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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Finger/stage manipulation » » Disrespecting Fred Kaps (7 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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mtpascoe
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Every once in a while, I get into the mood to put on a clip from youtube of some of my favorite magicians. I clicked on Fred Kaps clip from the Ed Sullivan show where he appeared the same night as the Beatles. I love this performance of him. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYh_vPGApbo

Anyway, I was reading some of the comments left by those viewing it and of course they were of the usual kind, stating how wonderful he was and so on. Then I came across a series of comments that totally disrespected the great man. I wrote back, but of course when you converse with someone that is headstrong, you can’t change their mind. Here is the comments that was left:

heelfan1234 says: At just after 3:25 he turns his body to the right, gets the shaker from hat with his left hand, but you can see his right hand go round the back of his body and get the salt pour gimmick, just a palm size container filled with salt. This is where all the salt comes from and it isn't that magical. I thought this routine was a bit of a yawn with all the overacting and him mouthing the word "salt". So what if it's salt, sugar or cocaine! We all saw him load the gimmick at 3:26 !
1 month ago
• At 4:31 - 4:32 you can see him ditch the salt pour gimmick in his coat tail pockets.
heelfan1234 1 month ago
CaraBrimleyRules is the most ignorant of the poster. She says: Well I didn't like it at all. Obvious how the salt pour was done when he obtained the gimmick from behind his back at 3:25 and just after. Also this magician can't act properly. His expressions are completely false and exaggerated, he can't speak very good English either. He looks like a complete amateur!
1 month ago
• @8chevalier8 liked the Homing Card. The poster said: The Homing Card is so lovely. You can see the direct connection in Kaps's stage persona to Tommy Wonder. The bemused magician, seemingly not in full control of his trick, as perplexed as his audience is amazed. Same with Cardini in a way. All the skill tempered with humility and humor.
Then CaraBrimleyRules once again shows her ignorance of magic: Sorry this is a completely lame trick using double/sticky rough/smooth cards. And it is completely overacted. If he performed this effect on a talent show today he wouldn't even get past the auditions. Or he may be included in a later round, only to be discarded as "joke value".
CaraBrimleyRules 1 month ago
I responded: Shows you what you know. I have the complete trick and it uses all sleight of hand. The last move is an Erdnase Color Change which is very difficult to do. The man's showmanship is brilliant. It sure beats the lame attempts I see on youtube where someone is performing in their t-shirts and have no personality.
This man Kaps was a three time world champ. Until you can claim that, please don't comment on what you don't know.
mtpascoe 11 hours ago
CaraBrimleyRules came back and said: Yeah the Erdnase change is not that difficult, it is revealed all over you tube. Anyway, this is all completely overacted pulling stupid faces. If he cam up before Simon Cowell he would get the red X! This Bram Bongers would not win a minor talent show today!!
The salt pour is done with a gimmick which holds all the salt which he steals from behind his back at 3:24 to 3:27
CaraBrimleyRules 2 hours ago

**********************

The reason I am posting here in the Manipulation section is that the readers here have knowledge about stage sleight of hand and can respond. And for the record, just because the Erdnase change is on youtube, doesn’t make it easy. After I learned the sleight, I had to practice it over and over to make sure I could do it without thinking like Kaps. She is so disrespectful and has no clue about performing. I wish that some of the magicians here can go to Kaps defense being that he can’t do it himself on go on youtube comments and give your opinion.
Peter Pitchford
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I find this attitude both on youtube and even in magic clubs. When a newbie knows just enough to get an ego, he just likes to point out to the world, "I know how this is done!" Ask him/her to do it for a paying crowd. #1 they don't even know how to get paying gigs and #2 they could not execute it well enough to do a paying gig. I think it is an ego phase that many of us go through. Hopefully we grow out of it quickly.
mtpascoe
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I hope so. This girl Cara goes on every video of Kaps and makes comments like this. On one of them, she says that Criss Angel is better, so you know where she is coming from.
Wizzard
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Mtpascoe
Thank you for posting the Fred Kaps routine. I start to smile, the begin to laugh out loud. Fred Kaps is just such a technician when it come to his routines. The beauty is the fact that once his routine was set it did not change. He was stable, not off the cuff, it was all scripted and beautifully done. There are not enough people who really care about the performance, they only want to criticize the performer. I am old enough to remember the 60's magic and magicians. Fred Kaps thought 'outside of the box' that's why he was such a star. Probably a good thing he was European.
Regards,
John
It's never the wand, it's always the magician
mtpascoe
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I saw this broadcast http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJ3wR9IClWY&feature=related when I was a teenager in the 70s. I didn't know who he was then, but to me, it was pure magic. I have not seen an artist like that until I saw Slydini on Dick Cavett. It's too bad that he had died a few years after this. Those that go on youtube to critique him might as well be saying that Michelangelo was a hack or dissing the Beatles. No respect for those that paved the way for us.
Bill Hegbli
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Ignorance is blitz on the Internet, if they only knew what they were talking about! That is what the Internet invites, stupid people making stupid statement about things they know nothing about and people that don' aspire to improve themselves. They have no desire to do anything but draw attention to themselves. Being they are untalented beings, making outrageous statements, draws attention to them, and strokes their egos. It is best to just ignore them, after stating they known nothing of what they are talking about.
Vietnam Veteran 1967, Sgt. E-5

Graduate of Chavez College of Prestidigitation and Showmanship

"Magic With A Twist Of Comedy"
mtpascoe
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I think ignoring is a good idea. But, it's tough. I remember going on the wiki page of the great writer Ray Bradbury and seeing disrespecting fools change his page and put hateful comments on there just to have it removed. Then a few days later it goes right back up again just to have it removed... once again.

