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Dannydoyle
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Ok. Let me just say that I do not think you know enough to try to make the point you are attempting to make. I would do a bit more research if I were you.

I thought you had at least some sort of background, some sort of hands on experience. I forgot I was on the Magic Café' for a minute sorry.

Seriously research research research, at least I read that somewhere. You have a nodding aquaintance with what you are trying to put forth. Not enough to make the grand pronouncements you are trying to make.

The thing about the human mind is THERE IS NO EASY WAY TO LEARN. You are messing about someones brain box, it should be tough to learn.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
kissdadookie
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Quote:
On 2010-11-30 15:09, Dannydoyle wrote:
Ok. Let me just say that I do not think you know enough to try to make the point you are attempting to make. I would do a bit more research if I were you.

I thought you had at least some sort of background, some sort of hands on experience. I forgot I was on the Magic Café' for a minute sorry.

Seriously research research research, at least I read that somewhere. You have a nodding aquaintance with what you are trying to put forth. Not enough to make the grand pronouncements you are trying to make.

The thing about the human mind is THERE IS NO EASY WAY TO LEARN. You are messing about someones brain box, it should be tough to learn.


Fair enough. Hands on experience? Again, we're talking about hypnosis in general, this thread was never about stage hypnosis. Are you saying that to understand hypnosis one must be a stage hypnotist or a hypno therapist? That's apparently what it sounds like. For a person who doesn't believe in beliefs, that's a very very very limited point of view is it not? Being a pro at stage hypnosis, what does that really mean at the end of the day? It really just shows that one is experienced at handling that specific kind of situation. Does it really mean that the person is any good at hypnotizing in other situations? No. The few stage hypnotists I know are quite reluctant to demonstrate hypnosis under fire (aka when being asked on the spot to hypnotize people), and they are not reluctant due to liability concerns or ethics, they became reluctant because they were put on the spot and taken out of their element. So I don't think that what you consider to be hands on experience really means much in the real world or equates to proficiency at hypnosis or understanding of hypnosis.
Dannydoyle
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Well now you show just how childish you can be LOL.

My "real world" is simply the stage. No I do not just demonstrate it and it is not because of liability, but because the show I do is theatrical in concept. It does not mean I can't do it in stupid social situations, it means I choose not too. Are you old enough to know the difference? I won't be challenged into some silly demonstration at a party like some sort of trained seal. I certainly can do those things, I choose not to do them.

Wow you have really shown me a lot about where your posts are coming from. Thank you.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
kissdadookie
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Quote:
On 2010-11-30 16:08, Dannydoyle wrote:
Well now you show just how childish you can be LOL.

My "real world" is simply the stage. No I do not just demonstrate it and it is not because of liability, but because the show I do is theatrical in concept. It does not mean I can't do it in stupid social situations, it means I choose not too. Are you old enough to know the difference? I won't be challenged into some silly demonstration at a party like some sort of trained seal. I certainly can do those things, I choose not to do them.

Wow you have really shown me a lot about where your posts are coming from. Thank you.


I give an example and again, you twist my words for your own agenda. Wow. Read and comprehend much?
Dannydoyle
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Oh and would you please show me where I said "I don't believe in beliefs". I can't manage to find it.

As I keep telling you WORDS MEAN THINGS.

Two more questions. How old are you and how long have you been involved in the "study" of hypnosis?
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
kissdadookie
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Wow, twisting my words again. I can only base my views of your beliefs and what not on what you've posted. You clearly do not believe that a performer's beliefs plays much in their actions. Look, the fact that you clearly said early on that for a magician to believe the coin is being placed in the other hand or not to not have any effect on the magician's actions shows just how far off base you are.
Dannydoyle
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Well just to put it out there, I am 20 years into this, and for the past 15 have been doing an average of about 4-6 shows a week. Yea you pick up a thing or two on the way to 5,000 or so shows.

So give me all the "read and comprehend" sarcastic nonsense all you like. I think your view of things might be a bit skewed in that you have been at this for about 15 minutes.

I worked Schulien's for 10 years and guess what? Charlie Schulien and not even one of the guys who worked there actually BELIEVED they were doing magic. They never thought the coin was in the hand. Better than 200 years of experience all tolled and not one of them was that delusional. Guess they were as misguided as I am.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
kissdadookie
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Wow, see, here's the problem. You're not comprehending what I mean when I said "believe." Of course I'm not saying to believe that the coin is really there. All I'm saying is that if you pretend it's there, your actions will end up looking more natural. OF COURSE THE DARN COIN ISN'T REALLY THERE! Imagining it being there however has an impact on how your perform the false put. In turn, if you don't believe in what you are doing, it's going to show. If you try to get a hypnotic phenomenon going believing that it's not going to work or if you have doubts about it, IT'S GOING TO SHOW! At the minimum it's going to affect your confidence which in turns creates doubt in your mind which in turn may negatively impact what you are doing.

