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David Thiel Inner circle Western Canada...where all that oil is 4005 Posts |
...when I have to sit through five minutes of shaking camera angles and annoying music to watch a 12 year old accosting strangers on the street...
It's not because I have an aversion to "street style" magic or 12 year olds -- but all the advertising is the same: five minutes of build up...twelve seconds of actual effect...and five more minutes of...something else. Personally -- I just want to see the effect and what that sucker does and I can decide for myself if I think it's a good fit. Not sure where my little "rant against blah blah" magic trick marketing goes...so I put it here. How do you spell "Arrrrgggghhhh?" David
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except bears. Bears will kill you.
My books are here: www.magicpendulums.com www.MidnightMagicAndMentalism.com |
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Bill Hegbli Eternal Order Fort Wayne, Indiana 22797 Posts |
Yes, you do sound crazy, don't know what your are even talking about.
I know you think the world should revolve around you. As Dr. Phil says, you want, what you want, when you want it. Well, good luck with that. Just calm down and see that there are other peoples ideas in the world. You could just walk away, of course then you may have missed something wonderful. Your choice. |
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Doc Dixon Special user Pennsylvania, USA 655 Posts |
David,
You do not sound crazy. In fact, I feel your pain. And I don't think you believe "the world should revolve around you". It seemed to me you were merely expressing a preference. (You might be interested in my not so subtle joking about that style of ads here: http://www.dixonmagic.com/ You'll have to scroll down to the video.) But there is a bottom line in place here. These kinds of ads move product. They may not move money from your wallet (or mine for that matter). But they do move other people's money, so I don't see that much of a chance for a change. In the meantime, there's always the fast forward button. Respectfully, Doc |
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David Thiel Inner circle Western Canada...where all that oil is 4005 Posts |
I've obviousy offended you, wm. Cannot think of another reason why you would respond so rudely to a person you have never met, a person who was simply expressing an opinion...and in a lighthearted way at that.
I was saying that there is a sameness that flows into magic marketing. I love magic. I love magic props. I make my living with them...and am very interested in seeing what they do. I simply heave a sigh when I realize that I am going to have to sit through several minutes of high energy, screen shaking preamble before they even begin to tell me what the effect is. Of course I understand they can market props any way they choose to. And I even understand that I have the right to watch or not watch, buy or not buy. So I heave a sigh...which was roughly the same process I went through when I read your nasty little response. David
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except bears. Bears will kill you.
My books are here: www.magicpendulums.com www.MidnightMagicAndMentalism.com |
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Bill Hegbli Eternal Order Fort Wayne, Indiana 22797 Posts |
So you are lighthearted and I am not, you are not rude and I am. Seems you are on your side, and what you think and how you behave is proper but everyone one else is not. Kind of like you are perfect and I am not.
When you rant on a thread about something that does not matter, and nothing can be done about, is crazy. If you posted to start a fight, come on, I love a good fight. No, I don't know you, and from your post don't want to. Gee poor little boy does not like entros and hype, to bad, you poor thing, next you will say that you want more advertising in your life. Get over it. The world does not revolve around you. |
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David Thiel Inner circle Western Canada...where all that oil is 4005 Posts |
No fights necessary, Great Hegblini.
I didn't come here to fight. So I am going to agree to disagree with you and ignore all your future postings and invite you to do the same to mine. Be well. David
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except bears. Bears will kill you.
My books are here: www.magicpendulums.com www.MidnightMagicAndMentalism.com |
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Andrew Zuber Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 3014 Posts |
I'm with you on this one, David. A lot of hype and music don't sell to me. Maybe I'm getting too old but I don't need to see someone that looks like he was just released from prison accosting strangers on a street corner somewhere. Doc is certainly right though. We may not appreciate that kind of stuff, but it certainly seems to have its place. It's just not a place I'll be buying from.
