The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » You are getting sleepy...very sleepy... » » Hypnosis to help Memory Sytems? Your thoughts... (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

Pakar Ilusi
View Profile
Inner circle
5691 Posts

Profile of Pakar Ilusi
I just compiled and created my own Memory System... A Peg System of my own really, simplified for use in performance. Mainly to memorize a list of 30 items (my personal best is 120).

Here is the thread in Inner Thoughts, (you need 50 posts though...).

http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......um=82&32

My question is, would Hypnosis directly help in the teaching and learning of such a system?

Jut so you know, a Memory Peg System uses a lot of visualization, well at least mine does... Smile

Thanks in advance.

Smile
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
mindpunisher
View Profile
Inner circle
6132 Posts

Profile of mindpunisher
Yes
Pakar Ilusi
View Profile
Inner circle
5691 Posts

Profile of Pakar Ilusi
Quote:
On 2011-04-12 05:02, mindpunisher wrote:
Yes


Thanks mp... Smile
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
bobser
View Profile
Inner circle
4176 Posts

Profile of bobser
There are lots of yes answers on this over many years. However there have also been quite heavy academic studies that have argued NO.
Understand these are open studies with no motivation to find an answer yes or no. They simply came up with NO (this of course included hypnotised subjects reviewing a criminal scene).
I have to say, in my limited experience on hypnotic memory this has also been my findings. Albeit the subject truly felt that they were in fact remembering better (hope this makes sense).
On peg memory systems I'm sure your individual system is excellent. But it will be for you and not for me. I trained with a very famous memory professor, ooooh what's his name again (excellent humour there!)? ... Dr. Bruno Furst.
He does recommend making up 'your own' system because it'll be personal to you.
When they were very young I gave all my children (saved me a fortune on presents for the little buggers)a 100 peg memory system which they absolutely loved.
As Bruno says: "there's no such thing as a bad memory. Only an untrained memory." And what you'll know by know Pakar is that not only do peg systems work but they actually make it impossible to fail. Cool - huh?!
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
mindpunisher
View Profile
Inner circle
6132 Posts

Profile of mindpunisher
Academics are useless..

Memory involves two parts. Absorbing information and recalling.

Psychologists tell us we learn half what we learn in our whole lives in the first five years. Mainly because we don't really start to fully develop self consciousness and analytical ability during that period. And our minds are in alpha state.

The optimum state for learning is light trance which can be replicted with hypnosis. In other words being in a relaxed state while studying and NOT trying enables us to absorbe more information.

And its the same with recall we need to be in optimum state for recall free of perfomance anxiety.

Hypnosis can facilitate this perfectly.

Plus there is also the issue around beliefs that an individual has around learning that were conditioned from an early period that effect the results.

I don't care what academics say we are learning machines another name for the hypnotic state is the "learning" state.


And by the way there is also the notion of the difference between "understanding" and "learning"..

Most people including academics strive to understand on an intellectual basis. They collect more and more information. While learning is about integrating information and skills in order to DO something successfully. The lattr is an unconscious activity. A feat must become an unconscious reflex before it is "learned".

Which would explain why most academics just don't get it.
Dannydoyle
View Profile
Eternal Order
19873 Posts

Profile of Dannydoyle
Quote:
On 2011-04-12 06:25, bobser wrote:
There are lots of yes answers on this over many years. However there have also been quite heavy academic studies that have argued NO.
Understand these are open studies with no motivation to find an answer yes or no. They simply came up with NO (this of course included hypnotised subjects reviewing a criminal scene).
I have to say, in my limited experience on hypnotic memory this has also been my findings. Albeit the subject truly felt that they were in fact remembering better (hope this makes sense).
On peg memory systems I'm sure your individual system is excellent. But it will be for you and not for me. I trained with a very famous memory professor, ooooh what's his name again (excellent humour there!)? ... Dr. Bruno Furst.
He does recommend making up 'your own' system because it'll be personal to you.
When they were very young I gave all my children (saved me a fortune on presents for the little buggers)a 100 peg memory system which they absolutely loved.
As Bruno says: "there's no such thing as a bad memory. Only an untrained memory." And what you'll know by know Pakar is that not only do peg systems work but they actually make it impossible to fail. Cool - huh?!


You may want to re think this position Bobser. I am with ya! Whooo hooooooo
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
mindpunisher
View Profile
Inner circle
6132 Posts

Profile of mindpunisher
It may be that academics found that hypnosis doesn't improve the recall of a memory of something like a bank robbery.

But being in a relaxed state rather than an anxious state while studying (creating the memory including using peg systems) and in a relaxed state whilst recalling that memory will improve the learning and recalling of information.

Think about public speaking for example. Or exams.

