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fergie33
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I've been getting great results with my hypnosis but I've started to realize that 80 percent of whether the hypnosis is going to work or not is the subject you using.i feel like a very small percent of people can go into deep hypnosis for stage. does anyone else agree with this? or if I'm wrong could some one correct me. also how do you know weather someones gonna be a good subject or not? I've used a lot of suggestibility tests but I feel like they've been very inaccurate. I usually find girls much easier to hypnotize than men. thanks -chris
Mindpro
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Ah, the wonder of proper training!
Anthony Jacquin
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What would proper training say on this Mindpro?

Anthony
Anthony Jacquin

Reality is Plastic! The Art of Impromptu Hypnosis
Updated for 2016

Now on Kindle and Audible!
Mindpro
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Many things...where to start. Every question he posed and point he made would be covered with proper training - subject selection, the importance of the proper setup or pre-talk, subject selection, testing, stacking the odds in your favor, selecting the proper type of induction for the current situation for your best chance of success, deepening, routine selection, confidence, and so on.

To address his questions - I disagree with most of what he said based on my own experience. I would say 80% in my show (again based on the areas I just mentioned above, having the proper training and knowledge) are good subjects and the best most animated are the guys. Both exactly opposite of what he perceives.

"also how do you know weather someones gonna be a good subject or not?" again, this is covered, addressed and comes with proper training. Suggestibility tests inaccurate? - again I disagree unless they are not being done correctly.

Then before all of these statements he states "I've been getting great results"? What he describes not not seem to be considered "good results" by my standards.

I'm hoping you were kidding Anthony or perhaps just wanting me to elaborate.
fergie33
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What I meant with great results is I've been doing it for groups of 6 to 10 people and I'm successfully putting people into DEEP hypnosis. but I want to get into stage. I understand its a game of odds and numbers but I was looking for advice to get the majority of people under. I've done suggestibility tests that have worked on people and they didn't go under then doing it on someone else and it not working, they went right under
TonyB2009
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Chris, you will make mistakes along the way, but you are on the right tracks. Get a few good books and they will tell you a lot. Books tend to be better than DVDs as they contain more information. I gather live training is the best, but I have yet to try it.
I find that one in four can go into a deep state of compliance, but in a stage setting, with other factors in play such as fear, social pressure, etc, this drops down a bit. Young people are easier than old, young teens the absolute best. You soon learn to read your audience and a time comes when you will spot some of the people you want while you are doing your pre-talk.
The books I have enjoyed most are Secrets of Stage and Cabaret Hypnosis, by Eddie Burke, Reality is Plastic by Anthony Jaquin, and a book by David Knight, the name of which escapes me.
fergie33
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Thanks for the positive feedback and help tony I appreciate it
dmkraig
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While I agree with Tony's comment (and some of his points are simply stated advanced ideas), I agree even more with MindPro. Chris, you are soooo very close! One decent training would give you what you need to be a pro and get on stage! You clearly already have the drive and desire, all you need now is the knowledge and experience.

Let's just look at your post. You wrote: "...I was looking for advice to get the majority of people under. I've done suggestibility tests that have worked on people and they didn't go under then doing it on someone else and it not working, they went right under."

1) People go under water, under tables, under ground, etc. People do not go under hypnosis. They enter trance or the hypnotic state. I know this seems like a minor point, but words are our tools. When you say or even think people are going to go under hypnosis, you are subtly telling the people you are working with that you are the master controller and they are under YOU. Lots of people simply do not want to give up control to you or anyone else. Of course, they do give up control every day, but they don't like to think they do. You're just giving them reasons NOT to allow themselves to enter hypnosis.

2) While suggestibility tests can indicate to the people you're working with that they are...well...suggestible, from what you've written it sounds like you've missed the point on these tests. First, you seem to be taking and either/or approach to these tests. By that I mean, either they work or they don't. But they're not really about either/or, they're about degrees of suggestibility. The magnetic fingers (AKA "finger vise" or "rubber bands around fingers," etc.) test is actually about physiology, not suggestibility. It does get people in the mood for more. The balloon/encyclopedia (heavy hand/light hand) test, when done properly has hands at different levels before you start giving suggestions. The degree of difference between the hands implies to you the likelihood of compliance. When people resist these two tests, it "shows how strong their will power is and that they can be excellent candidates for hypnosis IF they REALLY WANT to be hypnotized, feel wonderful, and have one of the most fun and enjoyable times of their lives."

Do you get it? EVERYONE "passes" the tests. They are, primarily, a way for you to judge them for candidacy for hypnosis. So I don't even understand what you mean when you say that the suggestibility tests "haven't worked." They always work. They tell you about the people.

From what you've posted, you have something that, in honesty, few people have: the guts to go out and be a hypnotist. You have the courage to be, as Anthony calls it (love the concept) THE HYPNOTIST. That's one of the most difficult qualities to obtain. If you combine that with training and experience you could be a fantastic performer.

The books mentioned by Tony collectively cost well over $100.00 u.s. They're absolutely great books. But if you saved up your money for an actual in-person training, you'd not only get the information, you'd also get the experience while being watched and given advice by a professional. I would advise buying, studying, and using those books IN ADDITION to an in-person training, not as a replacement for them.

How long have you been attempting hypnosis now? A few weeks? Several months? You could literally ready to do your first real show after just a few days of training.

Or you can continue trying to figure out why your suggestibility tests are successful or failures, why they don't always relate to success with hypnotic induction, and you can continue to try to put people under water...err... under hypnosis Smile

Whatever you decide to do, good luck!
Anthony Jacquin
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Quote:
On 2011-04-04 19:55, Mindpro wrote:

I'm hoping you were kidding Anthony or perhaps just wanting me to elaborate.


Just wanted you to elaborate on what 'proper training' is saying. I found all of the proper training I did espoused the 20% rule, i.e one in five, kind of in line with fergie's initial finding.

Anthony
Anthony Jacquin

Reality is Plastic! The Art of Impromptu Hypnosis
Updated for 2016

Now on Kindle and Audible!
fergie33
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I've wanted to get live training but I cant I'm only 16. so instead I've bought almost all of Anthony's products which might not be as good as live training but has made me successful in hypnosis. the minute I turn 18 I plan on going to a training group. dmkraig thanks for your response I took a lot out of it but theirs one thing that through me off. you said if the suggestibility test doesn't work( they resist) then there easy to hypnotize. I thought it was the other way around? thanks
dmkraig
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If you're really interested, and can get your parent's permission, there's no reason you cannot get a live training.

You missed my point about suggestibility tests. It's not that they work or don't work, it's what they tell you. Such tests always work. If you get the response indicating high suggestibility, then they will easily go into hypnosis. If you don' get the response you're seeking, then they're strong willed. If you get them to agree to follow your instructions, they'll easily go into hypnosis.

If people can stand say hello, they can be hypnotized. You may need a lot of time to do it, which isn't practical for stage hypnosis. You may need a different type of induction than you know. But if you can instill the desire to be hypnotized in a person (because it's such a fun and wonderful sensation), they can be hypnotized.

You'll learn this all in a good training.
Zerububle
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The only danger with in person training is that it can breed clones. My all means attend a training but don't assume that's all there is.
dmkraig
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I agree with Zerububle. A good training should help you develop your individuality. Otherwise, you'll just look like another graduate of the Chavez School of magic. One Channing Pollack is enough.
mindpunisher
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That's not a danger. Not being trained has real dangers. Having said that Im not really sure how you avoid being a clone? Hypnosis is limited. Even James using the well worn extremely tired missing finger routine in his videos on youtube.

Training doesn't make clones it makes competent hypnotists assuming the training is good. And that can only be good for hypnosis and the public.

Lack of talent makes clones. Having said that if you are going to start by basing your act on someone make sure you pick the best. And do not stick to hypnosis draw your inspiration from a number of sources.

Training never makes clones.
dmkraig
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Quote:
On 2011-04-06 04:51, mindpunisher wrote:
Training never makes clones.


