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Jacob Smith
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Hi everyone, I have had a lot of success doing hypnosis impromptu around my school and town doing performance hypnosis. I am universally known as the hypnotist now and am doing demonstrations daily for people during my lunch periods in school as well as in the real world on the street, but I really want to start doing stage and large scale shows. My basic question is where do I go from here, like how can I start attracting more attention for venues and making money doing hypnosis on stage? Does anyone have any tips or stories they can give me on how I can start getting more paid gigs doing performance hypnosis?
Mindpro
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"Paid Gigs"...already? How about learning hypnosis first.
Dannydoyle
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Then learning a show would be a pretty good idea also. Maybe some sort of training in performance?
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
TonyB2009
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I read Ormond McGill's book on Thursday and did my first paid show on Saturday. I wouldn't recdommend it, but it can be done.

I would recommend reading a few books on stage stuff and putting together a sensible structure for a show. Then stick to that for the first few.

Best of luck on the journey.

PS I recommend Secrets of Stage and Cabaret Hypnosis by Eddie Burke (www.mreenterprises.co.uk). I have also heard good accounts of Jon Chase's Deeper and Deeper for stage work.
Mindpro
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Simply put, you're not going to learn to do a true successful stage hypnosis show from just reading a book or two.
Jacob Smith
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I have studied a lot though, like I practice skits daily and am always working on new ideas...Thanks for the advice guys, I really want to read Orman McGill's book Tony! Can you post me a link to somewhere I can find it possibly?

Jake
Dannydoyle
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Then you should be just fine.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
TimonK
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Hey Jake!

Is there a possibility that you're a New Zealander? Just your way to write Smile

I started off with doing paid mentalism shows about 3 years or so ago and then incorporated hypnosis more and more until I ended up giving hypnosis shows. The best way to start giving gigs would be to start off at family and friend's events for free. This will give you opportunity to practice a more formal show. Remember thought that family and friends can be a hard audience for a hypnosis show ( as you might know this isn't always the case ). You also mentioned that you do shows in the 'real world' ( to me everything is real world - or is that just my perceiption ;D ?! ) so you should be fine with introducing yourself as a hypnotist to total strangers and still pulling off a successful show.

Anyways, I'd recommend you start with unpaid gigs at family & friends, give out business cards in the 'real world' to people you did a show to or to people who watched - this is always a good way to get gigs. Remember to always be professional, no matter if it's a paid or unpaid gig or if it's the street.
As the others already said, do some study on stage performing, maybe take drama or impro classes, rethorical classes helped me a lot, too. Take any opportunity to be on stage in whatever way ( speeches, etc. ) and you'll get there. As soon as someone calls you from your business card and you offer a paid gig the whole thing will start to roll. Before you start doing paid gigs, be sure you are comfortable on stage and yes, good enough.

You also might want to look up any events ( summer festivals, etc ) that might take place in your city and write to the organisers with an offer of performing there, unpaid or paid.
Being quite young myself I can remember that it was quite hard to get paid gigs started, so I wish you the best of luck! Work steadily and you'll make it.

All the best,

Timon.
"But overcome space, and all we have left is Here. Overcome time, and all we have left is Now. And in the middle of Here and Now, don't you think that we might see each other once or twice?"
- Richard Bach, 'Jonathan Livingston Seagull'

www.timonkrause.com
Jacob Smith
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Thanks for all the advice Timon! I am actually really glad you told me what you did because I have a gig this Friday at a restaurant and I was considering doing a bigger demonstration for my town's arts festival coming up both for free so I know I'm starting off right so far! Smile
TonyB2009
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Quote:
On 2011-04-30 22:30, Mindpro wrote:
Simply put, you're not going to learn to do a true successful stage hypnosis show from just reading a book or two.

Mindpro, I did. I was nearly fifteen years into the journey before I got any training. It might not be an idea route, but it is very possible.
Jacob Smith
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Wow that's incredible, I'm only about a year in since I first got a PDF copy of reality is plastic but I've been investing a lot into training materials and watching a lot of YouTube (mainly Tom Silver), since then I've made a name for myself doing hypnosis around town. I am saving right now and about to get a second job at chipotle to afford a spot at the HTG Live event, so I know that will prove to be excellent training!
Mindpro
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Quote:
On 2011-05-02 14:40, TonyB2009 wrote:
Quote:
On 2011-04-30 22:30, Mindpro wrote:
Simply put, you're not going to learn to do a true successful stage hypnosis show from just reading a book or two.

