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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The side walk shuffle » » Street Busking in front of protesters (1 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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JoeJoe
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The Occupy Wall Street "movement" is a pro-socialist agenda. Perhaps you should learn more about the causes you champion?

-JoeJoe
Amazing JoeJoe on YouTube[url=https://www.youtube.com/user/AmazingJoeJoe]
Devious
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Devious Deceptions
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Paddy
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Quote:
On 2011-12-06 13:28, epoptika wrote:
And again, Paddy, you reveal how totally clueless you are. I have participated in the Occupy movement and other pro labor/ pro working class movements around the country and can tell you that you are full of #@*%!!
Know what you are talking about before you start spouting off on important issues!

Have you ever read a newspaper in your life?!

In fact I am quite well read, subscribing to 3 different newspapers. My question to you is "do you know your *** from a hole in the ground?" Do you not realize that Occupy is NOT pro labour, it is pro socialist. The Occupy movement brings Ayn Rand's prophetic book "Atlas Shrugged" into truth. Their motto is "each gives according to his ability, each receives according to his needs." That should scare the holy crap out of you.
Non Impediti Ratione Cogitationis

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Dynamike
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Take a chill pill guys.
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tom hughes
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Hmmm... can anybody point me to a reference citing when OWS declared a pro- socialist agenda ( or indeed any formal agenda?). I thought OWS was anti- corporate greed rather than anti capitalist per se.

tom
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The Great Zoobini
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Smile
Meet you in Busker Alley Smile
ed rhodes
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Enjoy it while you can, Zoo. I don't see this thread lasting too much longer! Smile
"There's no time to lose," I heard her say.
"Catch your dreams before they slip away."
"Dying all the time, lose your dreams and you could lose your mind.
Ain't life unkind?"
JoeJoe
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Quote:
On 2011-12-07 23:26, tom hughes wrote:
Hmmm... can anybody point me to a reference citing when OWS declared a pro- socialist agenda ( or indeed any formal agenda?). I thought OWS was anti- corporate greed rather than anti capitalist per se.




Corporate greed is "capitalism" ... and what do you think they would replace capitalism with??



"A few weeks ago, the "Occupy Wall Street" protesters, carrying anti-capitalism and pro-socialism signs, marched up 5th Avenue in lower Manhattan." occupythenation.com

"Democrat Socialists of America" photos taken at protests

On September 19, Roseanne Barr, the first celebrity to endorse the protest, spoke to protesters calling for a combination of capitalism and socialism Wikipedia

The organizers themselves do not use the word "socialism", but instead use the phrase "social democracy" ... which "supports class collaboration as the course to achieve socialism. Social democracy advocates the creation of legal reforms and economic redistribution programs to eliminate economic class disparities". wikipedia



Still not convinced? Listen to the protesters themselves ... they said they were protesting capitalism, and when asked what they would replace it with they instantly and without hesitation replied "socialism". former-soviet-citizen-confronts-socialists.

I actually feel sorry for the protesters in that video ... they don't even know the difference between North and South Korea, the one lady actually believes that "workers in North Korea get paid decent". She is advocating a pay scale of less than half the absolute minimum caloric needs ... daily per person rations were halved in July 2011 to 200 grams. Economy of North Korea



I am actually surprised that anyone would even need to question their motives ... but I imagine I shouldn't be. The left-wing media is obviously helping them by not making their socialism demands available to the mass public. But make no mistake about it ... this "movement" is not pro-labor in any way shape or form, it is indisputably pro-socialism. If you don't believe me, go to one of their rallies and see for yourself. It is fact.



-JoeJoe
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JoeJoe
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And in case you are wondering how their proposed "system" would affect us as buskers ... it means we would pass the hat, and then give it to them ... and their general assembly would vote on how much to give back to us.

And that's all ok with the protesters in the video ... because they would vote to give us a "decent pay". Yeah right ... sure they would.

-JoeJoe
Amazing JoeJoe on YouTube[url=https://www.youtube.com/user/AmazingJoeJoe]
ed rhodes
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So it's so much better to let the banks and the corporations mess with everybody who wasn't smart enough to be as independent as you?
("mess" is not the word I want, but it's the word that will be allowed.)
"There's no time to lose," I heard her say.
"Catch your dreams before they slip away."
"Dying all the time, lose your dreams and you could lose your mind.
Ain't life unkind?"
epoptika
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LOL! Zoob's post is the best one on this thread!

As I said, I am not going to argue with intellectual gnats. I will leave one last link although I know it is wasted on the silly little insects infesting this thread.

This is what Occupy Wall Street is about.

And I am finished with this silly thread.http://www.alternet.org/story/153345/the_real_history_of_%22corporate_personhood%22%3A_meet_the_man_to_blame_for_corporations_having_more_rights_than_you?page=1
epoptika
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JoeJoe
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That's a great opinion piece, but what you don't want to open your eyes and see is that corporations are simply collections of people organized together ... I have considered incorporating myself (JoeJoe, Inc) ... how to you justify taking away my Constitutional rights for doing so?

David Copperfield is incorporated, how do you justify taking away his rights for being successful? David Copperfield's corporation pays taxes, and then when he gets his salary from it he has to pay personal taxes. So these "rich" actually pay more than their fair share already, they get double taxed.