It does in the armed forces.
It did for the Chavez School of Magic
If all a person does is repeat what they learned in stage hypnosis training, and if they don't add their own ideas and personality, it could in hypnosis.
mindpunisher
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"could do" the choice is always up to the ability, creativity and talent of the individual. The majority will always be clones that's how things are. Most people are sheep. Most being more than half. And before there is a stupid argument about "where is your research" use your head and just look around you.

The subject is HYPNOSIS training. Hypnosis training doesn't make you a clone it gives you a good foudation in hypnosis assuming the training is good. Its the choice of the individual or sheep to decide if they want to be a clone or not.

However its not always a bad idea to be a clone. If something is working and all you want is bookings or money then cloning is acceptable. Depends upon what you want. Seems to me on here there is more cloning than anything ( handsake induction - stick hand to table - stack hand to head - forget your name - forget the number 7 - yadda yadda yadda )

And that goes for the training too.

Personally I would look elsewhere for good training or advice. But then I never wanted to be a clone. But there is nothing wrong with copying when you are learning. In fact its the quickest way to success. Over time you develop your own spin.
Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On 2011-04-05 19:30, fergie33 wrote:
I've wanted to get live training but I cant I'm only 16. so instead I've bought almost all of Anthony's products which might not be as good as live training but has made me successful in hypnosis.

Oh no this is perfect. Yep exactly the route you should take. Carry on.

Posted: Apr 6, 2011 3:05pm
LACK OF TALENT MAKES CLONES! True. Lazy does as well.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
mindpunisher
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Also - If you are going to copy someone pick a good model to clone. Which is why I suggested looking elswhere other than this forum. The stuff getting dished out on here is pretty awful but will make good fodder for the sheep. Bahhhhhh
Chris Meece
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Yawn, I don't see why you guys even post anymore .. your message is always the same. I've resisted responding till now. I've read your posts with an open mind and agree that live training would be awesome. I've also picked up some useful tidbits from your posts. But your perceived superiority complex is wearing thin. I don't know if is due to jealousy or just an overall sour demeanor, but if you are serious about your message you really need to rethink your delivery. You could probably benefit with a reading (or re-reading) of Dale Carnegie's "How to Win Friends and Influence People." Maybe you need a hug... think happy thoughts. Heck if I know, just realize that you are probably not winning over anyone to your way of thinking. Maybe this is your master plan.
All small town magicians know what 793.8 signifies.
Dannydoyle
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Talk about YAWN. The kiddies comming in and crying a river about the "delivery" because they don't like being told how much they don't know.

I resisted posting any more than flippant jokes because of the pathetic nature of the very LONG LINE of you children who have come through here in the past few years. Do you think you are the first such children we have seen in 25+ years at this? Odd how I never manage to see any of you LAST!

So the children come in, puff up their feathers, beat the chest, and then move along. Jealousy? Hardly. Tiresome? I agree with you. But you guys have to know that the world did not spring into existance on your birthday!

I am not trying to win over ANYONE with a way of thinking. You children want to run about stealing cucumbers from people and fake videos and such and pretend you have a guru then go for it! More power to you. If that is what gives your life purpose then I am not one to be critical. Seriously. It is no skin off of my nose if this is your lifes ambition. I accept it. It does not have an impact on me in one way or the other. I hold no judgements. Fly be free! But don't tell ME what I am ALLOWED TO THINK either ok? You are critcal of us for having a point of view, yet you want to force us into thinking YOUR way.

Not sure why, maybe you just don't have what it takes to actually do hypnosis. Maybe you are jealous of those of us who have large regular audiences. Maybe you just need a hug. I don't know. Maybe you could just learn how to learn. Frankley I don't give a rats hind parts. Do what you are going to do, but don't pretend that you are somehow superior or the keeper of a greater knowledge.

Now go dig up some dirt on me on the internet and post it and make some snarky remark about it. That is what the children usually do. Then it is about 6 months of being frustrated with this process, a genuine lack of knowledge and wondering why it is not "fun" any more and you are outta here.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
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