention when a guy walked up to our group and told one of the others that he liked his show so much that he had copied it completely except one part that he did not understand fully and if he could please explain it to him. We just did not know what to say.
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seadog93 Inner circle 3200 Posts |
That is so sad.
"Love is the magician who pulls man out of his own hat" - Ben Hecht
"Love says 'I am everything.' Wisdom says 'I am nothing'. Between the two, my life flows." -Nisargadatta Maharaj Seadog=C-Dawg=C.ou.rtn.ey Kol.b |
chmara Inner circle Tucson, AZ 1911 Posts |
A whole couple of generations has now grown up with tape at home and video cameras shrinking to portable and concealable sizes -- and no education on the ethics of intellectual property development. In the US there is almost a sense of "we should be able to buy everything" in magcians -- and that has quickly devolved into a "steal" parts -- even the wholoe mentality.
Yes there are legal protections -- but they are expensive to enforce. Christian - you may remember the story I shared with you several years ago of my friend that owned a major t-shirt design company. Thast is an industrry that depends upon the cleverness of the design and logo protection (a la Mickey Mouse.) He found his major designs were usually being knocked off within 2-3 WEEKS of his issue -- and the costs of enforcing his copyright and trademark rights would be about equal or in excess of the gross sale aounts he was making on several thousand shirts of each design. His solution was simply to keep issuing new designs faster, finally, than they could be knocked off. He established his BRAND with quality, color and a feel that could not be knocked off. I realize that we have a lot more time in developing an act and can only depend upon replicating the act pretty constantly in person than he did in a flock of t-shirts. And presenting an act with different material each time is well nigh impossible to build a solid reputation. So short of metal detectors and barring recording (big signs-big bouncers) or spending skads of money with attorneys and the legal system -- modern technology has not been defeated in its use by knock off artists. Sure, they still have to figure methods -- but comic material and our "patter" even if copyrighted is often ripped directly from performances by us Friday to be parroted at a Country Club show (Badly) on Saturday by the thief. TV killed vaudeville because hard worked acts were presented to too wide a national audience too often -- and too many acts had one set. They also had not hired writers and developers (as you have) to constantly update and change. It is dubious that Copperfield made money (directly) on his TV specials, but they promoted his road tours. His contracts with his staff and restrictrions on audience backstage visits are legendary -- and I am sure people today who try to phone record, etc. are asked to leave or check their instrument. My thought is that you are at the level you need to get serious about security -- with the miscreant being able to sneak back in -- being very telling.
Gregg (C. H. Mara) Chmara
Commercial Operations, LLC Tucson, AZ C. H. Mara Illusion & Psychic Entertainments |
TonyB2009 Inner circle 5006 Posts |
At a convention a few years ago all the talk was about a mentalist who was going to do an hour long show. Most of the show was good (and I have seen the same guy do brilliant stuff). But in the middle he did a bank night routine that was word for word Richard Orsterlind's. I would love to see Richard live, but I don't want to watch an immitation.
Check out Tony's new thriller Dead or Alive http://www.amazon.co.uk/Alive-Varrick-Bo......n+carson
http://www.PartyMagic.ie |
wanda&viktor New user France 84 Posts |
We had the same experience two years ago, a French Mentalist recorded all our show but we was not aware of that immediatly. He was somebody we kneew and we had a big problem with this. Why did he this ? he said it was just for fun...
French Mind reading and mentalism act.
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funsway Inner circle old things in new ways - new things in old ways 9982 Posts |
I am distrubed that the "sense of entitlement" extends this far, but I think it is rude for someone to interupt a conversation to answer a cell-phone. Yet this practice will continue unless every person decides not to allow it in their business, lecture, class, etc.
when I worked in a testing center a couple of years ago it was clearly posted that cell phones were not allowed inside. "Signing in" on the log sheet affirmed a contractual agreement not to cheat, inluding possession of a cell-phone. Yet, regularly I had to confiscate a cell-phone from a student. This finally stopped when I would pretend to take a cell phone from a student at the begining of a test and smash it with hammer. Thus, you may not be able to change the attitude of those thinking that buying a camera gives them a licence to invade, but you can control the physical camera -- if you are willing to do so.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst
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Colin Inner circle Las Vegas 1355 Posts |
One of the things I absolutely hate most within mentalism and magic (and comedy) is how much people STEAL other people's material.
I've been to shows before where the performer on stage has been using my material not realizing I was in the audience until it was too late for them to stop telling the joke and it made it quite awkward for them and everyone watching, because they realized they'd just been caught. I've heard people tell Derren's jokes word for word. It's just not on! For our art to move forward, we have a responsibility to be original. Learning a trick is only one part and to be honest, it's a very small part. The harder part is how you then present it! Just because this is the harder part does not give anyone the right to just rip off someone else! It's quite sickening!!! If I spend months and months honing a presentation, there is no way I am at all happy with someone else coming in and just STEALING it. It is simply not good enough! If you want to performer in front of an audience, you have a responsibility to your audience, other performers and most importantly yourself to make sure what you present is your own material. I'd quite happily be up for naming and shaming every single person who does this, because we've got to learn that as long as we're stealing from each other, we're not moving forward, if anything we're moving backwards! It's time for people to start recognizing that to deserve to stand up on staage in front of an audience takes hard word. It can't be justified simply by ripping someone else off to get you there quicker. It is totally unacceptable! Rant over Col
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Euan4 Regular user Scotland 147 Posts |
Some of these stories are worrying! Christian that guy had quite the nerve, its something that doesn't seem to have much of a solution at the moment sadly! and I completely agree with Colin, writing material, especially jokes, is a hard process. It is not acceptable for someone just to copy you and put no effort into the show themselves.
One way to look at it is that this person stealing other peoples shows will no doubt not be able to make a good living doing his show because people will want original material, not something they heard derren say on TV.
Silence is golden, but duct tape is silver.
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Decomposed Eternal Order High Desert 12059 Posts |
I see people recording and texting every performance these days. It use to stand out to me, now I just keep going. I have no clue if they are trying to backtrack and use material or not. The good side is I try to be as clever as possible in "masking" what I am doing.
Decomp
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funsway Inner circle old things in new ways - new things in old ways 9982 Posts |
And the sign reads,
"Purchase of a ticket for any performance of Whimpy the Great, or presentation of such ticket for admission, constitutes an agree by the user not to bring any communication or recording device to the performance; and furthermore, that an any such device will be a free and voluntary contribution to Whimpy for his own use. The user agrees to surrender possession and ownership of any such device upon request to include any and all informations stored on such device. Prefessional persons requiring such a device during the performance may apply for an exception in writing prior to the day of the performance, but no exception may be assumed because of common practice or personal desire." NOTICE: ALL CELL PHONES, CAMERAS and RECORDING DEVICES WILL BE CONFISCATED WITHOUT COMPENSATION OR REDRESS.
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst
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