I learned Harry Lorayne's peg system and still remember telephone numbers of nearly 20 years ago without having to have ever written them down. Its a great system.
Dannydoyle
View Profile
Eternal Order
19873 Posts

Profile of Dannydoyle
Well ol Harry ripped that system off from a long list of people all the way back to the Greeks LOL
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
mindpunisher
View Profile
Inner circle
6132 Posts

Profile of mindpunisher
The system where ever it originated from IS great. I just happen to have got it from Harry. Greeks were before my time. And his books are very well written easy to follow. In fact I think the super power memory is public domain now.
bobser
View Profile
Inner circle
4176 Posts

Profile of bobser
Quote:
On 2011-04-12 14:09, Dannydoyle wrote:
Well ol Harry ripped that system off from a long list of people all the way back to the Greeks LOL


Woooooo hoooooo.
Back 'atcha with this one Danny!
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
bobser
View Profile
Inner circle
4176 Posts

Profile of bobser
[quote]On 2011-04-12 07:30, mindpunisher wrote
Quote:
Academics are useless..
... Psychologists tell us we learn half what we learn in our whole lives in the first five years.


But aren't psychologists academics???
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
mindpunisher
View Profile
Inner circle
6132 Posts

Profile of mindpunisher
[quote]On 2011-04-12 14:29, bobser wrote:
Quote:
On 2011-04-12 07:30, mindpunisher wrote
Quote:
Academics are useless..
... Psychologists tell us we learn half what we learn in our whole lives in the first five years.


But aren't psychologists academics???



Yes that's right they "tell" us they don't "do".... A good hypnotist will be able to replicate to some degree the mental states associated with optimum learning that belonged to the toddler where as the psychologist will point out the obvious and tell us its fixed.

Much like many of those psychometric tests psychologists create for recruitment purposes will claim the traits are fixed and predict behaviour. Where as a good hypnotist can change behaviour and traits to a degree where the individual results will change despite what the psychologist tells us..

I know because I have done it numerous times with sales people.

Isn't that where the term comes from "its just academic". I have a degree in network and multimedia computing and an hnd in graphic design so I could be thought of as academic. But the courses I did taught me nothing worthwhile. In fact when at uni I complsined about the lack of practical knowledge on such things as web development things that would enable students to get real paid work I was told..."this is academia not training". In other words it was useless theory no good to anyone in the real world..

Yep useless I would say. Wouldn't you? I have certificats coming out of my ears in all sorts of subjects but never has anybody asked to see one ever. No matter what job I carried out all these years working for myself.
Pakar Ilusi
View Profile
Inner circle
5691 Posts

Profile of Pakar Ilusi
Wow, who would've thought... Smile

Anyway, thanks guys.
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
Dannydoyle
View Profile
Eternal Order
19873 Posts

Profile of Dannydoyle
Quote:
On 2011-04-12 14:16, mindpunisher wrote:
The system where ever it originated from IS great. I just happen to have got it from Harry. Greeks were before my time. And his books are very well written easy to follow. In fact I think the super power memory is public domain now.


I know what you mean, and Harry did make it pretty easy to understand that is true. But it is really a very very old principal.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
bobser
View Profile
Inner circle
4176 Posts

Profile of bobser
Quote:
On 2011-04-12 19:52, mindpunisher wrote:

1) Academics are useless...

2) Isn't that where the term comes from "its just academic".

3) I have a degree in network and multimedia computing and an hnd in graphic design so I could be thought
of as academic.

4) ... no good to anyone in the real world..


1) that just cannot make sense in sane discussion.
2) the term "that's just academic" actually comes from none academics (like you) with severe hang-ups
3) see the answer to (2)
4) You don't live in the real world.

Finally, how can I spend time continually harnessing and educating you if you continually go and spoil it by throwing that rattle out of the pram every bloody week?!!!
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
mindpunisher
View Profile
Inner circle
6132 Posts

Profile of mindpunisher
No it came from the academics at my university. Plus after only buying a few books on web development and spending extra time I was more practical than my tutors to the extent all the students in my class canme to me for help with theor projects. Because the tutors couldn't help them with the software.

Same with client..

No rattle no pram Bobser just a dose of reality. And if you were bright enough you would learn from me..

But I am entitled to have BSc after my name so I do have a reasonable academnic achievement. It was a complete waste of time. An HND in graphic design almost a second degree and an HND in technical graphics almost a third degree.

Now put me up against a psychologist any time I know who will get the results..
bobser
View Profile
Inner circle
4176 Posts

Profile of bobser
I rest my case.
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
mindpunisher
View Profile
Inner circle
6132 Posts

Profile of mindpunisher
Your off your case time you rested it!
bobser
View Profile
Inner circle
4176 Posts

Profile of bobser
DOUBLE ANYTHING YOU SAY......
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » You are getting sleepy...very sleepy... » » Hypnosis to help Memory Sytems? Your thoughts... (0 Likes)
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2020 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.2 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL