Its hard to know what information is good or bad information. I mean look at all the folks that have released DVDs and books in the last couple of years. More than half of them are pretty bad or just rehashed material with a new cooler name.

I think that one if the best ways to steer clear of the rehashed material is to actually study the stuff that was released in years past. If you're serious enough about anything that you do, then you will actually take the time to seek out some of the older material on your given niche.

After you have read some of the older publications, and watched some of the VHS Tapes (or beta! LOL!!!) I think you will find that many of the items being mentioned to you over and over and over again will suddenly be what they are. Garbage.

If you're new to magic or performing magic and you just bought a book or dvd and think it's groundbreaking material, do yourself a favor and go out and do some research and try to find some older publications on the same genre. Suddenly, you will see the difference between the good, bad, and the rehashed.

If the meat of older material is good then a rehash would also be good. Perhaps even better if the language is more apropriate to the generation and therefore more completely absorbed and applied.
Inferior is inferior and nothing can help it. Gold is gold and that is that.

So to tell the difference?
Ask someone you trust & admire to steer you in the correct direction.
Read/Watch everything you can get your hands on and through trial & error find what speaks to you & your situation.
Flip a coin and trust the hands of fate.

It's easier than ever to do your homework these days, with many old classics and dusty old tomes available online (Learned Pig Project is a treasure trove). Asking around the local magic society and fairs often reveal piles of old literature to wallow in like a pig in poke. Many of the routines you find cannot be used now for various reasons, some can and are but most interesting is learning how thinking as a magician has developed over the years. Surprisingly little, as it turns out.

As for current stuff, I tend to avoid:

- 'Groundbreaking' effects with a demo video that is mostly the name of the trick slowly scrolling past via the magic of Windows Movie Maker

- Anything that's a "reputation maker"

- DVDs without accompanying materials produced by 'working pros' with no footprint on google and filming from their parents' basement

- Anything shilled furiously everywhere by someone going on about how lucrative his performing is (so lucrative he can afford to spend all his time shilling tat instead of working on his act).

When I do buy new stuff, I like to see:

- Some sort of written accompaniment in cases of DVDs, so I can look things up at my own pace. This rule also filters out the DVDs of some charisma free bozo droning on for an hour about a trick he then messes up himself (retakes are for wimps).

- An open-ended approach alongside suggested routines, so I can adapt the material for myself without doing all the creator's R+D.

- Some idea of what the creator actually does for a living (if it's a day job, then what they do to perform) and what their approach to magic is. Forum posts and word of mouth reports are great for this.

Great responses!!!!!!


You fellas are absolutely right.

One thing I will say is that rehashing to the point of better language and understandable writing is one thing, but pretty much just saying EXACTLY what some one else wrote or said is the animal I speak of.

Someone here was selling his 1998 DVD that he rehashed, added a scene or two, then magically offered it as a fresh 2008 production....

Zoobini, the thing about that is the person wasnt rehashing somebody else's previously released material. He was re-releasing his own. I know it may seem a bit rehashed but in truth this person only looked to make the product better then release it again...

I hope I'm making sense.

:)

I'm not sure of whom you speak, but I'm sure they had good intentions with it. The point is that it was theirs, ad not someone else's material...

So it's not the 'hashing it's the stealing?
I'm on board with that.

Yeah I say "rehashing" because may times you will see the material is glaringly repeated then other times, you will see the wording has been modified just a bit but is pretty much EXACTLY the same as what came before. Maybe even a typo or two...but still the same.
:)

At best it's a lame attempt at either making money or getting fame. I just think folks (especially the younger one's) should take the time to read up on some older publications before thinking new ones are the end all be all for information.

There's just so many DVDs and books out there right now that fall into this category.

Oh in case you're wandering what items I'm talking about, just watch some old video or read some books on any particular subject and then compare them to what you have bought recently.
You will make your own discoveries.
And in some cases, I bet you want your money back.

I would but I don't "buy recently", lol. I booked up on magic suggested by the Old Ones early in my journey (don't you just hate it when they say journey and you immediately hear "Lovin' Touchin' Squeezin"?) and then used time served to create my act and beat out the wrinkles in performance. Experience is a cruel Head Master but it's not easily forgotten.

I'll just take the hash...

I´m not sure about this one. The first time reading it thru, I found myself nodding my head. Ten minute later; rereading it, I shook my head,... except at Zoobini´s valuable input,.. thanks Zoob.

I´ve read some good stuff,.. lately. And I´ve seen some garbage,.. lately. In `earlier times´, there was not much availible, pertaining to the Streets. Thinking about it, though; it kinda hit me, that a lot of the stuff I like today, comes from people with their roots deep in the past. Guys with well worn shoes,.. from many miles of streets. Still, their material,.. their product is `new´,... up to date.

but hey, let´s stop dancing around candy store,.... Eric Evans´ stuff is great. Fresh,... nothing re-hashed,.... "for real magic". The Secret Art of Magic. Is there better?,...past, or present?

