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balducci
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Danny is agreeing with me. Twice in rapid succession! The world is ending today after all! Smile
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
Cyberqat
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[quote]On 2011-05-21 11:46, ed rhodes wrote:
[quote]On 2011-05-21 08:48, irossall wrote:
Quote:
On 2011-05-21 08:39, Woland wrote:
When you consider the things that President Bush did for and with military personnel and their families, the things that he continues to do, behind the scenes, often with with no press allowed, you realize that the press coverage of something like the visit to the USS Abraham Lincoln was a sideshow.


Bush stood behind our troops...

the poor enlisted ***s at the bottom of the ladder at Guantanamo went to prison while Bush, Chaney and their cronies hid safely behind them.

And I suspect this whole sub-thread violates the politics rule on all sides.

But it wasn't the bush administration that did these...

HR 3219, the Veterans Benefits Act of 2010

(April 23, 2010), the United States Congress passed the Caregivers and Veterans Omnibus Health Services Act, giving severely wounded warriors and the family members who care for them some much-needed support to ensure the warriors receive the highest quality of care available and remain out of nursing homes.

Quite a list here of all the things that the democrats are doing for Veterans, Service People and their families:
http://www.goldstarmoms.com/News/Legislation/Legislation.htm

And then there is this...

Military Families United Backs Presidential Initiative
John Ellsworth, Chairman of Military Families United and Gold Star father, released the following statement in regards to an initiative put forward by President Barack Obama, First Lady Michelle Obama, and Dr. Jill Biden that establishes a coordinated and comprehensive Federal approach to supporting military families.
http://www.militaryfamiliesunited.org/re......411.html

Ofcourse, facts weigh pretty lightly when compared to preconceptions in most peoples perceptions. And apparently the latest right wing marching lie is that somehow only they care about our appreciate our men and women in arms.
It is always darkest just before you are eaten by a grue.
Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On 2011-05-21 16:15, balducci wrote:
Danny is agreeing with me. Twice in rapid succession! The world is ending today after all! Smile


This makes 3! A man on a pale horse and I am outta here!
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Woland
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Marc Cenedella has an interesting graph on Presidential use of the first person pronoun, "I." Those of us who remember President Nixon may recall how fond he was of informing us that some event was the first time an American President had done something, or the first time Richard Nixon had done something -- he was almost incapable of making a presentation without mentioning some "first" or other. Well, the graph seems to bear out my recollection of President Nixon's speechifying:

Image



Now this only shows results of analyzing 12 addresses, so it is far from complete. And you have to correct for the length of the addresses. Nixon was also rather talkative:

Image


There's more at the link.

Woland
landmark
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1) What happened to LBJ?
2) Is there any reason whatsoever for this "study" except as some bizarre right wing talking point?
Magnus Eisengrim
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LOL Woland. Being interested in social research, I of course wondered how he got these numbers. How can he compare word usage of American presidents?

Random selection? Nope.

Broad sample of their work? Nope

Entire corpus of their speeches? Nope.

So how did he pick them? He never says. He doesn't imply that he read more than what he chose.

Now who wrote these addresses? Nobody seriously thinks the presidents write their own material do they? Of course not, they have staff writers.

But that's ok Woland. You hadn't made an anti-Obama post for over 24 hours. I was wondering if you were ill.

John
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.--Yeats
landmark
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Beat you to it this time John. Smile
Magnus Eisengrim
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Quote:
On 2011-05-22 20:58, landmark wrote:
Beat you to it this time John. Smile


My pleasure.
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.--Yeats
Magnus Eisengrim
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Just for fun, I thought I'd run the test myself. I picked one of Ronald Reagan's speeches at the Presidency Project--the same site Cenedella picked his sample from. Reagan's "Farewell Address to the Nation" contains roughly 3300 words (depending on how you count). He uses "I" 72 times. So Reagan's (not very randomly) chosen speech is 50% longer than either of the Obama addresses, but contain more than double the usage of the word "I".

Well go figger.

John
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.--Yeats
Woland
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Magnus,

Mr. Cenedella chose addresses delivered to the CIA by each president. If you want to do your own experiment, then compare the Farewell Addresses of the 12 presidents whose speeches he analyzed. Don't just pick one.

Woland
Magnus Eisengrim
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The point, Woland, is that this is a stupid measure. But if I get some spare time and access to the texts I'll run the batch through a corpus analysis engine.

John
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.--Yeats
balducci
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Quote:
On 2011-05-22 18:51, Woland wrote:

Marc Cenedella has an interesting graph ...

There's more at the link.

