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acesover
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The colonial times were famous for the often anonymous, libelous, newspapers and pamphlets. In some ways things never change.


Yea lots of anonymous newspapers and phamplets as everyone had a printing press in their house. And a way to deliver them to the masses. No one knew who wrote what. What are you smoking?
If I were to agree with you. Then we would both be wrong. As of Apr 5, 2015 10:26 pm I have 880 posts. Used to have over 1,000
acesover
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Quote:
On 2011-06-02 15:19, gdw wrote:
Lol.


Great comeback. Wow! Impressive.

As I said, Loser.
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acesover
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Quote:
On 2011-06-02 15:24, Payne wrote:
Quote:
On 2011-06-02 14:45, acesover wrote:
A militia is I believe for the most part a non paid defender of the public. Today it would be hard to get one with the attitudes many have. They are mostly receivers and not givers. I will not repeat but remember the words of JFK ask not...

At the time the constitution was written it probably was not vague as to what it meant, as everyone had a gun or guns in their homes.

Different times, different attitudes, different moral standards, different different different... No internet to hide behind and spout drivel. If you said something to say you probably had a reason to say it and were not embarassed to say it to someone face to face. Rather than just to incite and become as some here are known, a troll, with no real purpose in their life. Sort of like an insect that should be swatted. Their own life is lacking so they strike out at the good fortune and ideals of those who are more suscessful and happy in their lot, while they just slosh around in the mire they have created and blame it on everyone else. These people have all the answers. They just have no moral fibre or ambition, just nastiness inside them that they must let out and hurt others by their remarks. It makes them feel important if they can ridicule what others believe in and make fun of it. Like the kid at the playground who makes fun of everyone else but can not get along with anyone so he mocks those who do and says they are stupid and dumb so he looks for those who will agree with him.
They hang out together. We know them as losers.


And some people wonder why we didn't make the 10 Happiest Country list Smile


Payne,

Just to make yourself and others happy. Why don't you pick up and go to one of those other great countries and be happy? You have 10 to choose from...go for it. Why stay here and be miserable and disgruntled?
If I were to agree with you. Then we would both be wrong. As of Apr 5, 2015 10:26 pm I have 880 posts. Used to have over 1,000
Slide
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Ah...is this the love it or leave it argument. I never understood that. One of the basic principles of the US constitution is the freedom to criticize or even reject and throw out the government.

That said, I do know a number of people who have left the country to move to Australia specifically because of the healthcare and education issues here. In Sweden, Australia, and many other countries I've visited Education and Healthcare are taken care of. And everyone seemed happy, educated, healthy, and prosperous. Very little crime as well. I don't think there is anything wrong with looking at what is wrong with this country and trying to make it better. In fact it is un-american not to, in my humble opinion.

"Like the kid at the playground who makes fun of everyone else but can not get along with anyone so he mocks those who do and says they are stupid and dumb so he looks for those who will agree with him. "

If I had to choose someone who fit this discription based on the posts here, it seems acer is the one calling everyone losers and seems to be mocking people.

Ace, I checked out your posts for the last 30 days. Seems like most of your posts are on this offtopic list. Do you actually post on magic as well?
Payne
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Quote:
On 2011-06-02 16:18, acesover wrote:

Why stay here and be miserable and disgruntled?



Who says I'm miserable?

Besides watching you all on the right wallow in what you believe to be the sad state of affirs of todays world makes me happy Smile
"America's Foremost Satirical Magician" -- Jeff McBride.
acesover
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Just another comment on the 10 happiest countriesin the world. Probably all combined they do not have the population of the United States. Some of those comparsions is like saying that Texas has the happiest population in the world and it would have more people than some of these happy countries. I would not doubt that NYC has more people than some of these countries. Big deal. Now try and keep over three hundred milion people happy. I have an idea. Lets let some more illegals enter our country and get benefits...have to keep them happy also.

The old liars figure, and figures lie concept.

Also tired of hearing how much maternaty leave these countries give...well here we support their children all through High School and if they have more children we give them more money especially if they have no father because he sneaks back when the case worker is not around.
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acesover
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Quote:
On 2011-06-02 16:43, Payne wrote:
Quote:
On 2011-06-02 16:18, acesover wrote:

Why stay here and be miserable and disgruntled?



Who says I'm miserable?

Besides watching you all on the right wallow in what you believe to be the sad state of affirs of todays world makes me happy Smile


To you comment of: Who says I'm miserable?