Mindpro, I did. I was nearly fifteen years into the journey before I got any training. It might not be an idea route, but it is very possible.


I know and understand that as you tell that story here before. I think though this is terrible advice for a newbie. Most newbies will read your entire post above and the part that they will take from it is "it can be done" and "this guy Tony said so 'cause he did it."

The problem I have with this is while it is possible this is not the best advice to offer someone new who is seeking guidance and advice. I believe the vast majority of all newcomers that read that then believe it's doable and encouraged by this statement, when in reality many pf them will only be back on here in days or weeks saying they only had minimal or no success, why, and what can they do to have better results?

To truly help these newbies, I feel it's better to offer them the best, practical, and most reliable sound advice that offers them a true representation and understanding of what they are seeking. Shortcuts always result in future problems of lack of total understanding.

So while it is possible,(so are other things you wouldn't necessarily tell someone to encourage them - yes it's possible to walk on he moon, yes a ten year old could drive a car, yes it's possible to get struck by lightning twice) the real advice is that to get the results they are seeking requires more than reading few books or viewing a dvd. Truth of the matter the average person will not obtain the desired results from simply doing this. In may day I was encouraged to study and learn as much as I could from as many resources as possible. Read books, (nowdays) view dvds, get live hands-on proper training, shadow, intern or assist with a certified professional, and to start with smaller steps and expectations, master them before progressing to the larger, ultimate goals. This is the practical advice that still stands today.

Knowing Ormond personally, I do not believe he ever would have expected anyone to simply read his encyclopedia or other works and consider themselves fully educated and to be a hypnotist. He was a proponent of education, creating and developing your skill set, and real world education and experience.

The other problem is many newcomers think that participating here on the Café and watching YouTube clips are considered proper education.
TonyB2009
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Mindpro, I have seen lots of guys paralysed by overtraining. They study so much and train so much it builds a barrier in their heads, and they never get down to actually working with people. Reading one book and going for it may not be the best approach, but I believe it is better than spending years and thousands on live training.
The middle ground is probably best, but at some point you have to stop training and start doing. And that point is reached a lot quicker than most people realise.
Some of the guys posting here for advice are already hypnotising people, and telling them they need to pull back for months or years more training is not the best advice.
Nothing personal in this; I just believe we need to jump straight in sometimes.
Mindpro
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Proper training does include the "doing" that you mention and also covers "analysis paralysis." I also believe that many newcomers that are here that think they are already hypnotizing, are not truly in fact doing so, but rather doing related things such as basic response and suggestibility tests that they think are in fact hypnosis, and not truly reaching the suggestible state required to solicit the response they're expecting.

Too often "jumping in" to these guys means simply wanting "to get to the good stuff", without learning the hows and whys.

I don't at all understand how you can tell anyone that getting proper training "is not the best advice".
TonyB2009
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Quote:
On 2011-05-02 20:12, Mindpro wrote:
I also believe that many newcomers that are here that think they are already hypnotizing, are not truly in fact doing so, but rather doing related things such as basic response and suggestibility tests that they think are in fact hypnosis,


I believe that applies to most of us.

I am not against training; I just think there is no substitute for getting your hands dirty. In the absense of training trial and error will get you there in the end.

At Anthony Jacquin's training weekend in Dublin recently we went out and tried it on the streets; that was real training. Doing it on each other is not. That's the problem with training. I know two hypnotists over here who have trained extensively but who labour over a stage show. They've overtrained for the job.
dmkraig
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Tony, I'm a bit confused by your comments. You seem to be equating training with reading books and watching videos. I consider that studying ABOUT hypnosis. And I agree, just studyiing about hypnosis can fill a person with so much information that they can literally become paralyzed with insecurities about what they should actually do.