And rant away...sometimes it's necessary and the Café is a good place to do that, despite a few who will try to spoil your fun
"I'm sorry - if you were right, I would agree with you." -Robin Williams, Awakenings
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MagicMoney New user The World of Magic 12 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-02-01 13:13, wmhegbli wrote: Billy, You are the most disagreeable person on the Café I have ever seen. I have followed many of your posts and many have the same tone to them. Is that why you have your P.M.'s turned off so people can't tell you how rude you are? Knock it off. Inviting someone to fight because "You like a good fight". Sounds more like you are the one that is crazy. With having 7375 Posts I think you have way too much time on your hands. |
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David Thiel Inner circle Western Canada...where all that oil is 4005 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-02-03 20:26, Andrewzuber wrote: I think we understand each other. Looking at the advertising makes me wonder who is buying the props. I heard Peter Nardi discussing the market for magic. He indicated that the vast share of the market isn't the pros -- it's the hobbyists and the part time pros. Nardi indicated that many of the pros were set in the props they use and weren't really open to making any changes. It would be interesting to see a profile of the average prop-buying customer today. Are they males under 25? Are they businesspeople? What level of their incomes do they make performing? How much to they spend on new magic in a year? Are there TWO levels of consumer: the ones who devour packet tricks and another level that thinks nothing of dropping hundreds or even thousands on a prop? Have you noticed that the trailers for the high end stuff are usually very basic and to the point? Hmmm... David
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except bears. Bears will kill you.
My books are here: www.magicpendulums.com www.MidnightMagicAndMentalism.com |
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Andrew Zuber Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 3014 Posts |
I think the YouTube generation of magicians, those that are looking for that instant gratification and watch a lot of MTV, are the target audience for this style of marketing.
I'm sure that those who are working full time are fairly set in their ways. Sure they'll add something new from time to time, keeping the act fresh and learning new material, but they're working pros because they've been doing these tricks for decades. If their goal is learning something new every week and putting it into their act, they're doing it for themselves more than the spectators. A lot of people (and I admit I can be one of them) can grow tired of something quickly and move on to the next big item. I think this is why you don't see a lot of teenagers doing the cups and balls. My guess would be that they don't consider it "cool," but it's a trick that's been around for thousands of years and some of the most accomplished performers in the world are doing it. How many of the people who buy based on those fancy trailers also own the Stars of Magic, or the Dai Vernon Book of Magic, or any of the other books out there that form the foundation for what we do? I'm guessing not many. Again, I'm sure these kids (and my guess is most of them are in their early 20s at best) make up a large percentage of the market. They buy stuff based on what looks cool. I think we all do that; I just think that what looks "cool" is a lot different than what they do. Well, it's 4pm. Time for me to flip on some Matlock and eat dinner.
"I'm sorry - if you were right, I would agree with you." -Robin Williams, Awakenings
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David Thiel Inner circle Western Canada...where all that oil is 4005 Posts |
Andrew...I...like Matlock.
I turned onto magic in the 80's and I bought tricks by the dozens. And I clearly remember thinking that buying a book for thirty bucks or a new prop for the same amount wasn't even a contest. The prop won every time. Now my view has changed. But it's been like thirty years. Geez. I'm old. Dam*. And you make a great point about why pros buy new tricks. I've been performing full time for 20 years and I still buy new stuff. It really helps that about 60% of what I do is walkabout -- and aside from a few old standbys -- I am constantly changing the components of my walkabout bag. You're right. It's more for me than the audience. Gotta go. Columbo is about to start. David
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except bears. Bears will kill you.
My books are here: www.magicpendulums.com www.MidnightMagicAndMentalism.com |
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Dr. Magic Veteran user 355 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-02-01 13:13, wmhegbli wrote: I think I can hep you. 1) stop drinking 2) eat more fiber. In 1776, you'd have told them all to stop complaining. |
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aussiemagik New user Norfolk, VA 89 Posts |
Andrew....I would agree with you that they're doing this more for themselves and not the spectators. It's in an effort to look cool. However, oddly, they base this decision on the spectators. These youtube videos churned out by the dozens are just videos of the spectators reactions.