You know what? You are right. You never said it or even implied it. I apologize.
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Slide
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Aces,

How much time have you spent living in another country other than the US?
Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On 2011-06-02 13:16, Payne wrote:
Quote:
On 2011-06-01 23:59, acesover wrote:

You ask: Do you consider the constitution to be a sacred untouchable document?


I tire of the American Exceptionalism crowd. Yes this country is a great place. One of the greatest. But it is not "THE" Greatest. No such place exists. Some countries are better at some things than we are while we exceed many countries in other things.


First off from an earlier part of your post, obviously the Constitution is NOT perfect, it can get closer to such as we ammend it. This is what makes it able to strive for perfection.

Second as to your quote above I would like to offer the notion that the American Exceptionalism crowd has some splinters in it (such as me) who believe we ARE exceptional, but can improve, and others do things well also. We are NOT the world leader in everything, could never be. I just want you to know that there are those of us who still believe in the idea, but within logical limits.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
acesover
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Quote:
On 2011-06-02 16:53, BillMcCloskey wrote:
Aces,

How much time have you spent living in another country other than the US?
\

Does Viet Nam count?
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No, that doesn't count , but certainly explains a lot.

Have you ever lived in another country in a non-military capacity? Have you traveled to other countries in a non-military capacity?

My theory is that people that espouse a love it or leave it attitude rarely have traveled far from home base (except in the military) and have few if any friends from other countries.

Personally I've lived in England (6 months when I was in school) France (3 months) Amsterdam, Japan, Brazil, Australia, and Sweden. I have good friends in all of those places. I've seen a lot of great things in those places that I wish happened here (particularly when it comes to health care and education).
acesover
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On 2011-06-02 17:18, BillMcCloskey wrote:
No, that doesn't count , but certainly explains a lot.

Have you ever lived in another country in a non-military capacity? Have you traveled to other countries in a non-military capacity?

My theory is that people that espouse a love it or leave it attitude rarely have traveled far from home base and have few if any friends from other countries.

Personally I've lived in England (6 months when I was in school) France (3 months) Amsterdam, Japan, Brazil, Australia, and Sweden. I have good friends in all of those places. I've seen a lot of great things in those places that I wish happened here (particularly when it comes to health care and education).


Well if Nam does not count then none unless you count layovers in airports.

I might add that at this juncture of my life I can live in any country I choose, and from friends that I have that live in this country that are from other countries, Germany and England I would definitely stay here in the United States from our conversations.

Having said that I woudl like to ask you where you now live? Are youfrom the U.S, and if so why is it you don't relocate to another country? However if you are in another country I congradulate you on following your heart to leave.

Also if you are basing your like or dislike on one issue. I feel you are being very narrow minded. It is like voting for someone running for office who you see eye to eye on one issue. So you vote for him because he is going to fix the roads where you live. Of course he is going to raise taxes, support Red China in developing a nuke and also help North Korea do the same. I am of course being sarcastic here but I hope you see my point.
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Slide
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I live here because my family is here and my business is here and I own a house here. The usual reasons people live where ever they live. There is nothing about America keeping me here. I'm here because my infrastructure is here. I am not getting your point about "basing like or dislike on one issue." Or do you think health care and education are unimportant issues like whether we should pave a road or not?

As an entrepreneur, I've given many people jobs, paid for their health care, generated millions of dollars in revenue and paid hundreds of thousands of dollars in taxes over the years. I have no problem with people criticizing the government. I could ask, if you don't like people exercising their rights to criticize and protest, why don't you go to another country that is more in line with your thinking, like China?
Dannydoyle
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I have lived in many other places. I think there are enough parts of our country that if you wanted to you could find what you are looking for. As a matter of fact this is why our country is designed the way it is but I am not going to get into that discussion. It is pointless.

The point is I have lived in Spain, Mexico, and a couple other places for extended periods of time. We can run our business from literally anywhere that has a phone and internet connection. We choose to live where we do. If the only thing that keeps you where you are is "infrastructure" and you could move if you wanted to, I think that is not such a great thing.
Danny Doyle
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<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
acesover
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Quote:
On 2011-06-02 17:42, BillMcCloskey wrote:
I live here because my family is here and my business is here and I own a house here. The usual reasons people live where ever they live. There is nothing about America keeping me here. I'm here because my infrastructure is here. I am not getting your point about "basing like or dislike on one issue." Or do you think health care and education are unimportant issues like whether we should pave a road or not?

