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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Penny for your thoughts » » Subtle Scam by Tommy (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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mindpunisher
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I don't know I think Rogers missed an opportunity for a great effect --- count down to 46 then count 48 49 etc and show that there is a card missing at the 48th position...

I might market that!
Roger Kelly
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Quote:
On 2011-03-21 11:58, mindpunisher wrote:
I don't know I think Rogers missed an opportunity for a great effect --- count down to 46 then count 48 49 etc and show that there is a card missing at the 48th position...

I might market that!


I want 50%! Smile
Tom G
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As Theodore's post mentions there could be a lot of dealing. My thought is once the card and number are named, if the deck
is handled after that point for anything other than counting down to the number chosen, it would take a fairly dull spectator
not to know that "somehow" the card is being put into position.
Roger Kelly
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Quote:
On 2011-03-21 13:17, Tom G wrote:
As Theodore's post mentions there could be a lot of dealing. My thought is once the card and number are named, if the deck
is handled after that point for anything other than counting down to the number chosen, it would take a fairly dull spectator
not to know that "somehow" the card is being put into position.


I thought that too at first, Tom - but one of the 'dealings' is being executed by way of explaining the other part of the effect (ie the Thought of Card) to the second spectator. I think sometimes WE worry too much because of what WE know to be the truth. I'll run it past my bro this week and see what he says. He's into magic too and he'll give an honest opinion, and he's sharp as a needle. If it gets past him, I think I'm safe. If not - I'll have a re-think.

Anybody else come accross this as a concern?
monello74
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Quote:

As Theodore's post mentions there could be a lot of dealing. My thought is once the card and number are named, if the deck
is handled after that point for anything other than counting down to the number chosen, it would take a fairly dull spectator
not to know that "somehow" the card is being put into position.



If you want, change the first effect or change the entire routine.
I wrote Subtle Scam a while ago and I didn't stop ever to find methods to improve it.
In my current version, a spectator just think of card and just think of number (Any number and Any card and he doesn't reveal the card
and number ever before he starts the couting).

However, the current Subtle Scam is already good, because the audience view point is:
Think of a card and a Perfect ACAAN and in my opion is the impact is really good.

Apologize, if I don't share any other update about my pdfs, but I am very disappointed to see my work sold by illegal dealer.

This is a shame.

Bye,
Tommy.
It's a Miracle...

For ACAAN/OP effects:
(Mental Magic)
http://sites.google.com/site/m2mmagictrick
Roger Kelly
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Quote:
On 2011-03-21 14:06, monello74 wrote:
... but I am very disappointed to see my work sold by illegal dealer.

This is a shame.

Bye,
Tommy.


That truly is a shame Tommy. If it's eBay - you can report it - for what it's worth I don't know. Sorry to hear that Tommy after all the hard work you've put into it and the amount of satisfaction you have given to the community.
Picard
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Quote:
On 2011-03-21 13:17, Tom G wrote:
As Theodore's post mentions there could be a lot of dealing. My thought is once the card and number are named, if the deck
is handled after that point for anything other than counting down to the number chosen, it would take a fairly dull spectator
not to know that "somehow" the card is being put into position.

I have to agree with this.
I even eliminated one dealing out of 2 (it's not completely hands-off then) but it still doesn't feel natural.
Ideally, as you've said it should be instantly counted down to the chosen number once you get both pieces of information (card and a number). While it might pass by some spectators I wouldn't feel comfortable doing it as written to certain people.
Still, Subtle Scam has inspired me in a way to develop something of my own. Tommy has put a lot of thought in it and provided many variations to the original routine, so I do not regret buying it. Btw, already from the description of the effect I sort of had an idea how this might be done, so the add was completely fair. I guess I just expected a bit too much.
entermagic
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Quote:

.....

I even eliminated one dealing out of 2 (it's not completely hands-off then) but it still doesn't feel natural.

.....