When I say "training," I mean taking an in-person training with a teacher and other students. Part of the training--perhaps 50% or more—should involve practice with other students as the instructor observes. In this way the student gets his or her "hands dirty" with actual practice on other people. IMO, one of the reasons some students end up wondering if someone was hypnotized is because they've never actually been hypnotized themselves. Being in a training allows a person to experience hypnosis (probably several times).

None of these things can occur from reading books or watching videos. Learning hypnosis can take a few days of training or weeks (or months) of stumbling with books and videos and trying to find people to practice with.

I agree that there is a difference between working with fellow students and going out on the street or stage. But working with compatriots--especially when people are beginning--can give the confidence necessary to be successful on stage or street. A beginner going out on the street can rarely consider himself or herself what Anthony calls 'THE HYPNOTIST." With in-class practice they still may not consider themselves to be on that level, but at least they'll consider themselves to be The Hypnotist rather than a hypnotist.

I realize that there are some people here who read a book and went on to become a great performer. I respect you for that. However, I would respectfully suggest that you are both exceptional and the exception to the rule. For every person who becomes a great performer after reading a book or two there are probably dozens or hundred of people who follow that process and after a few failures (even mixed with some successes) give up.

The problem is an error of logic known as extrapolating the general from the specific. By that I mean the attitude of "This worked for me so it should work for everyone" even though evidence simply does not support that. The people who succeeded after reading one book and want others to follow that pattern are ignoring their own exceptionalism and dooming the majority of eager enthusiasts to failure.
Mindpro
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Well said.
TonyB2009
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Kraig, you are not wrong. But the thing is these guys are going out hypnotising people anyway, so its too late to urge live training. Advice on where to take what they are already doing, and will continue to do, is what they are looking for.

Also, unless live training has changed drastically from when I began, it just isn't always an option. I saw courses advertised that cost $1,500 for a weekend, and involved travelling. Not only was that not possible, I think it was vastly over-priced, no matter who was carrying out the training.

The only training option I had was a correspondence course that even at the start of my career I knew was fifty years out of date.

Training with books and videos may not be ideal, but for many of us it is the only way we can go.
dmkraig
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I respectfully disagree, Tony. It's never too late to get training. To say otherwise would be telling someone who is messing up his home trying to fix the plumbing and electric wiring to simply give up because they can never learn properly.

There are all sorts of prices for in-person training, and some, indeed, is quite pricey. However, if someone really want to learn, they can get a second job for a month or two and pack lunches rather than buy them. I just don't buy the "I can't afford it" argument. It says that people are incapable of earning extra money, and I just don't believe it.

Of course, they can also buy books and DVDs, spending a few hundred dollars or more, and then spend months trying to sort things out and still not do a good job. I don't know about you, but I value my time. In reality, the costs of second rate, do-it-yourself training, other than most likely resulting in either failure or abandonment, far exceeds the costs of taking a training.

It all comes down to what people want. If they really want to become good hypnotists, they can earn the money and learn. If they don't really want to learn, they can come up with all sorts of excuses: I'm too young, I can't travel, I don't have the money, I don't have the time, yada, yada, yada. If you really want it you can get it. If you don't really want it you're not going to be a good hypnotist anyway, so do what you want. I'd like to see more great hypnotists because that would challenge current performers to be even better rather than depending on skits that were old when Ormand was just a twinkle in his father's eye.
TonyB2009
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Hi Kraig. I don't know where you are based, but in Ireland to get training means travelling abroad. And if I am going to travel abroad, I am going to bring the kids and make it a holiday. I am not going to shell out exorbatant prices for training.

I've been fifteen years doing shows, and the first opportinity I got to do hypnosis for entertainment training in my country I availed of it. But if I had waited for the training I would have lost fifteen years of doing good solid shows.

Proper training may well be the best option - I am sure I would have eliminated many mistakes - but for those of us not living in the US or the UK, it is not always possible. And to those people, I say go for it.

I was lucky in that a few days before my first show I bumped into a stage hypnotist, Adrian Knight, who was kind enough to explain enough of the basics to get me through that first night. And Barry Sinclair has always been generous with his knowledge. Both men chose to encourage me rather than point out the pitfalls, and when newbies phone me, I remember that and try to tell them as much as I can.
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