Indeed there is. Marc ends in part by noting:

---
But putting a longer lens on it, we must also note that the present situation is one in which the nation’s security is primarily secured by the type of specialized, professional operations conducted by the CIA and special forces teams.

And with my CEO hat, I’d note that leadership sometimes requires the ‘I’ and not the ‘we’. In times of crisis, or in situations where significant or substantial organizational hurdles block the path to success, it can be the case that the leader needs to switch from the congratulatory ‘we’ to the responsibility and accountability of the ‘I’.

...

It may be that given the inevitable red tape, bureaucracy, and SNAFUs that undercut special teams’ operational effectiveness in the field, that the personal interest and commitment of the President is required as an indication to those who are putting their lives on the line.
---
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
Magnus Eisengrim
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Ok I must be bored. I compared the use of the word "I" in every inaugural address from Obama back to Kennedy. Make what you will of the results.

President Speech Length Use of "I" Rate
Barack Obama 2396 3 0.13%
GW Bush (2005) 2092 10 0.48%
GW Bush (2001) 1612 15 0.93%
Bill Clinton(1997) 2158 8 0.37%
Bill Clinton(1993) 1600 15 0.94%
GH Bush 2332 39 1.67%
Ronald Reagan (1985) 2598 13 0.50%
Ronald Reagan (1981) 2446 31 1.27%
Jimmy Carter 1226 6 0.49%
Richard Nixon (1973) 1805 16 0.89%
Richard Nixon (1969) 2128 29 1.36%
Lyndon Johnson 1508 15 0.99%
John Kennedy 1366 4 0.29%

This is interesting. If use of the first person singular indicates something awry with a President, then the worst offenders on the list are Ronald Reagan (1981), GH Bush, Richand Nixon (1969) and Lyndon Johnson. And the most humble of all, is Barack Obama.

Who would have predicted that? And if I had blogged it, who would have posted it to the Café? Such difficult questions for the day after the Rapture.

John

PS the table looked perfect before submitting. Sorry about the mess.
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.--Yeats
Woland
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Nice work. I wouldn't have expected Jimmy Carter to be the briefest. Or Barack Obama the wordiest.

Woland

P.S. You'll note that in my original post of Mr. Cenedella's results, the only President I mentioned was Richard Nixon, and it was to illustrate a point about how I remembered his speeches, that I posted the graphs. You guys were the one who rushed to the defense of President Obama - running when you weren't chased. Is that a form of Magician's Guilt?
balducci
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Quote:
On 2011-05-22 23:09, Woland wrote:

P.S. You'll note that in my original post of Mr. Cenedella's results, the only President I mentioned was Richard Nixon, and it was to illustrate a point about how I remembered his speeches, that I posted the graphs.

Right. You posted a link to an article entitled "I, Obama: The President and the personal pronoun" ONLY to make a point about Nixon.

Still, that might be remotely believable if not for your other posts in this thread including your original one.
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
landmark
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Right,--it's only the continuation of your long-time running posts against Nixon.
landmark
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You beat me to it balducci!!!!
Magnus Eisengrim
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Quote:
On 2011-05-22 23:09, Woland wrote:
Nice work. I wouldn't have expected Jimmy Carter to be the briefest. Or Barack Obama the wordiest.



Second wordiest. Both of Reagan's were longer.

John
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.--Yeats
balducci
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Quote:
On 2011-05-22 23:27, Magnus Eisengrim wrote:
Quote:
On 2011-05-22 23:09, Woland wrote:
Nice work. I wouldn't have expected Jimmy Carter to be the briefest. Or Barack Obama the wordiest.



Second wordiest. Both of Reagan's were longer.

John

LOL.

:applause: Smile Smile
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
acesover
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Quote:
On 2011-05-21 08:00, irossall wrote:
Quote:
On 2011-05-21 07:23, Woland wrote:
Au contraire. I think if you speak with men & women in the military, they understand that the President's interactions with them were all about them.


That very well may be true but the majority who watched it on tv were not military. It was a Bush photo-op for sure.
Iven Smile



As you said in your first post on this topic. "IN YOUR OPINION", and we all know about opinions. So yours is no different than anyone elses and means just as much except to yourself.

One should learn to keep their opinions to themselves as most people do not want to hear "opinions" as they have their own.

Now if you have some "facts" lets hear them. But stiffle the opinions.

As they say, "move on nothing here to see" just another meaningless opinion.
If I were to agree with you. Then we would both be wrong. As of Apr 5, 2015 10:26 pm I have 880 posts. Used to have over 1,000
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