All depends from your "presentation" to make it to appear natural or "super natural" LOL Smile
Remember always the conditions: an untouched borrowed deck. no mem deck, "Any" card at "Any" number, no force or psychological
technique, only on deck, no switch, no stooges, no sleight of hands.
Nothing is better on the market also the "price" is a miracle.
Please, correct me if I make a mistake. Maybe there is something more clean than Subtle Scam the name
of this effect? Duplicity! But this effect is just a bonus in Subtle Scam.

The only thing that you can say is that this is not a direct ACAAN, but Subtle Scam is not an ACAAN effect: it is a mix of 2 routines
together and with a right "presentation" the ACAAN part looks like a miracle.

Nothing is better.

MP
a brown 1968
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Hi MP

You always focus on the conditions but these are conditions for magicians to meet as a challenge , I would argue the conditions are less important than both the entertainment value of the effect and the lasting impression the effect leaves in a spectators mind.

I am more concerned with the performing conditions and getting from A to B taking the shortest possible route .

For me conditions such as:

Being able to do the effect walk around or at a table
A borrowed shuffled deck
Can work for 1 or 2 spectators
Noisy background
So I prefer Richardson's . true not a perfect ACAAN but the spectator does not care .

I do like Subtle Scam but as mentioned already both bits of information are known to the performer well in advance of the outcome . The longer the delay the more people will figure out that this information is used by the performer to make it happen, the HOW they don't know.

Andy
entermagic
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Hi Andy,
in my opinion, if you don't see the conditions, Subtle Scam is not for you or any other
method, because Richardson's is already the best.

MP
Roger Kelly
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Hey - we can't compare Richardson's to Subtle Scam can we? Sure, Richardson's (Impromptu CAAN) is brilliant - but its vastly different to SS. In fact, I (sometimes) use them both in the same set, they're that different.
Picard
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Quote:
On 2011-03-22 09:54, a brown 1968 wrote:
You always focus on the conditions but these are conditions for magicians to meet as a challenge , I would argue the conditions are less important than both the entertainment value of the effect and the lasting impression the effect leaves in a spectators mind.

This is an important point. I think we (magicians) are too concerned with perfect conditions. Original Subtle Scam is completely hands off, but the lack of directness is a problem. The only important thing is how the spectators are going to perceive it. With just a little bit of handling and proper presentation much more direct effect can be achieved which will be REMEMBERED as hands off by spectators (even though it's not 100% hands off).

AS WRITTEN Subtle Scam lacks directness, and the card and number are known waaay too long in advance. I do agree that great presentation CAN sometimes make up for weaker parts of any routine but I have yet to come up with such an ingenious presentation to make Subtle Scam something I would want to perform in front of my audience.
entermagic
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Quote:

AS WRITTEN Subtle Scam lacks directness, and the card and number are known waaay too long in advance




Too long in advance that the audience forget that they have already named...

Perform Beyond Subtle Scam and then let me know what the audience will say about the effect.

MP
Roger Kelly
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Quote:

Perform Beyond Subtle Scam and then let me know what the audience will say about the effect.



This is key.

Some of the labour involved in this effect had me serioulsy considering its inclusion - but when I saw the reactions - I was more than happy.
Louis Cipher
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Quote:

This is key.

Some of the labour involved in this effect had me serioulsy considering its inclusion - but when I saw the reactions - I was more than happy.



Yes, the reactions... and I look also for the Simplicity and if you can perform it always with any deck and Subtle Scam requires just a borrewed deck.

(_Louis Cipher_)
entermagic
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Thank you Tommy about "TC ACAAN"

I like it a lot because: it is direct and fast.

1. Hand the deck the spectator.
2. Name a card and number
3. Count face-up the cards and the card is there.

Very very good impromptu method.

Nice addition.

MP
doriancaudal
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Congrats for your TC ACAAN Tommy Smile I will use it, for sure!
Hands-off ACAAN - freely chosen card and number : http://doriancaudal.wix.com/miracaan
Mind_Magic
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Every time Subtle Scam is becoming better and better.
Thanks Tommy for the updates.
InfinityDream
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This effect will be my ACAAN that I will use over and over.

Excellent work again.

-Antonio
wilko7
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Has there been another update? I havent recieved any but would love to if there is.
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