Jimmytalksalot,... I find his stuff,... his thoughts,... to also have `authenticy´. Again, pretty new,... still,... original.,... I´m talking about the "philosophical aspect" here. I also find him to be one of the FEW `Street´ performers. Therefore, his material/thoughts quite centered to the Streets.,... not Festivals, Garder Partys,.. or Comedy Clubs.

Ok,... the rest of the `new stuff´, I would also flush,... some of it twice,... but these are worthwhile exceptions.

Let´s talk about `old´ sources. Who?,... What??? Jim Haveline? Robert Houdin?? Bosco??? Information, from the Streets, I find to be rare.

givin´ it easy,
gallagher.

I get the feeling you have one opinion and I have another Gallagher...


Let me guess, you think there's some sort of animosity between me and the fellas you mentioned right? Trying to get the old pot stirred?

It's very transparent what you're trying to do and to tell you the truth it just makes me smile...


I'm not going to name any books here publicly because then if I leave one out or don't mention another, folks take it the wrong way, and get all bent outta shape. Or think I'm from one "camp" or another. That's stupid. There are no "camps". There's workers and then there's fellas like you.

Me, I'm a worker.

I'm not here to argue. I'm here to help if I can, and make new friends. If you don't want my help, or want to be my friend then go away...I think of it as mind over matter. I don't mind because folks that cause trouble don't matter.

Oh and it's not polite to interrupt when the adults are talking...

I'm done with this thread.

Gosh Bobby,.. too bad we couldn´t stick with facts. I´m not a National Enquirer reader,... it doesn´t really interest me with who or whom you don´t sleep with.

I mention BOTH of these guys,... whom I´ve never met,.. because I REALLY respect their work. Their WORK about the Streets. Their PRESENT work about the Streets. I thought that was the purpose of the thread.,... was I wrong?;.::

I feel, though, on your part, to merely says,"Stuff today is the same as what came before." , is wrong. Especially in these cases. Specifically pertaining to the Streets. Example:Eric Evans´ view of an audience,.. the psychoöogy behind their motivations,... the Magicians motivations. Presentation according. All topic and perspective never before so presented,.. that includes the Past!

Jimmytalksalot thoughts , as well. WHO today writes up so much "stickly about the Streets"? Who? AND, thought provoking and innovative.

Question: Who else IS there today? Who?

A bit of advice,.. today, FREE, I´m in a good mood,.... drop your personal hang-ups, when it comes to learning.; only then opens the door.

givin´it easy,
your friend,
gallagher.

Hey Bobby, good to see you back here on the Café and good talking to you this week.

Gallagher,

thanks a lot for the kind words. I have read your stuff also

and I have learned a lot and enjoyed it very much.

it means a lot to me when the info that was taught to me helps others, I feel like I'm doing the right thing when I pass it on. it also is rewarding that my experience is helping others.

I am also grateful for any of the info that is out there. I know in years past it was much more difficult to get a hold of info.

I love cellini and sheridan's writing a lot.

sometimes I feel old and that my shtick out there on the street is becoming passe so I look to the next generation.

for a more recent writer I like a young guy, nick w. aka Nickey Fynn who writes forum and blog busking adventure stories about asia and europe. he has no book or any type of product other than his street show, his sole means of income, but he has been a huge inspiration to me and many others.

he told me some awhile back he read my stuff got inspired and started travelling the world.

every once inna while he sends me some new youtube footage of his work, I'm always looking forward to see what new trick or antic he's up to. it's perfect when ever I'm bummed out...cheers me right up, he's really good.

some of you may know him he writes here too.

I think it's great that we have the internet now, even inspite of it's obvious misinformation, because of all the free info and news we can get about our art and because of sites like this one.

I think the best source of info is stage time.

thanks again gallagher I read about your life style in one of your posts and I have great respect for you.

.......this is our lives not a business machine.

I feel like no matter what I will say at his point somehow it gets turned into a commercial for stuff or someone's something, or I get attacked for what I say. It's funny too, because I just got back! LOL! I'm not here to argue. I was trying to talk about new and old media. But it gets redirected towards one or two specific folks. Funny how that works...
I didn't want get into specific books, especially books that I have never read (like Jimmy's) but here goes...
I read Eric's but found many things wrong with the theories presented in relationship to Sun Tsu and that it only seemed to scrape the surface of the meanings of the actual writings and scenarios. I also don't go into any performance situation with the mindset that it's warfare or anyone is my enemy. Which is what I garner from strategic writing like Sun Tsu's and he's so cryptic.That being said, it works for some folks on some level, but it wasnt for me. Eric is a phenomenal magician, and I respect what he does. Sure we have butted heads in the past but that doesn't mean he's not awesome to watch perform magic.


You want a couple books printed recently that I do like here ya go:

Within the last ten years The Art of Krowd Keeping by Danny Hustle and Gazzo. It's easy to read has no cryptic meanings and is spot on in theory and direction.

