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Dannydoyle
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You say about business and such, yet SO few of the ambush hypnotists make any money. So don't tell me it is about business.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Jacob Smith
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Thanks all, I will have some performance videos up once I get ahold of the footage from my friends family.
Shrubsole
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Quote:
On 2011-05-10 17:55, Dannydoyle wrote:
You say about business and such, yet SO few of the ambush hypnotists make any money. So don't tell me it is about business.


But that is up to the individual. If someone wants to go out every night and never make any money at whatever it is they do, that's up to them.

Personally I have found (may not work for everyone) that instead of the usual advertising, cold calling or even arranging a meeting with the venue owner, I have got many a gig* by showing up where I want to play and doing (what looks like) an impromptu show. (Cut down version not a full show)

*All types of show that I do (Magic, Mentalism and/or hypnosis)

They usually then want more. And that's when the business kicks in. There is nothing better than generating demand before the hard sell. (Just make sure the owner is there and included in the show)

I find this approach gets me lots more work than doing a few bits for just the owner or cold calling and saying 'I'm wonderful, when do you want me?'
Winner of the Dumbringer Award for total incompetence. (All years)
Dannydoyle
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Might work in England, but I doubt very much any gig worth working is aquired that way across the pond.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
bobser
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About 7 years ago I did some instant canvassing in a busy area in Southampton. Just walking around restaurants saying I'd arrived in the area and was looking for some work in the area etc etc...

I got lots of 'No's' but I got the couple gigs I was looking for since I read a couple minds, bent keys etc.
here's the funny one though; this two young gentlemen translated to me that their uncle wanted to know if I could: "levitate like the American man".

I smiled at the laughing uncle, and moved some tables before performing a (b-ld-cc-)levitation. So the uncle is now locked in the toilet (seriously) screaming at his nephews that not only is there NO work for me ever, but I "musn't even come into the restaurant ever again!"

Indian uncles, what ARE they like?!
Bob Burns is the creator of The Swan.
mindpunisher
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Quote:
On 2011-05-11 17:36, Dannydoyle wrote:
Might work in England, but I doubt very much any gig worth working is aquired that way across the pond.


I guess there are differing standards as to what is "worth working". And to what you would call a professional gig.

I never understood the restaraunt market. I have never known any restaraunt in Edinburgh to employ a magician or hypnotist. And knowing the margins they make in the food can't see how they could afford to.
Shrubsole
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Quote:
On 2011-05-11 17:36, Dannydoyle wrote:
Might work in England, but I doubt very much any gig worth working is aquired that way across the pond.


Obviously Corporate jobs are of course not got that way, but for daily bread and butter jobs in bars, cafés and restaurants (any non-big chain types) it really does work better doing things that way around here.

Corporate gigs I do through agents mostly (or event planers) as there is no place to turn up to impromptu until the actual night. So they work entirely differently.

I do think in this case there are differences between here and corporate, big chain America.
Winner of the Dumbringer Award for total incompetence. (All years)
Shrubsole
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Quote:
On 2011-05-11 21:01, bobser wrote:
About 7 years ago I did some instant canvassing in a busy area in Southampton. Just walking around restaurants saying I'd arrived in the area and was looking for some work in the area etc etc...

I got lots of 'No's' but I got the couple gigs I was looking for since I read a couple minds, bent keys etc.
here's the funny one though; this two young gentlemen translated to me that their uncle wanted to know if I could: "levitate like the American man".

I smiled at the laughing uncle, and moved some tables before performing a (b-ld-cc-)levitation. So the uncle is now locked in the toilet (seriously) screaming at his nephews that not only is there NO work for me ever, but I "musn't even come into the restaurant ever again!"

Indian uncles, what ARE they like?!


That's typical! Try and please them and it's not right. A Lose/Lose situation.

You should have said that if you didn't get a gig there you would put a curse on the place. Smile
Winner of the Dumbringer Award for total incompetence. (All years)
Shrubsole
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Quote:
On 2011-05-12 06:10, mindpunisher wrote:
Quote:
On 2011-05-11 17:36, Dannydoyle wrote:
Might work in England, but I doubt very much any gig worth working is aquired that way across the pond.


I guess there are differing standards as to what is "worth working". And to what you would call a professional gig.

I never understood the restaraunt market. I have never known any restaraunt in Edinburgh to employ a magician or hypnotist. And knowing the margins they make in the food can't see how they could afford to.


Ah! The usual look down your nose at everyone else and elect yourself better than everyone.

A typical MP post there! Smile
Winner of the Dumbringer Award for total incompetence. (All years)
Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On 2011-05-12 06:19, Shrubsole wrote:
Quote:
On 2011-05-12 06:10, mindpunisher wrote:
Quote:
On 2011-05-11 17:36, Dannydoyle wrote:
Might work in England, but I doubt very much any gig worth working is aquired that way across the pond.


I guess there are differing standards as to what is "worth working". And to what you would call a professional gig.

I never understood the restaraunt market. I have never known any restaraunt in Edinburgh to employ a magician or hypnotist. And knowing the margins they make in the food can't see how they could afford to.


Ah! The usual look down your nose at everyone else and elect yourself better than everyone.

