I've perused the many threads regarding the various gimmicks available (Tony Clark, Norm Nielsen, Precision, etc.), and I've got a question taht isn't covered in any of the posts I read.

Do all of the gimmicks permit the "rose" to be removed from one's lapel intact before being transformed into a silk? Most, but not all, of the few video clips I've seen show the rose being transformed into a silk as it is being pulled off of the lapel.

Information from those who own and/or have used these gimmicks would be very much appreciated.

Donal, I owned and used Abbott's and Norm Nielsen's gimmicks. Both can be used by either method. I think you are really thinking of a personal way to handle the transformation of the rose. Or possible they just don't know that it is possible to pull the scarf from the rose.

I have seen published there are a few other methods not using a gimmick as well. Snaps, straight pins, elastic straps, and other methods have been devised by other performers.

Thanks, Bill. Since reset between performances will be an issue, I'm going to experiment with a few of the gimmicks first and see which (if any) will meet my needs.

Donal, I PM you.

Donal,

So did I.

David

Thanks to you both. I'm much obliged.

If I understand Donal's question correctly, Shimada performs the rose to silk that way. He removes the rose completely from the lapel and then in his hand the flower changes to the silk. The November 1985 issue of GENII featured Shimada on the cover and has a number of effects from Shimada's act, including (on page 307) a written (but not illustrated) description of Shimada's rose-to-silk effect. I also believe that the solution to the problem is not so much which gimmick is used, but the manner in which the silk is rolled.

Lance Burton in his first appearance on "The Tonight Show" also performed the rose to silk by first removing the rose from the lapel and effecting the change in his hand.

----- Amado "Sonny" Narvaez

Thanks, Sonny! I'm off to Ask Alexander to Research that Genii issue...

I have always pulled it off of the lapel before making it change to a silk. My issue is with the way it's rolled up. I have yet to see one that "really" looks like a rose. It's a throw away bit, so I don't think the audience has a chance to analyze it. But, it would be nice though if there was a method of rolling it up where it really can be a fooler.

I have always, pulled the silk from the flower, and if you have not seen one that looks like a flower then you have seen a poorly prepared silk. It is very simple and looks good from a distance. I have seen some that don't look like a flower from professionals, but it is all in your perspective as to what a flower looks like.

During the past several weeks I've experimented with the Nielsen gimmick, the Abbotts gimmick, the Tony Clark gimmick, Duane Laflin's no-gimmick version that uses a pair of magnets and Shimada's no-gimmick version.

IMO, the one that results in the best looking "flower" is the Tony Clark gimmick. However, with the Clark gimmick you cannot remove the flower intact and then change it into a silk.

Everything's a trade-off...

I guess I misunderstood your OP, I thought you wanted to remove the silk from center and have it visually transform into a silk.

I will PM you some added information on a good looking flower.

I have a silk winder from an unknown manufacturer which winds the silk quite nicely and the flower looks great. I can pull it off intact and turn it into a silk just fine without any problems.



I completely agree with that statement. I have many versions of this gimmick and I have never had a problem making the silk look like a real rose with any of them. Further, if you have prepared the silk correctly with some of them, you can in fact remove the flower intact before you change it into a silk.

I just remembered that Johnny Hirose has a really neat silk and ring routine that starts with a silk rose on the lapel, which is removed whole and then transformed into a silk. It looks like a real rose on your lapel too. The effect/routine is called Ring and Silk.

You can see Johnny Hirose's routine performed on the Stevens Magic site at
http://www.stevensmagic.com/index.php?ma......_id=8002

----- Amado "Sonny" Narvaez

Thanks for the link, Sonny.

I like Norm Nielsen gimmick and you can take out the flower before changing to silk.

I believe Peter White's gimmick (which is much like Nielsen's) allows you re to remove the silk as a rose and change it.

Richard

Anyone use the Tony Clark version?

I have seen Tony clark version. Like mention earlier can not remove the flower intact before changing to silk