I'm just giving examples, it may apply to some and not apply to others. Everybody is different, I'm acknowledging that. You're obviously on the "it's one way and one way only" bandwagon.
Dannydoyle
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Now you have moved from 'BELIEVING' the coin is there to the "power of positive thinking". LOL.

(words mean things remember Mr. Hypnosis?)

Oh wait I have a crazy idea. You know how we used to do it back in the day? We used to something we called ACTING! I suppose you are aspousing "method acting" or what not. But the fact is that if you do your show with confidence, that spills over to the audience. BELIEF has NOTHING TO DO WITH IT! You don't "believe" you will do a good show, you have practiced, and rehearsed, and you know full well you will do a good show. Heck that is BETTER than belief.

Again my sincere suggestion is more research.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
kissdadookie
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Ok sir, you have the biggest swinging... bat in the room. Happy? After all, that's all this was really about wasn't it? Hail to the man with experience and ego.

In all seriousness though, I truly think that we're not really disagreeing with each other here, more of a misunderstanding. Nonetheless, you come off as a bit insulting so, that's that.
Dannydoyle
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Sure since you can't make a point, yea that was what it was all about LOL. Never step back and learn.

Just because you can't figure out the difference in the word "believe" and the phrase "act as if" don't lay that at my doorstep. Then you preach it as gospel. If that is insulting then Franklin was right.

"The sting an any rebuke is the truth".

Your big revelation after hours of experience is to ACT as if the coin is in the hand? Wow no wonder I ALWAYS get busted. I have my hand wide open and show them I didn't really transfer it. I bet it looks more magical your way. Come on.

Yea don't walk on stage and say "not sure this will work but lets give it a try". Insightful.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
kissdadookie
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I'm still waiting for you to DISPROVE any of the points I made in this thread. You have still yet to prove anything aside from a clear indication that you completely misunderstood the points I was making. I've explained my points in a variety of different ways at this point, none of which you have been able to disprove yet you're still going at it? What exactly is your malfunction?
mindpunisher
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The whole thing about this Kissie and most of the people on this forum is that their views are based upon very little experience. ( including some of those they buy cheap products from and deem as experts when in truth they are only a few steps ahead of them ) No one here has to prove or disprove anything. You are in the company of very very experienced hypnotists. Instead of actually appreciating that position you don't listen and you believe you have something worthwhile to say when you haven't.

That sadly is your malfunction and why you probably won't ever go beyond being a hack when it comes to hypnosis. Or worse a street hypnotist.
kissdadookie
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And with that ladies and gentleman, is that. Let's give MP a round of applause for being his usual self and Danny a slap in the back for swinging hard for the fences Smile
Dannydoyle
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Sorry kiddo. Your insight is hypnosis 101 and has been for better than a century. Nobody can disprove, "act like you are confident" any more than they can disprove the theory of gravity.

I have PROVEN you have relatively little knowlege and almost no experience. What else would you like PROVEN? Seems to me that is enough.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
kissdadookie
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Quote:
On 2010-11-30 21:21, Dannydoyle wrote:
Sorry kiddo. Your insight is hypnosis 101 and has been for better than a century. Nobody can disprove, "act like you are confident" any more than they can disprove the theory of gravity.

I have PROVEN you have relatively little knowlege and almost no experience. What else would you like PROVEN? Seems to me that is enough.


It's ridiculous how you basically tried to slam me even though nothing I said could really be proven or disproven. That was my intent in the beginning. I purposely left things relatively general, yet you come on here with your snide remarks. Was I ever here jumping up and down saying "I'm right I'm right! Listen to me don't listen to others!" No, I did not. You on the other hand not only pointed out pretty much NOTHING after all of this apart from "I have experience, you have none (according to you). So there." What the heck was the point of that? It's not educational. It's not beneficial. The whole goal in the end appears to be you trying to put me down for no reason other than to put me down, yet you are alleging that I am a child? Yeah, good one.
mindpunisher
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Merry xmas!
Dannydoyle
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Ok one more time. I have DISPROVEN it is about belief. I have PROVEN you have no experience and little knowledge.

Your whole idea of "believe the coin is in the hand" is hogwash. I proved that. So go on keep trying to talk about anything you like but as it stands you have proven everything to us you need to.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
kissdadookie
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When the heck did I ever say that belief only entails that you have to believe in one of the theories of hypnosis? All I ever pointed out was that if you believe that hypnosis isn't really hypnosis and is something else and that helps you along, go for it. In other words, don't let conflicting ideas you read on the forums or what not prevent you from achieving what you are trying to achieve with this stuff. It is you Danny who has constantly twisted my intentions and my meanings. In the end, you have proven NOTHING apart from the fact that you just came on here to argue for the sake of arguing and putting a stranger down. Pointless really.
Dannydoyle
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Oh I also proved you have no experience litle knowledge and lots of opinions.

Since you are obviously a last word sort of child and I don't want this to go on endlessly, please have your last word.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
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