Bradbury is still alive and I wonder if he has ever gone on there and saw that. I'm sure all of his years of writing, he has proven himself as literary giant. Then you have those that "tag" his bio page. Fred Kaps is dead. He can't defend himself. Thank God he is not around to see this this treatment of him.
Bill Hegbli
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Remember there is freedom of speech on the Internet, the only problem with the Internet, it does not provide the ramifications that comes from actually knowing who the person is, so they go unpunished, that usually comes about in real life. So they are only weak beings that allows creepy people to do hateful things.

As I said before, just tell them they do not know what they are talking about because the do not have the education to make informed statements.

Then move on, or get off the Internet as it will affect you in a negative way, and that is not good for your well being. Just let it go.

This is just like the statements sometimes made here on the Café. People making statements of things when they did not do the work to prove their statements.

Or when a new product is mentioned and you get pages and pages of questions and statements trying to put down product or guess at the method.
Vietnam Veteran 1967, Sgt. E-5

Graduate of Chavez College of Prestidigitation and Showmanship

"Magic With A Twist Of Comedy"
Pete Biro
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Ignorant fools not worth responding to.
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
mtpascoe
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Pete, when I saw this, I thought about you. You knew Fred very well and it was one of the reasons I posted this. Both of the posters are bullhead and won't change their mind. This Cara and the other twerp, I can't think of his name, but he calls Kaps by his given name Bongers. I don't think this is out of respect, I think he was trying to be little him.

After the first post I made, I haven't responded since then. I have read their other attacks on Kaps and it just makes me mad, but like you said, it's not worth responding to.
Markymark
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I wish more people who put up the clips would just disable all comments.It's easily done and no smart alec can post anything.
[My internet was down last night and I'd no friends for 24 hours!]
''In memory of a once fluid man,crammed and distorted by the classical mess'' -Bruce Lee
Pop Haydn
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They are children. They enjoy getting your goat more than making any kind of point. Why fight with kids who only want to try to upset you?
61magic
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Quote:
On 2011-09-29 19:37, mtpascoe wrote:
This girl Cara goes on every video of Kaps and makes comments like this. On one of them, she says that Criss Angel is better, so you know where she is coming from.

Maybe this Cara person can look at a Criss Angel's performance 30 years from and realize what a terrible performer he is. Kaps will be remembered long after Criss Angel is gone from the scene.

LMFAO
Professor J. P. Fawkes
mtpascoe
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Pop you are correct about getting others goat. I have read the other posts she has made on Kaps and she gets into it with another magician who is defending him. It gets ugly with name calling, kind of up her ally it seems like. She seems to enjoy it. She reduces magic to just moves, saying so what and such. That's like saying that the Mona Lisa was painted with brush strokes, what's the big deal about it or Romeo and Juliet was just a bunch of words. Anyone that would reduce the Mona Lisa to a bunch of brush strokes or a great routine like Kaps salt trick to bunch of moves with a gimmick, can't appreciate art.

61magic you are correct. Let's see how Criss Angel's body of work holds up 30 years from now. He is already a has been.
JamesinLA
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I say, take the clip down. Post it again under slightly different name, disable comments. This way, fools are denied their forum.

Jim
Oh, my friend we're older but no wiser, for in our hearts the dreams are still the same...
magicians
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Quote:
On 2011-09-30 14:41, JamesinLA wrote:
I say, take the clip down. Post it again under slightly different name, disable comments. This way, fools are denied their forum.

Jim

Agreed, I also "report this comment".
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
Larry Barnowsky
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A wise adage: Don't feed the trolls
Levent
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Hi Guys:

I believe everyone has a right to have an opinion, but NOT everyone has an informed opinion. For instance I have an opinion about how to prevent a disaster like the one at the Fukishima nuclear plant. But being that I have no education in nuclear physics, civil engineering or a dozen other sciences related to nuclear plants, my opinion cannot and should not have the same weigh as that of an expert.

So in this case you have a great magician on YouTube and the open nature of the internet forum allows people without a strong knowledge of the subject publishing opinions. Haydn is right, these are mostly kids and most of the time they are more interested in stirring up a conflict (AKA Trolls) while hiding comfortably in the anonymity provided by the internet

As for me, I follow this basic rule: Only publish things that you are willing to say to a person face to face.

You can certainly differ with people on all matters big and small, but if everyone followed that rule then I think the internet would be a far more civil place.

One last thing: In the 2001 comedy film "Silent Bob and Jay Strike Back", at the end of the film the two heros get a lot of money and decide to spend it flying around the world, tracking down ALL the people who said bad things about them on internet forums. If that were to really take place, the internet would be a lot more civil overnight! LOL!

The above mentioned scene is on YouTube. Warning, it has a lot of profanity and violence, so if bad language bothers you, DON"T watch it. HERE is the link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tsXKAtpLm4I&feature=related
mtpascoe
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Boy, some real wise words from those that I respect. What you said about meeting people face to face is so true. On Whit's wonderful forum, there was this Transexual who was always a fresh air on these boards. Her comments where always witty and fun. But, then she got attacked by those who find offense to such things and that wonderful spirit was silenced on this board. It was a shame.

The real dangerous part was that she was being stocked by some of these guys. It could have turned dangerous. It definitely got ugly. I won't name names, those on that site know the situation.

I guess the point that Levent is trying to make is, if you can't say anything to someone in person then don't be a chicken and bully anyone on the internet. Enough said.
Alan Munro
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When posting magic videos on YouTube, just disable the comments. There's no sense in giving a jerk a soapbox to stand on.
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