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Jay Are Inner circle 4186 Posts |
Advice...always consider the sources of the advice you take...
xxx
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Heywood New user 34 Posts |
Mentalists do not cover.
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Sean Giles Inner circle Cambridge/ UK 3517 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-07-29 22:14, Heywood wrote: Please elaborate... |
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Heywood New user 34 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-07-30 12:57, seangiles wrote: The audience wants to be entertained as a primary focus. Move through the question and into something new. If I were truly reading your mind, and I did not receive your thoughts I would not have an out. I would move on to a person or refocus on something else. Outs were invented to boost a perception of reality that is not realistic. Thought transmission is not foolproof... neither should we be fool proof. If I were real and I was accused of switching a billet, I would be puzzled by an accusation of trickery. I would not know how to address it. |
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luva74 New user Little Rock, AR 54 Posts |
This thread was discussed in detail on the Magic Rush podcast. Episode 017 and at the beginning of Episode 018: http://www.magicrush.net
Also on iTunes: a search for "Magic Rush" should bring it up. |
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Decomposed Eternal Order High Desert 12059 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-07-31 01:15, Heywood wrote: What he said. Decomp
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Sean Giles Inner circle Cambridge/ UK 3517 Posts |
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On 2011-07-31 01:15, Heywood wrote: Then that is how you would cover. You would be puzzled by the accusation and move on. And I agree with you... |
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MagicTobe Loyal user 259 Posts |
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On 2011-07-15 22:05, DallasCarter wrote: Nice to see some humble and peaceful magicians on the Café. As for your questions: 1. I would first of all try to make the best out of it or deny that they "caught" me.By pretending it was intended. For this specific case I would have probably said that it helps me concentrate or something like "well this is not sleight of hand, but sleight of mind.. but if you really want me to put my hands away.." I would then either go into Luke Jermays way of doing the puls stop (impromptu, no apparent trickery) or perform another failsafe mentalist effect that I always keep prepared for these cases. 2. Somebody, I think it was Sankey, said "Leave them wanting more" My spectators always BEG me to perform one more miracle.. but I never do! |
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Heywood New user 34 Posts |
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On 2011-08-04 03:08, Sean Giles wrote: Puzzled is a state of mind. It is not cover. I have done shows where I blew 70% of my revelations and still got full applause. Cover is failure and does not deserve applause... oh, unless you are a magician. |
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Sean Giles Inner circle Cambridge/ UK 3517 Posts |
Welcome to the Café. it sounds like you need to spend more time rehearsing. Screwing up 70% of your act doesn't really deserve applause either, now does it?
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
Sean-
Heywood is actually a very experienced and highly skilled performer. (Although I agree that his statement about being wrong 70% of the time and still getting applause might seem a bit odd if you don't know him or haven't seen him work.) He's also a good friend of mine and we share a similar sense of humor as well as a willingness to take chances during shows just to see what we can get away with. His point that there is no need for a mentalist to "cover" errors is exactly right. That's something that magicians do. "Real" mind reading, after all, is not an exact science. Good thoughts, Bob |
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Sean Giles Inner circle Cambridge/ UK 3517 Posts |
That's fair enough Bob. It was the 'unless you're a magician' comment that got me. It's the classic put down used on here, wielded with all the subtlety of an axe in the back!
I do agree that a mentalist should have no need to cover errors of accuracy. It is a magician thing where everything must be completely accurate and real mind reading wouldn't work like that. It would probably be fragmented and difficult to receive and not at all 100% accurate. Having said that though, when gimmicks are in play there is always the possibility of getting caught, as in the case of our young friend on here with his p_d. Hasn't happened to me. Yet. But I've had my p_d questioned before. I always carry a second one that can be checked. I know this isn't an issue so much for stage workers but I'm talking close-up. I think chucking a swi___ed p_d to someone and saying 'check it out' is a legitimate cover (only) if someone in a group is insisting there's something funny about the p_d you're using. Happy days. It's a Bank holiday in the UK. A gig this afternoon and then no work till Tuesday |
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StuartNolan Elite user 479 Posts |
"If I were real and I was accused of switching a billet, I would be puzzled by an accusation of trickery."
I don't mean this in any critical way or to be needlessly pedantic but rather in support of your argument but... Isn't this actually a form of cover, albeit a natural and subtle kind?
"One should always be a little improbable." - Oscar Wilde
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
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On 2011-08-27 04:12, Sean Giles wrote: No, Sean, I didn't mean it that way at all! What I meant was that a cover is often NECESSARY in magic. When a trick goes wrong a magician needs to find another way out to cover the mistake lest he come across looking incompetent. Since a mentalist does not present what he is doing as a "trick", that type of cover isn't necessary. Sorry you took what I said as a put-down magic. It wasn't. It's just that the rules of mentalism are completely different. And THAT'S what far too many would-be mentalists fail to understand. Good thoughts, Bob PS- I LOVE magic when it is done well. I started out as a magician doing a silent manipulation act, backpalming, split fans and all. But I hated working to music and much preferred to talk. (I still do golf ball manipulations in front of the bathroom mirror to amuse myself and occasionally do magic to amuse the little kids in my neighborhood.) |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
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On 2011-08-27 04:38, StuartNolan wrote: It depends on how you interpret "cover". I took it as being a reference to "outs", or the alternative endings magicians often use to bring a screwed up trick to a satisfactory conclusion. Best- Bob |
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Sean Giles Inner circle Cambridge/ UK 3517 Posts |
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On 2011-08-27 04:49, mastermindreader wrote: Hey Bob, I think we have crossed wires here. When I said 'It was the 'unless you're a magician' comment that got me', I was referring to the previous poster. I didn't think you were using any put-downs at all. I too started out as a magician. My first love was coin magic and even the card magicians look down on the coin guys! It's a funny old business. My 4 year old daughter loves the coin stuff, especially when the coin vanishes and I blow it out of my nose! I don't think she'd really appreciate a drawing duplication just yet, maybe in another 10 years |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
Oh, I see what you mean. He said, "Unless you're a magician" and I said, "That's what magicians do." Basically the same thing, but knowing Heywood as I do I don't think he meant it as a put-down, either. I think he just means that FOR A MENTALIST a 'cover' is failure and doesn't deserve applause. But in the case of a magician, a recovery from an obvious mistake would indeed be applause worthy.
At least that's what I THINK he meant. Best- Bob |
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David Thiel Inner circle Western Canada...where all that oil is 4005 Posts |
Sometimes, in magic or mentalism, s*it happens. You keep rolling...and the less focus you bring to the fact that something's wrong, the better. The audience looks where the performer looks...and the audience notices what the performer focuses on. If there's a plausible explanation, I take it...if not...keep rolling.
David
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except bears. Bears will kill you.
My books are here: www.magicpendulums.com www.MidnightMagicAndMentalism.com |
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StuartNolan Elite user 479 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-08-27 04:57, mastermindreader wrote: True nuff I was just enjoying interpreting "cover" in the same way a spy might, as a cover story and identity. That's closer to how a mentalist may operate than a magician perhaps. Thinking in that way certain actions may risk blowing your cover but the best action is simply to keep calm and stay true to your cover story. We can spend too much time concerned with mechanical and dexterous methods and risk forgetting that our most powerful tools are character, attitude, moxy and poise.
"One should always be a little improbable." - Oscar Wilde
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Heywood New user 34 Posts |
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On 2011-08-27 06:01, mastermindreader wrote: Correct. I was not meaning it as a put down. When I perform as a magician - which I do on occasion - I have outs. As a mentalist, I do not worry about outs and cover. |
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