The Asher Brute Force-excellent by the way.
Criss Cross Force
and currently practicing the Sadowitz Slip Jog

I like the flip force. I first saw it on Lee Asher's "Well Done" titled as "May the Force be With You."
Another favorite is the crosscut force I use with my Jumbo Bikes.
I also use the classic force but lately I had to use my fallback far too often.

I use "Force". I spread the cards in my hands, out-jog one card and insist (with as much intimidation as I possibly can) that they take that card. Works EVERY time.

I'm just kidding all of you. No one else did, so I HAD to. It's part of my job!!

Yah, I like to hire a big Italian guy to stand behind me while I up-jog the card and spread and ask the spec ever so politely "Pick any card. I trust you'll make the right decision."

The Classic Force - this alone is a small book if all the tips and handlings that are appropriate are described. There are many ways to work toward making the Classic Force sure-fire. Once you master all the little touches and are comfortable with it, the Classic Force is amongst the best of all possible ways to control a spectators selection. Several hints:

1.) Holding all the cards around the force card tightly, so that the force card is the ONLY one that moves freely encourages the spectator to take the path of least resistance.

2.) Timing. Timing is everything. Have a spectator select a card in a trick where the selection is irrelevant. You can gauge the way in which that particular person removes a card, and adjust your timing accordingly when you need to force a card.

3.) The obvious - practice all the time, forcing cards even when you don't need to. That way, if you miss, it doesn't matter. You get the practice, and if you succeed, have another edge in the trick you are doing.

4.) Body language and actual verbal communication - you can hurry the spectator without being offensive about it. The need for speed forces the spectator to be less particular during the selection. Some body language - lean into the spectator as you are giving instructions, and then move away, taking the cards out of reach as he is going for the selection. Properly done, this gives the impression that the spectator is holding up progress. In an effort to be part of, and to not look the fool, the spectator will take whatever is thrust upon him. There are many other subtle ways to intimate that the spectator should hurry up and pick a card, all non-verbal - work on them. The spoken work - refer to Expert Card Technique - Jack McMillen has a trick in there (The Psychic Stop) in which the spectator is forced to stop counting on a specific number, and the way in which the selection is verbally manipulated is an excellent lesson in forcing.

I could go on and on about this one force, but that's enough for now. Maybe, if there is any interest, we could start a thread on how to classic force a card, and the guys with some experience would be willing to share it - kind of like a symposium on Classic Forcing?

Other forces that I use with regularity include:

1.) Hofzinser Fan Force
2.) Riffle Force
3.) Cross Cut Force
4.)Bluff Pass Force ( Interesting side note - there are many ways in which to use the Bluff or Mock Pass besides for the traditional reason of bringing a selection to second from the top. The whole concept of apparently removing a certain, spectator-determined block of cards, while in fact removing SOMETHING (or nothing!) entirely different, opens up whole vistas that have been barely explored and grossly underused by most magicians. Again, a whole monograph could be written on this subject.)

There are many effects where the method of forcing is dictated by the handling/procedures of the effect. For instance, I use the bottom deal to force a card in one trick, the second deal in another. These are not forces in the traditional sense, but the slieghts produce the desired result (forcing a card), so can be classified as forces in these instances.

There are some forces that are so peculiar that they are only good under specific conditions, but under those conditions, can't be beat. For that reason it is good to be familiar with as many ways to force as possible, and to be particular about what method you use. The idiosyncracies of various effects are what dictate the selection of a forcing procedure for me, and so I have made it a point to consider every forcing method I can find, knowing that any one method will not satisfy all conditions, although the Classic Force, with which I started this post, is certainly amongst the most versatile of forces. Here we are, full circle, back at the Classic Force! Hope this has been of interest to someone, and that maybe we can continue the discussion in more specific ways by starting other threads that are focussed on one or another of the forcing procedures mentioned in this thread.

Best, PSC

Mine would have to be the riffle and the classic but I also like a variation in one of hugards books but i'm not sure what it's called

I must say, this has been one of the best ongoing threads in this forum in a long time. The contributions have been many, wonderful, exciting and very diversified. I would like to say thank you to everyone who has participated and to all of those that have just read. I hope you, like me, have learned something. Better yet, I hope this thread continues and grows.

1) Psychological stop force - works 100% of the time (Simon Lovell offers a GREAT write up of this in simon says)

2) Riffle force

3) Classic force

YES! I'd really like that... I want to learn all the little extra's I can for this one!

OK... I'm *very* new to magic (unless one counts the stuff I did as a pre-teen many moons ago), and I'm *quite* intimidated by the idea of forcing a card... as much as I'd love to be able to do it. Is there any hope for me? Thanks!

ps- GREAT forum here... I've been lurking for quite some time.

Peace-

Classic
Classic
Classic

Well if I can borrow a Svengali deck I'll try that first.