A typical MP post there! Smile


Usually yea, but here not so much. Yep tere is a difference in what is worth working. I can't imagine a restaurant that wants hypnotists working. It could happen here, it may happen here, but I have never seen one. Magicians yea, and I guess they fake and do the bs presentations, but outright hypnosis? Not so much.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Mindpro
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I also can't imagine hypnosis in a restaurant for so many reasons - liability, lack of understanding and public perception, the physicalness of it, and so on. Non-appealing to owners/management as well as the patrons. Just the entire performance environment seems so inappropriate and counterproductive to hypnosis. I've never seen or heard of this but I'm pretty sure if it is happening it simply a magician using hypnosis as a fake premise for a trick, fake hypnosis, or simple suggestibility tests presented as hypnosis.
mindpunisher
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I have friend who owned a large restaraunt. We ran a business networking group from it. I used to do the odd seminar which included some mentalism. I did it for free since I was trying to help my friend and also it ws a good way to get in front of businesses. However he has since closed the restaraunt. The current climate is making things really tough just now for everybody. Bars are closing down right left and centre etc etc. Last year I contacted a number of the type of venues that I used to when I did hypnosis shows for the ticket money on the door. The ones that had function rooms of 80-250. None of them wanted to even try since the cost of drink in relation to the cost of living means less and less people are going to these types of venues. So an added ticket on top of that would make it even tougher. In fact if you offered to buy the establishments from them they would probably bite your hand off.

In my lifetime I have never seen so many bars and restaraunts close. To the point where I believe its changing our culture and how people socialise over here. Things are changing drastically.

I never understood the restaraunt "market" or ever seen it worthwhile from where I live even for doing magic. Had it been a reasonable market I would have had no qualms giving it ago myself. Nothing to do with looking down on anybody. I just don't see it as viable market. I don't see ANY market. Even during the Edinburgh Festival I don't ever recall any restaraunt that employed a regular magician or mentalist. And certainly no hypnotist since Edinburgh is very strict with regards to safety and licenses. But even so I can't see whay a restaraunt would want a hypnotist. They want to sell food and get you off the premises as quickly as possible to clear the table for the next crowd.

Of course I can only comment on my experience and my part of the world.
Jacob Smith
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Actually Mindpro, I did not use any of what you said thank you very much but I do understand what you mean when you say you don't think it is appropriate for restaurant situations. Personally, I used a lot of James Tripps material that I learned from his blog and from his hypnosis without trance package mixed with a few ideas that I myself have been playing with based of what I have seen James Brown do. I just think of it this way, if you are truely the hypnotist then there should be no limit to when and where you can do demonstrations.
Mindpro
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Were you doing only hypnosis or mixed with something else (magic, mentalism, readings, etc.)? Were/Are you presented or billed as a hypnotist?
Jacob Smith
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I was billed as an entertainer or at least I billed myself as an entertainer then said I am a magician and hypnotist. I basicly used things like card sticks and amnesia to get them in the right state based off what I could get them to feel via Luke Jermay style suggestion that I used earlier in coin routines routines actually (great stuff for indirect suggestability testing). I will say that I very rarely used the full closed eyes trance phenomena except on some of my friend's friends who I met to demonstrate things like full hallucenations (even though those can be done without classic trance too) and all that fun stuff with in the center of the restaurant while everyone watched.
To all hypnotists who want to do hypnosis in a restaurant style setting, I highly recommend using non-trance style hypnosis because it is less "scary" sounding to the restaurant patrons and can easily be done covertly via a "mind game" or as a "card trick" at first then always give a few positive suggestions at the end so that they really feel that meeting you made a real difference. I always start with my coin magic because it is sure fire and you can use the suggestion work mentioned above to see who is really following along on the experience then I move into card routines that are more hypnosis heavy that include outs in case the hypnosis doesn't take. The great thing about hypnosis is that it is very modular, so if the food comes you can stop and they are always left with a very unique experience Smile
Mindpro
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Ah!!! As I suspected. Magic not hypnosis. Hypnosis from a magician's perspective. Thanks for your explanation.
Shrubsole
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And so completes another dismissal by an expert hypnotist.

I'm amazed that they allow anyone other than themselves to post here.
Winner of the Dumbringer Award for total incompetence. (All years)
Mindpro
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I'm glad you finally understand.
Shrubsole
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Quote:
On 2011-05-12 23:47, Mindpro wrote:
I'm glad you finally understand.


The only things that I do fully understand are these:

1. There are a number of self-elected, egotistical, bullies active on this forum.

2. That I won't be bullied off this or any other forum.


Now I'm sure it would be a fascinating study and debate as to what went wrong with these people to make them that way: The constant need to have their ego stroked and need to put themselves above others to gain a fake importance that they don't actually have, but I feel that is not a discussion for a hypnosis forum and should really take place on a forum called "My Big Head And Where It All Went So Tragically Wrong".

Having said that, maybe regression hypnosis may be able to pinpoint the exact time and event in their lives where their needs where not being catered for and so the need to demand power by bullying took over.
Winner of the Dumbringer Award for total incompetence. (All years)
Dannydoyle
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Bullied? Really? It is now some heroic struggle? Wow a bit self aggrandizing huh? Oh well.

Being told you are wrong is different from being bullied, but you already know that.

See a guy comes here and claims he is doing hypnosis, turns out it is magic and is told so. You then tell the person who tells him that he is a bully.

The question I have is why your deep seeded need for others to accept what it is you do? If YOU are happy, then life goes on well right? I mean I am perfectly happy with what it is I do and could not possibly care less what the band of ambush hypnotists think about it. They don't pay me. So why should you care what a bunch of us think about what it is you do? It should not matter to you! We will probably never get it. That is not the end of the world. It does not infringe on your ability to accost strangers in random pubs and alledgedly hypnotise them. Just keep doing it and the heck with what we think! Don't keep needing our acceptance, and arguing for it. If you want to tilt at windmills, I would suggest that you buy a donkey.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
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