When colonists first came to America, we established communal farms ... where everyone pitched in to do the work, and the harvest was shared equally. People started to slack, they'd just let the next guy do the work because there was no incentive for them to work hard. And when it came time to harvest, they picked it over as quickly as they could because they wanted their "fair share" before someone else got to it. So they picked the corn before it was ripe, and we lost half our colonists to starvation that winter.

The Governor of the Virginia Colony saw the problem ... he decided that the farm would be divided up into plots, and every colonist would get their own plot of land, and whatever they grew on their land they got to keep for themselves. Thus capitalism was born. The result was a celebration of the Thanksgiving Harvest - more than enough food to feed everybody. You don't pick your own corn before it is ripe, you wait till it is as big as it will get.



In a socialist society, the non-productive people drag down the productive people. It eventually hits critical mass where there are not enough resources harvested to support the population. Starvation is common in all socialist societies. The fix is to weed out the "unproductive" portions of the population, which is what the guy in the video was talking about - mass starvation, cannibalism, and state sanctioned mass murder. That's coming from a guy that lived under socialism for 29 years.

The problem with a "social democracy" as proposed by the OWS "movement" is that they are simply replacing the dictator with a vote from the general assembly. So the people become their own dictator. The end result would ultimately be the same here ... the general assembly voting what social groups were an unproductive drain on society - voting on who to eradicate. Without the "carrot" to reward productive people (the corporations), the only tool left is a "stick" to punish the unproductive people (the protesters).



And I don't see why the thread should be deleted ... we are having an adult conversation about something that is affecting our workplace. If the Unions were on strike in Vegas and none of the magicians could do their shows, I'm sure nobody would delete threads discussing the situation. The only reason this thread would be deleted is because once again the established magic elite looks down upon us sidewalk performers and doesn't take our venue seriously.

These protesters are living in our "theater" and I submit that warrants our attentions.

-JoeJoe
Amazing JoeJoe on YouTube[url=https://www.youtube.com/user/AmazingJoeJoe]
Paddy
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That article was originally published at War is a crime.org http://warisacrime.org/
Non Impediti Ratione Cogitationis

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Devious
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You are actually very wrong on that one Paddy. The site you posted,
picked up the story from AlterNet two days later, as mentioned by Epoptika.
Check the dates posted, to clearly see your error.

Now, why in the heck is everyone talking politics in here? Do you really think
you are going to change anyone's mind as to politics? Only fools argue with fools.

I thought you all were magicians? Why I oughta! Can any of you take a whoopin'?
Here are some real fighters, but remember the first rule as a member of the
"Fight Club",Worse Beating Ever1st round baby!

My Motto in life is,
"United We Bargain, Divided We Beg!"
Devious Deceptions
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L'Chaim!
JoeJoe
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Quote:
On 2011-12-08 21:36, Devious wrote:
Now, why in the heck is everyone talking politics in here? Do you really think
you are going to change anyone's mind as to politics? Only fools argue with fools.


Because in order to have a discussion on busking in front of the protesters, then we must discuss who they are and what they want. If Zuccotti Park was your pitch ... then your definition of "political rant" might not be the same as it currently is.

-JoeJoe
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Devious
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Okay I see your point, but how about this then bud,Occupy My Gloves.
I'm not on any side, but the military's side, fair enough?
Devious Deceptions
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JoeJoe
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It's all good dude ... I'm not trying to fight. I just see this as an important conversation because when spring arrives and buskers hit the sidewalks, some may find themselves "occupied".

Going back to the original question posted by Dynamike ... I don't think busking "for" the protesters would be a good idea.

As to busking "in front of them", that would depend on where the protesters were, what they were doing, and more importantly ... where and what the punters and marks were doing. I would try to avoid being associated with the protesters at all costs. Comedy about the 1% vs 99% could work ... but only if it was really funny to both sides.

-JoeJoe
Amazing JoeJoe on YouTube[url=https://www.youtube.com/user/AmazingJoeJoe]
JoeJoe
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And that article is blatantly misrepresenting facts ... yellow journalism.

For example, Central Hudson Gas & Electric Corporatio......New York was *NOT* about "corporate speech" as they claim, it was about "commercial speech".

There is a huge difference in the two words ... the author wants you to believe it gave corporations free speech rights ... what it actually did was give EVERYONE "commercial free speech" rights, including the mom and pop shops on main street ... and ... BUSKERS!

See GOLDSTEIN v. TOWN OF NANTUCKET:

Quote:
Defendant contends, however, that plaintiff's activity is commercial speech and thus does not enjoy First Amendment protection


This decision in 1980 reinforced the lower courts decision on Goldstein in 1979 ... after this case was settled by the high court, the town of Nantucket knew it had no hope of winning on appeal, as the Supreme Court effectively awarded commercial speech First Amendment protections ... commercial speech being speech done on behalf of a company or in......a profit. Reading that, you see that in 1978 commercial speech only had a "limited measure of protection" - meaning that if you were busking for profit, you did not have the full protection of the First Amendment.

If it wasn't for this case, the possibility exists that busking would not have the level of protection we enjoy today. I don't see how any busker could frame that case as being a bad thing.

-JoeJoe
Amazing JoeJoe on YouTube[url=https://www.youtube.com/user/AmazingJoeJoe]
Devious
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I totally agree, but then there's this one,
Corporate Clowns
Devious Deceptions
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