As an entrepreneur, I've given many people jobs, paid for their health care, generated millions of dollars in revenue and paid hundreds of thousands of dollars in taxes over the years. I have no problem with people criticizing the government. I could ask, if you don't like people exercising their rights to criticize and protest, why don't you go to another country that is more in line with your thinking, like China?


Billy,

Anytime you want to compare notes you let me know. I am willing to wager I pay more property tax in a year than you do income tax. Not sure of what you do but I am as you put it also an entrepreneur. Maybe not as big as you but I doubt that. I am invested in 2 mini malls 16 and 22 stores. Along with my billiard parlors two of which are located in the malls. Partners in 2 national franchises and several apartment buildings. Also a used car lot that I am losing my rear on and looking to sell it.

I never said I did not like people critizing the government. I just don't like whiners. Don't whine, do something about it.

My point on a one issue cnandate is this. Suppose you are an advocate of gun control and you feel quite strongly about this. Well you have a canidate who sees things your way on this issue. However you are anti abortion and he is pro abortion along with his supporting gay marriage to which you are opposed. Is your gun control issue enough to sway you to support this man while he supports the other issues you distain? Are you willing to go for a one issue canidate? That is what I mean.

While Health Care is a major concern it is not the end all or a deal breaker. We do have a health care system in place and I do not mean the Obama plan. There are health care packages avaliable and while not cheap they are there so it would definitely not be a deal breaker for me as to where to live. It is one issue of many.

What the heck are you talking about my going to a country like China which is more in line with my thinking? Are you on meds? If so and you are taking them then stop. Also if you are on meds and have stopped taking them you better start again because because you definitely have issues in your thinking.

Just curious as you mention that America is not keeping you here. Where do you think it is you would rather take your family?
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LobowolfXXX
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To get a better sample, we could aggregate the "Where have you lived?" argument...

How many countries are there that if we counted the number of people who have emigrated from that country to the USA and the number of people who emigrated from the USA to that country, the latter number would exceed the former?
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
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Quote:
On 2011-06-02 13:16, Payne wrote:
Quote:
On 2011-06-01 23:59, acesover wrote:

You ask: Do you consider the constitution to be a sacred untouchable document?



I doubt the framers of the Constitution ever considered the document they created "sacred". They certainly didn't consider it untouchable as they made it amendable for future generations. Otherwise we'd still be able to deny rights to certain segments of our population. Though some would say we still do.

Thus the document is, well far is a bit extreme, but at least not as nearly perfect as some would like us to believe. For one the phrasing is in some places less than clear. This leads to arguments over intent and interpretation of certain segments. They could have simply said private ownership of guns is protected without bringing the whole militia thing into it. They could have been much more definitive on the whole church state thing as well. But it's the best document we have and it has worked moderately well for the last two and a half centuries. Especially if you discount that whole unfortunate 18th amendment boondoggle.

I tire of the American Exceptionalism crowd. Yes this country is a great place. One of the greatest. But it is not "THE" Greatest. No such place exists. Some countries are better at some things than we are while we exceed many countries in other things.

But to Jingoistically pound ones chest and blindly proclaim that the USA is the bestest country in all the world does no one any good at all. After all one learns from ones mistakes. So if one fails to see the flaws and issues at hand they will never try to correct the problems. They will fail to take the steps necessary to make this country the best place it could possibly be.


I agree with most of this post, but I disagree with the sentence "No such place exists." If there are some countries that are greater than others (and the line "Yes this country is a great place" implies agreement with that notion), then there's probably a greatest. I do agree that when you get down to the handful of "greatest" countries, it's hard to distinguish between them qualitatively, and that different countries have different plusses and minuses, but neither of those ideas makes those countries "equally" great.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
critter
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I disagree with the notion that believing the US to be the greatest country on Earth automatically blinds one to the flaws.
I know my friends aren't perfect, but they're still my favorite people. I know America isn't perfect, but she's still my favorite country.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
Dannydoyle
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Quote:
On 2011-06-02 19:44, critter wrote:
I disagree with the notion that believing the US to be the greatest country on Earth automatically blinds one to the flaws.
I know my friends aren't perfect, but they're still my favorite people. I know America isn't perfect, but she's still my favorite country.


Pretty much what I was trying to express.
Danny Doyle
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critter
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Well I agree then.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
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