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DaiMagic
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Hi folks, I am fairly new to hypnosis and recently hypnotised a few friends and although 90% went well there were a couple of problems. First was that 1 person who failed to go under completely, afterwords complained of having a splitting sore head, could this be due to anything I had done?. Second problem was a little more worrying. One friend went under perfectly, and after giving a few testing suggestions, I told her she would completely forget her partner she would not know who he was or why he was here, this was ok to start with as she had no idea who he was however as people started asking her questions i.e who is he?, he came with you, do you not know him? she started to get freaked out, I tried to put her back under to remove the suggestion but she would not go, I calmed her down took her to another room where she went back under and I brought her back out properly, afterwords she felt fine. The main worry for me was the fact when I told her to sleep she didn't respond properly. Obviously I want to avoid this happening again and as I have only hypnotised a hand full of people any advice from the more seasoned performers would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
Owen Mc Ginty
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Add the suggestion of how you would like the subject to react. i.e. you wont know this person, you will not be alarmed or upset in any way, but you will find it very puzzling...etc etc.

As well as the phenomenon you want to elicit, if you add details on what reaction you´d like you may be able to avoid people freaking out.
Also, add a "re-induction" suggestion i.e. when I touch you on the shoulder and say sleep you will return to this pleasant, relaxing deep state blah blah blah.

Just my thoughts, although you´ll get more answers on here shortly I´d imagine. Smile
If you never fail, you're not trying hard enough.
quicknotist
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Headache - Depends what you did. You say they failed to go under completely. What does that mean?
Even if you suspect they were even just "a little bit hypnotised" or if you had gone through an induction then you should have also gone through a full wake-up procedure which includes pre-empting, clearing and suggesting away the symptoms of any potential "hangover."

Freaking Out - It's all in the structure of the suggestion. It's a bit irresponsible to do this without also suggesting beforehand that they won't get freaked out by it but will find it "a bit weird in a funny way" or similar AND/OR by suggesting the experience will only last until you do something else specific. You might have been able to rescue the situation by suggesting something similar "on the fly" as soon as you noticed she was beginning to freak out. Maybe by saying something like "Isn't that funny? You find that really weird and funny don't you?" BUT it's always safer to build the prevention into the suggestion rather than flounder around for a cure.

Both problems could have been prevented by thinking beforehand what could go wrong and then doing your level best to ensure it simply doesn't.
DaiMagic
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Cheers Owen, I did give her the re-induction suggestion, she just seemed to be focused so much on trying to figure out who it was that it didn't seem to register with her properly. Its just the first time someone has reacted so strongly to an amnesia suggestion. I will make sure to re-assure them next time while they are under. Smile
DaiMagic
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Yep I understand that, I did go through the full wake process with the subject that I felt was not fully under, he did feel good, i.e awake refreshed, etc. he just complained of a headache afterwards.

The other situation quickly became hard to control due to other people bombarding her with questions which only added to her confusion. however its all a learning process I just hope I can avoid this type of thing in the future. she did feel great after it was all done and dusted.
Dannydoyle
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Where did you learn to put people in trance before you put them in trance? While no perminant injury can be sustained from this you can make your friends life quite uncomfortable for a bit of time and that is just unfair to your subjects.

Clearly you were not even taught the basics of how this works. Please, before you try again do more research than a post on a bulliton board. You owe that to your subjects.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Shane Masters
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Welcome to the board DaiMagic!! There is some good advice already stated above, however, I would really like to offer some more. In this post, if anything sounds like it is condescending, I assure you it is not.

1: Try to break your post into paragraphs. It is much easier to read.

2: As stated, proper training is a must for the safety of your guests. I am one to admit that when I started I read a couple books and thought I knew it all. After making some mistakes, I realized I needed proper training. 8 years later, I am here....still learning and will never stop learning. This art is much like a game of chess. It only takes a short time to learn, but, it takes years to master.

3: No offense in advance if the questions you ask do not get the response you want. Many members have a vast amount of experience they have accumulated over the years through a lot of hard work, blood, sweat and tears. To ask direct questions and not get a response is like asking a magician the secret to all his tricks.

However, there are other members that are willing to share their secrets. Those members have products for sale. They rely on these sales for an income. They will not be willing to divulge this information for free. However, many of these members do offer personal service after the sale as well, so you really do get your money's worth.

4: Regarding your "headache" issue, there are a couple reasons I could think of that could cause this.

