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Octopus Sun Special user Wiggle Wiggle 586 Posts |
Quote:
Mb217 wrote: Thanks Du, and hey, "Whence come you?" FTLOTHSJOJ |
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ljh21 Regular user Philadelphia 112 Posts |
I agree with you MS
This is a stepping stone for Ryan and others. You tell it like it is Ryan. You don't try to claim a retention vanish as some new slieght,move or technique that you have invented. You don't proclaim it is different because your figernail never touches the coin or somthing like that. You don't have your friends backing you up with these absurd proclamations so you can sell it online to the unknowing. Don't be afraid to share with others some will appreciate it some won't that's just how it is. J-Mac you are so right Dennis has a great retention and I remember his videos from the Depot. |
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Jonathan Townsend Eternal Order Ossining, NY 27297 Posts |
We magicians often find ourselves in a strange position during routines where we make great show of empty hands at some moments and later on attempt to gain that same audience perception from cramped and awkward displays. The "Doug Henning" type display might serve to teach the audience to expect such displays and they may well ask for that at moments when you are holding out.
The abuse of high fingerpalm (clip craw) and low fingerpalm as ""Ramsay Subtlety"" can risk exposure. There is great risk in drawing attention to an unnaturally poised hand and greater risk asking folks to "not notice" where a coin was which is so very close to where a coin could still be. IMHO folks can gain more utility from the subtle displays after spending some time making the less confrontational basics like transfers, hold and hide, learning to use a pull, servante, cuffing, pants pockets etc to have options where you have an empty hand to display. That "Doug Henning" gesture/display is a tough habit to lose after its acquired. Been there, done that, spent years unlearning it. ;) Jon BTW, Ramsay smoked and had some clever work using the cigarette to motivate a coin transfer that serious students might find instructive. It, along with other uses of the Ramsay Subtlety are in The Ramsay Legend by Andrew Galloway.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
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J-Mac Inner circle Ridley Park, PA 5338 Posts |
Thank you JT. Some great comments in there!
Jim |
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solrak29 Special user NY Metro 936 Posts |
To be fair, I only got as far as watching you do the effect where the half turns
into two quarters. So, at the very least, it was motivational for me to check my self, uh, I mean my RV. So here are a couple of thoughts... In comparison to the videos I saw posted in this thread alone, I would say (and probably for my self too)that the retention needs work. But I have to admit that my initial reactions before seeing the other videos was that your work was OK. I also liked the instruction and some of the points you emphasized in execution. This might be nit picky but... Though I liked the concept where you said "go somewhere with it". The part I didn't really care for is where you said "go to the pocket". I suspect this was said impromptu but going to the pockets generally raises a red flag in anyone's eyes. On last thing, pertaining to the video, is I think the video quality could be better as when you move real fast things get blurred. Quote:
Ryan Bliss is giving a free help for beginners in coin magic, and that for itself is remarkable. I like free as much as the next guy and I know we are all magicians here and that most penguinites would also be of the order, but I'm not sure if this is really a good thing. Quote:
Its free so I don't think this counts as product promoting haha. Not promoting a product per se, but...nevermind... I do want to thank you for sharing this with us and being brave enough to elicit comments. I'm sure, as it did for me, that this motivated us more experienced guys to pick some coin up and compare and contrast; and/or practice; and/or post links on the subject. So thanks for that...like to hear/see more from ya...
To Find Me On The Pitch, Follow me :On Twitter
Checkout my pseudo blog : The Sidewalk Performers Forum "I intend to live forever, or die trying" - Groucho Marx |
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Mb217 Inner circle 9520 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-10-28 21:10, Duaut wrote: I knew there was something more than just magical about you. My brother.
*Check out my latest: Gifts From The Old Country: A Mini-Magic Book, MBs Mini-Lecture on Coin Magic, The MB Tanspo PLUS, MB's Morgan, Copper Silver INC, Double Trouble, FlySki, Crimp Change - REDUX!, and other fine magic at gumroad.com/mb217magic
"Believe in YOU, and you will see the greatest magic that ever was." -Mb |
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ljh21 Regular user Philadelphia 112 Posts |
As this young mans mechanics have inspired us to evaluate our own ROV's as SOLRAK29 has said (and it has for me as well.) And Jonathan is right the spectator only percives that the coin has vanished not the method. We should then try to make the coin vanish as convincingly as possible (regardless of method) and if your retention is the best for you then that is the method you should use if not experiment and find what works best. It is always good to keep the guns loaded in case you need them. Repetition has it's pros and cons.
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J-Mac Inner circle Ridley Park, PA 5338 Posts |
Amen, ljh21!
And to be honest, though everyone wants to use the ROV it is definitely NOT the best vanish for most folks. It's a little like driving: everyone insists they are great drivers when the opposite is usually true! All coin slingers insist they have a great ROV.... (not!) Thanks! Jim |
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Atom3339 Inner circle Spokane, WA 3242 Posts |
ROV Vanish is great to use sparinging. Just to mix it up. Just to cause some doubt.
TH
Occupy Your Dream |
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Ryan Bliss Regular user 136 Posts |
Hey guys, I have read everything you have said, and I would like to respond with some thoughts.
My intentions for this video were purely to put out an easily accessible medium in which to learn a decent retention vanish. I can not lie and say mine is the best ever, but I do believe that mine is more than substantial. Many people do the retention better than I do, however for the purposes of teaching, I honestly believe that mine is good enough to allow me to teach it. As for the debate on weather the retention should be done slow or fast, I will address my approach that debate now: I have seen many magicians to the vanish slow, and I seen others do it at some speed. For me, the whole purpose of a retention vanish is to have your spectators convinced that the coin IS REALLY put into the hand. Therefore, if that is your goal, then speed is really a trivial question. The way I think about it is this, if your retention looks good, then it looks believable. Whether it takes you 1 sec, or 5 secs to do it is not really important. Remember this, the the vanish is not the EFFECT. The vanish is just one component to a larger picture. For my style, and the Approach to magic that I travel, doing the move should not be labored over. IF you are going to put a coin in your hand, you would just do it, you wouldn't take 4 or 5 secs just because you can. that's how I think about it. That said, I have seen people do it slowly and it's totally fine. If that fits your style then fantastic, that's what you SHOULD do. But for my style, I like to just do the move and get on with the trick. But I would like just add that to those of you who feel doing it slow is better, then I am sorry that I did not talk about that in the video, I did not take that perspective into account. To be totally honest, When I said you need a place to go, then I said "like the pocket to get a pen," yea your right, that's probably not the best place to go. So I take responsibilty for that. Like I said, I wanted to teach the vanish, not a whole trick. But yes, if you DO go to the pocket for god sakes PLEASE HAVE A GOOD REASON. Now that my hand is cramped I would like to thank everyone for their feed back both positive and negative. For me negative feedback is a way to keep myself growing because no one is right all of the time. For those of you who liked it then thank you for your words, and for those of you who didn't, thank you for at least explaining what aspects you didn't like so that I may improve on myself. |
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manal Inner circle York ,PA. 1412 Posts |
Quote:
On 2011-12-04 17:20, Ryan Bliss wrote: Well said . |
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