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DWRackley Inner circle Chattanooga, TN 1909 Posts |
I didn’t take it as offensive to me. I was just recognizing that I can get pretty opinionated at times, and you made a valid point. We’re all using the tools we have to entertain an audience. That (entertainment) comes first.
(Plus, this branch is still new and exciting to me, and I have to keeping checking myself that I don’t pull any stupid newbie stuff! ) Good Thoughts!
...what if I could read your mind?
Chattanooga's Premier Mentalist Donatelli and Company at ChattanoogaPerformers.com also on FaceBook |
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~Cicero Veteran user 397 Posts |
Great entertainment is great entertainment. The opposite is also true...
Brian
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kcalB Special user Took me 16 years to make 999 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-07-19 13:33, Christophercarter wrote: Sleepy Hollow on The Hudson ? If so were neighbors. SB
"Klaatu barada nikto"
Former Member of P.E.A. Creator of The Clearly Q&A Board Alumni ECSSI ECSSII ECSSIII ECSSIV ECSSV BizarreHauntingsI |
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Shrubsole Inner circle Kent, England 2455 Posts |
Are any of these available in ENGLISH as they are unreadable in the language they are written in!
Winner of the Dumbringer Award for total incompetence. (All years)
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blackESP Regular user 107 Posts |
Eshla is strangely absent ... is this him off the meds?!
(Joke ;-) |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
I am NOT bald!
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Shrubsole Inner circle Kent, England 2455 Posts |
For once I feel sorry for the moderators (Doesn't happen often!) That's a lot of extra work they've got there!
Winner of the Dumbringer Award for total incompetence. (All years)
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Frank Douglas Special user 555 Posts |
Bob
I think he meant BOLD. I assume that due to the lack of grammatical accuracy in the previous posts. |
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David Thiel Inner circle Western Canada...where all that oil is 4005 Posts |
**sigh**
Some people's kids. Geez. David
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Except bears. Bears will kill you.
My books are here: www.magicpendulums.com www.MidnightMagicAndMentalism.com |
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Shrubsole Inner circle Kent, England 2455 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-07-19 18:31, Frank Douglas wrote: The English is so bad that it could be any four letter word beginning with 'B' or one that doesn't of any length!
Winner of the Dumbringer Award for total incompetence. (All years)
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Pakar Ilusi Inner circle 5777 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-07-19 09:34, krakhead wrote: Leave him be. Better for all of us that only a few "get it". Hope he never ever gets it, it is one less competitor.
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
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Dynamike Eternal Order FullTimer 24148 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-07-19 09:34, krakhead wrote: Your friend must be from Pluto. |
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quicknotist Special user 888 Posts |
Just tell your friend you were expecting his text.
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Bill Hallahan Inner circle New Hampshire 3222 Posts |
Quote:
Tell him this:
That applies to your interpretation of his show too. If his audience's like his show, then he's doing something right.
Humans make life so interesting. Do you know that in a universe so full of wonders, they have managed to create boredom. Quite astonishing.
- The character of ‘Death’ in the movie "Hogswatch" |
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Thomas Cooper Special user 935 Posts |
I highly disagree Bill, the audience appreciation is NOT the final word in how good a performer is. The Masked Magician got 15 million viewers and went on for many seasons, clearly people found the show entertaining on some level. It does not mean he was a good magician or performer.
One cannot base a performers ability on the public, just as one cannot merit a film by the amount of money it makes. The Shawshank Redemption is often voted (and widely considered) the best film of all time, and yet it has only made $50,000,000 in its whole history ever since 1994. Transformers 2 (Revenge of the Fallen) is widely considered by movie critiques to be the worst movies of the last decade, and has gained internet fame from being such a terrible film; while it has garned a total of $830,000,000 since 2009 alone. The public are not good judges of performers. Very few people actually are good judges of entertainment, and usually its best if they only judge their own speciality (i.e I would never claim to be a good judge of a dancing contest, but I believe I know a good Magician when I see one). There seems to be a line somewhere between a popular performer, and a good quality performer. They are not the same thing. Criss Angel is popular; he is not a good performer. At this point I have given enough examples to make my case. Though the question remains of what is vital to make a good Magician or Mentalist? Personally I believe that one vital part of being good is to be able to fool them, to not let them know how the effects are done. Another requirement of being a Mentalist (to me atleast) is to create a belief in the audience, that belief may be that you posses psychic powers, a belief in the afterlife and spirits, or it may just be a belief of psychological abilities and the power of the human mind. Perhaps that is the difference between Magicians and Mentalists: Mentalist must make them believe. Tom xx
I call myself "Thomas Cooper" here because this stops the magic café appearing when people google my stage name.
Does anyone else find the term "Special User" to be a bit condescending? |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
The Shawshank Redemption is "widely considered the best film of all time" ???
Honestly, Tom, do you just make stuff up as you go along? Ever hear of a little film called "Citizen Kane"? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AFI%27s_100_Years...100_Movies And Bill, of course, is correct. Without a lay audience, the illusion of mentalism cannot exist. It is the audience, and the audience alone, who passes final judgment on any performer. It's SHOW business, remember? (You don't give 'em a good show, and you're out of business.) The Rt. Rev. Dr. Bob |
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MentalistCreationLab Inner circle 1528 Posts |
"That applies to your interpretation of his show too. If his audience's like his show, then he's doing something right."
Well said. |
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Bill Hallahan Inner circle New Hampshire 3222 Posts |
Thomas Cooper wrote:
Quote:
I highly disagree Bill, the audience appreciation is NOT the final word in how good a performer is. The Masked Magician got 15 million viewers and went on for many seasons, clearly people found the show entertaining on some level. It does not mean he was a good magician or performer. I almost added the caveat, "within the bounds of good taste and ethics" to my sentence, but it's not necessary to qualify that. My post was in the context of the quote in the first post, which I quoted. I'm reasonably certain the case in the first post had nothing to do with ethics, and everything to do with performance style. I'm sure if it ethics was the issue, that would have been mentioned. And thanks Bob. Quote:
The public are not good judges of performers. I will bold part of my quote bold for you: Quote:
What matters is how the audience feels about a performance. What performers think might or might not be relevant, but if the performance isn't well-received by the intended audience, then it's not good performance art. If the target is the general public, then their opinion is the only relevant opinion to the performer. If the target is a number of F.I.S.M. judges, then their opinion is what matters.
Humans make life so interesting. Do you know that in a universe so full of wonders, they have managed to create boredom. Quite astonishing.
- The character of ‘Death’ in the movie "Hogswatch" |
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mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts |
Additionally, Tom, your argument is self contradictory. You begin by saying that only a person with expertise in a given art form can judge it. But you conclude that a mentalist should be judged solely on his ability to create belief in his audience.
The logical conclusion, then, would be that a good mentalist would be able to cause OTHER MENTALISTS (since they would be the only ones to have expertise in the field) to believe in his powers. That, of course, is impossible, for no one with expertise in the techniques of mentalism would end up "believing" the performer. On the other hand, if, as you conclude, the degree to which an audience is led to believe is, in fact, the criteria by which a mentalist is to be judged, then the only measure of success is whether or not he can instill belief in a lay audience. Ergo, the response of the lay audience is, by your own definition, what measures the performer's ability. Good thoughts, Bob |
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parmenion Inner circle Switzerland/Zürich 3988 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-07-19 23:04, Dynamike wrote: lol, Dynamike, that line is great!
“I love talking about nothing. It is the only thing I know anything about.”
<BR>Oscar Wilde experimentaliste <br> <BR>Artist pickpocket Professional <BR> <BR>Looking for the best book test in French? send me a PM! |
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