A: Did the individual require eyeglasses and did you do a focal induction? If so and they removed their glasses for this, the strain of focusing may have caused this.

B: How long was the induction? You say he was not completely hypnotized. Did you have him sitting around with his head forward while you tried to deepen? I call this the "prayer position". This could have caused his neck muscles to strain ,thus, inducing the headache.

C: If you did a focal type induction, what did they focus on? If it was a light like many hypnotists use, the focus on the light could have caused it. I, for one, have to be very cautious around certain lights as it triggers migraines.

D: If you used one of these arm pull instant inductions, I am curious if maybe you did not harm them. Stay away from these.

5: As far as not going under completely, it is my belief that you either are or are not. Much like being pregnant, it is not a middle of the road thing.....you are either pregnant or not pregnant. Then the next questions is " How far along are you?" How deep are they?

If you attempt to hypnotize someone, even if they "think" they are not hypnotized, take the time to re-induce, remove commands and release.

6: As far as the memory command and the girl panicking, here is my take on your situation with the information you provided: You just simply told her to forget her partner ( Mistake #1 ). I assume she knew the other people in the room. People she trusted. They were allowed to keep telling here she came with him and should know him ( Mistake #2 ). You are the hypnotists, you are in control, you lost control ( Mistake #3 ) As mentioned above by Quicknotist, when you seen her start to panic and become confused, you did not step in with a guiding suggestion about how she feels ( Mistake #4 ). The sleep command needed an anchor, again, as stated previsously. You did not install one ( Mistake #5 ).

After these mistakes, you did the right thing by removing her from the room and handling the situation. The important thing is to not make these same mistakes again.

I am not going to go into a proper release/awakening. If you are not sure if you did one, you really need to do more research and again, get training. I am a testament to training. It is not a waste of time or money. Like I said, I started off wrong. Let me divert you from that and take a much wiser path than I did when I first started.-Shane
The Cerebral Assassin
Dannydoyle
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Every one of us started at a place of ignorance. This is not bad. We simply did not have the information before we sought it out. Many jump too quick, but that is not unforgivable. Like you pointed out simply get the information. I am happy to give help, but not piecemale.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Shane Masters
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I agree Danny. I will not comdemn a man for asking a question. No one is born with eternal knowledge that I know of.-Shane
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DaiMagic
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Thanks guys some good advice there.

This was not the first time I had done this I have hypnotised people in the past with great sucsess. I am well aware of the long road to mastering something like this, if you ever can, after all I have been a studing magic for 20 odd years now.

Shane thanks for taking the time to write an in depth reply. You nailed it with the neck muscule strain, he was in the "prayer position" for around 5-10 minutes, he seemed to be "away" but was not responding well to suggestions, he actually seemed too relaxed.
Shane Masters
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No problems Dai. Glad I could help. You will find there are many, many helpful people on here. We love to help each other out.....when we are not arguing like brothers and sisters.

The reason I am keen on headache issues is because I am a chronic migraine sufferer. If there is a way to get or try to relieve a headache.....I know about it.

Quicknotist hit it on the head with an anchoring solution to your problem as well as using a guiding technique for their emotions. I personally feel that if you are going to let the subject interact with quests, this is important to do. My post made it seem like you shouldn't allow this. You can, but, you really need to setup possible "outs" just for this reason.-Shane
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mindpunisher
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And no one here can see the potential problems or dangers? And we encourage complete newbies to hypnotise others without even knowing what they are doing? Not only that we help them.

Geeze this place is an asylum.
Shane Masters
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Punisher......did you not get your Thorazine shot today?-Shane
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Dannydoyle
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OH I see the problems.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
quicknotist
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Quote:
On 2011-01-17 17:15, mindpunisher wrote:
And no one here can see the potential problems or dangers? And we encourage complete newbies to hypnotise others without even knowing what they are doing? Not only that we help them.

Geeze this place is an asylum.

It's a dilemma.
If nobody helps them, they're out there doing it without any guidance.
Shane Masters
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Quote:
On 2011-01-17 18:40, quicknotist wrote:
Quote:
On 2011-01-17 17:15, mindpunisher wrote:
And no one here can see the potential problems or dangers? And we encourage complete newbies to hypnotise others without even knowing what they are doing? Not only that we help them.

Geeze this place is an asylum.