But if it absolutely has to work, (your life depends on it), then I would probably use the tried and true, one-of-a-kind, one-way-force deck for sure.

Or else I might try to...
Place the Force Card on top of the deck.
Spread the cards and have a spectator touch the back of any card. (a Free choice)
Remove it and place the card face down on top of the FC.
Pick up a double and display FC to audience.
Replace double on the deck and slip the top card into the middle of the deck.
False shuffle controlling the FC and then perform your miracle.

Honestly, just trying to give some variety.

Christ force
Equivoque force
MC double lift force

I almost always use the classic force, for some effects I'll use the riffle force, but my favorite is the bottom deal force.

>> OK... I'm *very* new to magic (unless one counts the stuff I did as a pre-teen many moons ago), and I'm *quite* intimidated by the idea of forcing a card... as much as I'd love to be able to do it. Is there any hope for me? Thanks!

Do you mean "classic-forcing a card"?

If not, what's to be intimidated about? Something like the Balducci Cut Deeper force requires no skill whatsoever on your part and is quite deceptive.

Cheers

Tom

For those of you that are new to magic (I have noticed that there are some recent additions to the Café) there are several excellent ways to force a card that require very little in the way of slieght of hand, yet are absolutely deceptive. Here are a few that I resort to when I think that the spectators are paying way to much attention to my skill level:

The cross cut force - this is a beautiful way to force a card under certain circumstances. The best explanation in print is in Ron Bauers Private Studies Series in the Cut Up Card Trick, by Senator Crandall. If you know this force you may ask "What do I need to read about it again for?" Well, there is a popular misconception about why it, and other things like it, work. That misconception is referred to as "time misdirection". RB explains why there is no such thing as "Time Misdirection", and what REALLY happens when you put some time between the cut and the viewing of the force card. Understanding that is key to your understanding of other things magical.

Another great way to force a card is to use a forcing deck. I know, I know, that's cheating! Well, I can tell you that non other than Don Alan, perhaps the single most influencial magician in close-up in the 20th century (Almost everyone doing closeup uses something of Dons', whether they know it or not!) used a 26 card forcing deck for a bunch of things. The handling is what is important here. Don had a deck that was 26 of one card, and 26 different cards. His handling, the way he shuffled, the display and spreading of the cards for selection, all contributed to the "no handling" feel of his card magic. Most magicians, never mind normal audiences, had no idea that Don used a force deck! The way Don handled a force deck can be seen on several of the videos that are available on him.

Using a key card is an exceptional way to force cards. I favor a corner-short. It is easy to find by riffling down the outer left corner of the deck. When you feel the key go by it is easy to stop immediately after it passes, meaning that the card under it is the force card. You have to practice riffling so that you are in the area of the corner short when the spectator calls stop, but that is not very hard. Once you are familiar with short card work, you'll never carry a deck without one! I have substituted a marked card for a corner short, but it is harder to stop on, since you are totally dependent on your vision. Look for literature on key cards, corner shorts, etc. You can use them to force cards above, below, or to force the short card itself. You can also use them to control a replaced card. This is a versatile way to manage selections. The other way to control spectator choice that is similar to a short or marked key card is the Will De Sieve "coin card". This is basically a card that you have pushed a quarter or similar sized coin onto, so that there is a raised cirle on the back of the card. It acts as a locator card now, and is easy to cut to. There are many references to this key card in the literature. The idea of cutting to the De Sieve card brings me to the last force I will mention in this post, and that is...

The crimp or bridging techniques. Again, these are simple in concept. They require some practice, but are not the equivilent of difficult sleight of hand techniques like classic forcing or Hofzinser fan forcing, etc. You can put the "work" into a deck in such a way that the spectator will cut to your crimp or bridge all by himself! This gives the appearance of absolute freedom of choice, since the cards are not even in your hands when the spectator makes his selection. Again, the literature abounds in references to this type of card handling.

Best, PSC

Gmartins,
the under the spread force that you couldn't think of the name of is the Fan Slip Force as described in The Magic Handbook by Peter Eldin

- Slip Force Handling of Gary Kurtz

- Riffle Force with a Vernon Touch

- A Peek Force that was shown to me by Lennart Green, but I think it´s not his own.

Markus

My own unpublished handling of the slip force.

Joshua Jay's handling of the Riffle Force, which I just learned this week. Joshua has made the riffle force more convincing and fair than even a perfect classic force.

The dribble force.

I've posted earlier, but these are my ammendments:
1. Backslip - this force is so reliable
2. Under the Spread
3. A variation of under the spread used by Jay Sankey in bigger finish. (I learned this one just by watching the demo.)

Note: the reason that I'm not fond of the Classic force is because it's not sure fire, though I plan to learn it well and be able to perform it well soon, though I know this will take an enormous amount of practice, and in the meantime, the Underspread is alright.