David...For those with a little more logic behind our decisions would like to see practicality, reset time, and potential (meaning we can use patter and performance to generate reaction). I was trying to say that these videos display the trick very little and instead are of people screaming on a bridge in Vegas. Anyway, I lost my train of thought (Murder, she Wrote just started). Chris |
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Bill Hilly Elite user 449 Posts |
Come on you guys, get hip. I'm watching The Bob Newhart Show on hulu.
As to the thread title, isn't that the punchline to the setup: An Irishman walks into a bar with a steeringwheel down the frint of his pants... |
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Andrew Zuber Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 3014 Posts |
David - Columbo is awesome. Peter Falk is the man. When I was working at NBC in Burbank in 2009, we still had the Columbo production offices on speed dial in our fax machine. We just loved the show THAT much. That's also a good indication of when the last time was that we'd purchased a fax machine....
Chris - I absolutely agree. Spectator reactions are a huge part of those demos. If I put everything into my show that I'd seen get a great reaction on video, I'd be performing the entire L&L catalogue. My show would be a month long. I picture exactly what you mean with the screaming people in Vegas; I've walked that bridge a thousand times. Of course they're screaming. They're young, they're plastered, they're in Vegas and there's a video camera on them. Try the same thing on an overpass in Iowa. I don't think you'll get the same reactions. I think the best outcome is for a working professional to know his audience, know his abilities, and know what will entertain people. Sure there's a lot of trial and error in performing, and we all have off moments, but I think seasoned pros don't need all that extra stuff to sell them on the effect. They need to see the effect. Bob Newhart, Jessica Fletcher, Ben Matlock...I love all of them. Throw in an episode of ChiPS for good measure and you've got yourself an awesome evening of entertainment. Then you don't have to worry about all that magic nonsense.
"I'm sorry - if you were right, I would agree with you." -Robin Williams, Awakenings
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David Thiel Inner circle Western Canada...where all that oil is 4005 Posts |
McMillan and Wife, Adam 12, The Man From UNCLE, The Wild Wild West...Charlie's Angels. (Yes. I said it cause Farrah was so...y'know.)
I keep thinking there is a great effect in the blending of all these old shows. But I don't know what it is...yet. SO many boomers in the audience these days...and on the stage, I guess.
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except bears. Bears will kill you.
My books are here: www.magicpendulums.com www.MidnightMagicAndMentalism.com |
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Alan Munro Inner circle Kentwood, Michigan, USA 5952 Posts |
I love watching Twilight Zone on Hulu. If only The Green Hornet series and Mission Impossible (first incarnation) were on there, life would be perfect!
It's too bad that the younger generation often lacks the observation skills to know when they're exposing their tricks. There would be few videos posted, if they were aware. |
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Andrew Zuber Inner circle Los Angeles, CA 3014 Posts |
I think the issue is that some of them will record a video and decide that it's good enough, and post it immediately. Again, the instant gratification. Me? I've recorded the cups and balls routine I'm currently working on at least 30 times and I'm still not satisfied (and this was after learning and rehearsing the routine for quite awhile without the aid of a video camera.)
I miss Hulu. We don't have it in the UK. Same goes for Pandora and Netflix. Good thing I've got the trusty Magic Café at least.
"I'm sorry - if you were right, I would agree with you." -Robin Williams, Awakenings
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Michael Peterson Inner circle is where I'm trapped, because of my 4071 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-02-07 21:22, Dr. Magic wrote: :) Mike |
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Mike Maturen Inner circle Michigan's Beautiful Sunrise Side 2726 Posts |
Let's not forget "Emergency"!
Quote: On 2011-02-07 22:58, David Thiel wrote:
Mike Maturen
World of Wonder Entertainment The Magic and Mayhem of Mike Maturen 989-335-1661 mikematuren@gmail.com AUTHOR OF "A NEW DAWN--Weekly Wisdom From Everyday Life" member: International Magician's Society |
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