It's a dilemma.
If nobody helps them, they're out there doing it without any guidance.
Yup...out there with a video camera jerking peoples arms out of socket. -Shane
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dmkraig
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Quote:
On 2011-01-17 18:40, quicknotist wrote:

It's a dilemma.
If nobody helps them, they're out there doing it without any guidance.


Quicknotist, the problem, IMO, is not that nobody is willing to help them. From what I've seen—in person, here, and on other boards—the problem is that they refuse to accept the guidance.

The primary guidance remains the same: GET TRAINED. For some reason (or reasons) they don't like this. Often they come up with all sorts of reasons why they can't attend a training (In NLP they say another word for "reasons" is "excuses"). In fact, when given this advice, the response is often anger, petulance, and a know-it-all attitude. "I don't know much about hypnosis, but I'm going to ignore what experts tell me and learn it the way I want to learn it."

Interestingly, the think I notice is that the people who do finally take the advice of getting trained tend to stick with hypnosis and become quite good at it (even if they don't become professionals) while those who insist that even though they know little about it they must learn it their way end up abandoning hypnosis and never really learning it at all.

Sure, there are always exceptions to this, and many people who want to learn think they are the exception. Very few are.
DaiMagic
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Lol I have viewed many post in the Café and being primarily a magician I am usually in the "workers" forum.

There is a very different feel hear. There appears to be 2 camps.

One which understand that know one starts out "Enlightened" and able to master things instantly, they are willing to give constructive criticism and offer fair advice.

The others seem to think that "newbies" should just STOP now and leave it to the elite. They do not provide answers only more questions.

I will get more training in hypnosis to add to what I already know, and again I thank you guys for the advice.
bobser
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Quote:
On 2011-01-18 17:35, DaiMagic wrote:


There is a very different feel hear. There appears to be 2 camps.
One which understand that know one starts out "Enlightened" and able to master things instantly, they are willing to give constructive criticism and offer fair advice.
The others seem to think that "newbies" should just STOP now and leave it to the elite. They do not provide answers only more questions.


Hey DaiMagic, welcome. Unfortunately you're spot on. But the good guys always win in the end. And the bad guys? Well they don't actually KNOW their bad. As you rightly said, they simply believe their the elite.
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
Mindpro
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Times have changed.

When I was younger, as some of these newcomers I couldn't get enough training and education. All I wanted to do was learn, and then learn more. Our eagerness was in learning something inside out. I'd save money, work odd jobs, borrow money from relatives and travel across country to attend a training, or go several states over to meet with someone for mentoring or tutoring, or a networking session. I'd work for free or shadow someone with the skills and knowledge just be be around the environment and learn by being part of it, I'd read whatever I could get my hands on (believe me these things were a lot more scarce back then) and when we did get something we appreciated it and read and worked it over and over again. We went to live training and committed ourselves to lengthy certifications and continued education. We wanted to be certified and accredited, multipke times over, from the best we could afford. We showed a respect and appreciation for the art and science of hypnosis, and for the performers who were before us and those willing to help and share with us. We would have never thought in a million years to lock horns with them and try to pretend to be a peer or think that we cold operate on their level, in theory or reality.

As I said times and changed. DaiMagic is correct there are two camps but not as described. The two camps are those that really want to learn hypnosis and become educated, THEN continue on and perform it. The one factor that is often sooooo overlooked here is once you master hypnosis that doesn't mean you are an entertainer. That's an entirely different set of skills, learning an education. These people here are willing to share and often do share the most - when others understand the process and are committed to learning and understand that this is not something that will be learned in a month.

The other camp wants to skip the education and just get to the part of interest to them. They're seeking shortcuts, pseudo methods and would rather bond with other likewise members who tell them that all the other stuff is unnecessary and old school. dmkraig's perception of let's see who's still here in the long run after the self generating smoke clears, will ultimately prove the real point.

Do misinterpret wisdom, knowledge and experience for being "elitists". This nonsense of "no one is willing to help" these newbies is ludacris. What I'm seeing is people that don't want to hear the truths or reality, but would rather bond together to think that somehow being united will change the knowledge needed to attain the results they're seeking. They also seem to only think of the effect to the public (so cool) but not the safety and related concerns that should be first and foremost.

Poeple are willing to help, but they have to be willing tolearn and acceot the advice being offered. I've just gone over some recent threads and posts, and there is all kinds of help and guidence being offered, regularly.

As I said, times have changed.
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