Jeff Sheridan's book is great too, although I wouldnt see Jeff being too successful on the street today. He's insanely good at what he does but definitely not a street worker by todays standards. There's some valuable knowledge there.


A little off magical topic and older - The Book of Five Rings by Musashi It is a much simpler treatise on strategy that I relate with better. Musashi writes in a direct and no nonsense manner that hits home with me.

The Gregory Hines Autobiography - this is a great book if you really want to get inside the mind of a great Choreographer and Tap Dancer (I just thought I would throw this in there for you Gallagher since you tap dance on the street.)


Now, folks can go read these or just go out and perform. You will learn at greater rate than reading about it!

But Gregory Hines posture is just horrible, shoulders all hunched and he looks at his feet like if he can't see them he can't move em. So many young have learned this from him. It's more like drumming with feet than dancing. Shame....

Hey Bobby, thanks for not dropping out. I really didn´t mean to hack on you,.. I´m sorry it can across so to you.

Sleeping on it last night, I thought to myself, "****, there have been SOOO many good, great, and simply `curiuos nice folks´ that have come thru this Site. Such a wealth of experience, knowledge,.. and good humour. Somehow we always get tied up in one another. Scheiße!"

A lady once told me, "Yeah, come on, what do you expect, Strret Performers are out there,... on their own! No Stage. No audience. NO welcome. Alone. The only ones who survive, keep it going, are those strong enough,... and their individüal pride (I think she meant Ego) is the only thing they´ve got for protection."

When asked, "Who´s the greatest Street Performer out there?" Kosmos once replied, "Me of course!" But then he said, "Anyone out their making their living doing it, has my respect. They´ve got to be great."

Thinking about it, I thought, "wow, just think if some of the folks who have been thru here, and left, would still be around to share some of their thoughts and knowledge." Think about it! Whit Hayden(!). Gosh, could you imagine picking his brain a bit,... about comedy,.. timing,... the 1960´s.
,.. listening to Doug Conn talk about coins!,... or Stick Manipulation.
,...talk to Dave V about "Celinni Times".
,... get Kondini to talk about busking the Royalty of England with Zibits!
,.. get Danny Hustle to write tales about starting on the Streets of Boston,.. with nothing.
,... have Chad tell us about different types of woods to use for sticks.
,.. hear stories of good pitches in southern France, as experienced by Chance.
,.. imagine getting Eric Evans to talk about using Big Coions on the Streeis!?!?
,..I´ve heard, YOU´re an expert yourself, when it comes to grabbing and HOLDING a crowd!
,.. Sonny Holiday,.. you can bet he´s been in and out of here too,..
,.. ever see JoeJoe make a cigarette fly?,... you wouldn´t believe it.
,... George Gilbert,.... computer crack,... could show us how to find every festival,... and sabotage `Busking Unfriendly Towns´ Computers .
,.. Gaddy, one of the best read men on the Streets.
,... Charlie Capers on misdirection.

"man", I thought, "so many great folks,.. in and out. Such possiblity. Down the tubes. Why? Our egos?" ( Just a question, here,... I´m asking myself,.. thinking about MYSELF.)

Years ago, I attended a Juggler´s Convention, in Laval France. Outside the entery was a a little tiny sign, standing all alone,... everybody read it. It said ,"Leave your Ego outside:" I learned more in those four days then I´ve ever learn before or since.

sorry, I think I´m labbering. Just wanted to say, "Thanks for not hanging up." And, "Sorry it came over sideways."

gallagher.

p.s.: yeah, Gregory Hines was a great one. Loved the dance. He danced for a time with his bother Maurice on the Streets. not for the money, but for the experience! He said, "it wipe all fears from his feet°. He was a great one,.. very humble. ,.. I guess that´s something ALL the `Greats´ have in common.
,... labbering again.

p.s.s. . Jimmy, I´ve got to "ditto" you on that one about Nickey Fynn. He´s great! Really inspires me,.. to go out there and play for anybody,... even the cows! Great, great guy. Very sympathetic.

It seems to me that there are many GREAT street performers with many different ways to be successful. I was watching "Talking Funny" with Jerry Seinfeld, Chris Rock, Louis C.K. and Ricky Gervais on HBO. If you get a chance to see it do it! 4 GREAT comedians all doing it differently. So when it comes to performers of a different type (street performers) they are going to do it differently. If Jerry Seinfeld doing comedy wrong because he does not curse and Chris Rock does, no of course not.To add to the difference of street performers is the different pitches they work. I have seen Eric Evans, Jimmy Talksalot, Bobby Maverick, Gazzo all build a crowd do a show and earn a good hat!!! They all did it differently. So bottom line to me is just as comedians mentioned above they all have there own style and so there answers to Street Performing are going to differ but they are all PROS. I just want to say to all the PROS who post here THANK YOU!!!