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rowland Inner circle 1566 Posts 
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Quote:
On 2012-04-07 10:26, Jamie Ferguson wrote: On any other thread that would be funny 
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Brad Burt Inner circle 2675 Posts
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"Real Secrets" is pretty much a 1 or 0 kind of thing. Either it's a scam or it isn't. Either the tricks received will be ok or they won't.(Or, hopefully some of them will be superb...which will be cool.) Either a person will subscribe or he/she won't. The subscribers will either be happy/ok with what they get or they won't.
There are any number of things I thought ill advised about how it was set up. But, there you go. Even though I have found a real and what I consider a substantive methodological problem with the first offering I have had a great deal of enjoyment attempting to get around it. If this is how all RS stuff will be it's what I like to call, "magic for adults". You get the method. You get what you need to DO the trick or routine, but nothing else. No thinking, no fully fleshed routine, etc. You have to take the thing and work out how best to do it, because you can NOT just do the routine as supplied without working out a presentation that explains/covers/etc. any number of 'whys'. Spoon fed magic this is not. That's neither a criticism or an accolade. It just is. There will certainly be any number of subscribers who do NOT like this. It happens I'm one of the ones who does. I already have a long written critical analysis of the thing waiting for the RS site to go live so I can enter act with others who have the first offering. RS is a nice little fun 'thing'. It's not in any sense some ground breaking construct. The first offering shows that they are willing to go the extra mile in the quality of the actual mechanism they are sending out. It's very nice indeed. For those of us who are mail order junkies it has the 'extra' fun of NOT knowing what is coming each month! I think that's fun. Other's do not. For $12 considering the crap that I have bought as a dealer at WHOLESALE and felt ripped off the price is within my tolerance for adventure. The secrecy thing? If every offering is like the first then I don't see why they did it. As I noted before: I could tell you exactly what it is, how it works, what I don't like, etc. and there is no way at all you could do it! So the whole thing is moot. I have to believe that the there are many routines coming that do not fit that structure that could be revealed, etc. with the result that anyone could do them....otherwise the secrecy thing makes not sense whatsoever. Best,
Brad Burt
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jtmorris Regular user Canada 158 Posts
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Oh dear Ray...
To call out bullies and aggressive posters, then to call people idiots and aggressive because they bought into something you didn't like-well that makes you by definition a hypocrite - and I'm not name calling, but you have defined yourself. I have bought into real secrets. I am looking forward to it. I don't appreciate you calling me an idiot and trying to make me feel bad because I have a different opinion. Let's try again, this time post something constructive.
"Looks like a camera trick!" "I had to watch it 5 times before I...still didn't figure it out" - COINTUM-LEAP
Unbelievable, visual, simple, and motivated mix of cards and coins. COINTUM-LEAP |
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newguy Elite user 411 Posts
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Brad,
Thank you for you balanced, intelligent analysis. You offer smart observation while staying within the rules. Looking forward to your thinking on the inside (soon?) My major observation that I offer to you is that with folks like Magic Makers, and those overseas who can knock off something as complex as Messika's Tarantula gimmick, don't you see how this could be knocked off? (as could almost anything these days?) |
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Joe Roberts Special user 946 Posts
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Quote:
On 2012-04-07 05:33, Ray Chelt wrote: So you DO give a lot of respect to those who say "You know, I know it's a gamble but I like the idea of a surprise." Well... isn't that what every single member on here is saying? I haven't heard anyone else say otherwise. Every single subscriber seems to think this is just a fun indulgence at a relatively cheap price. In fact, the only person who expected this to be some grand exercise in learning new "information and principles" is the one person you were defending in your post: Duanebarry. My advice to Duane was that if he DIDN'T like surprises, and preferred to make -- in his words -- "informed choices" about what he buys, then obviously a trick-of-the-month club is not for him. There is vitriol coming in ONLY ONE direction on this thread. And it's not from people who have signed up. There are a lot of things I'm not interested in. Kid's magic. Gospel magic. Or tricks like this which are apparently your type of thing: http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......orum=218 That's cool. Everyone has different taste. I guess the difference here is that the things I'm not interested in, I don't feel compelled to post about constantly. As you're still working your way through Card College I can understand that you have a different opinion on something like Real Secrets then, say, Max Maven who wrote: "Given that my name has been included in some of the promotion, I will confirm that this is a legitimate enterprise, which I think will make subscribers very happy." Enjoy your card to wallet. |
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Magicsquared Inner circle 1262 Posts
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Quote:
On 2012-04-07 11:27, Brad Burt wrote: You're misunderstanding the secrecy thing. It's not a matter of "we want to keep this secret so non-subscribers can't do it." It's, "We want to keep this secret so there is no online trail for a SPECTATOR to follow." To give an example, let's say you perform an effect for a very engaged spectator where you move the apple logo on the back of their iphone. This may be a great effect and it will likely fool them in the moment. But if you're performing for someone who is under the age of, say, 35, and they're really intrigued they may take their phone, fire up their browser, type: magic "apple logo" into google and on the first page they would find a magic Café thread talking about the effect. And then they think, "oh, I see, it's just a trick you can buy." Even if your presentation is entertaining and amazing on its own, this would still take away from it at least a little. Now, let's say this effect had come through from Real Secrets (it wouldn't because it's an expensive gimmick to manufacture) but if it did and someone googled those exact same terms there would be NOTHING to lead them to a magic effect. That's the idea. |
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newguy Elite user 411 Posts
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1st RULE: You do not talk about FIGHT CLUB.
2nd RULE: You DO NOT talk about FIGHT CLUB. 3rd RULE: If someone says "stop" or goes limp, taps out the fight is over. 4th RULE: Only two guys to a fight. 5th RULE: One fight at a time. 6th RULE: No shirts, no shoes. 7th RULE: Fights will go on as long as they have to. 8th RULE: If this is your first night at FIGHT CLUB, you HAVE to fight. |
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Magicsquared Inner circle 1262 Posts
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Real Secrets website is update (refresh the page when you get there if you don't see it immediately).
Some good ideas for the first effect in the blog. Also a couple new names in the "effects coming from" group: Gaetan Bloom, Cyril, Michael Weber, Robert Neale, Max Maven, Sebastian Clergue, Charlie Frye, Chad Long, Tim Trono, Mathieu Bich, Martin Gardner |
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newguy Elite user 411 Posts
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MSQD,
Did you get a new password? |
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Magicsquared Inner circle 1262 Posts
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Quote:
On 2012-04-07 14:16, newguy wrote: Yeah. New ID came in an email at 1:49. Check your email and your spam folder. If not there then it's probably going out in batches. |
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newguy Elite user 411 Posts
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Got it
Cool inside! Great new ideas already Sending them some of mine And I am now VERY happy about the auto renewal for three reasons |
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Tom Jorgenson Inner circle LOOSE ANGLES, CALIFORNIA 4451 Posts
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Magicsquared:
Out of curiosity, did you actually read the cover letter before you posted this? It amazes me that the first thing some folks do is hurry to blab it all. That makes it REAL hard to keep things a secret.
We dance an invisible dance to music they cannot hear.
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FrenchDrop Inner circle I can name that tune in 1647 Posts
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Quote:
On 2012-04-07 12:06, Joe Roberts wrote: Joe, did you miss the guy who calls Real Secrets "the most important thing that's happened to magic in decades" and has repeatedly posted about how critics of RS are just bitter because they're missing out? 
Quote:
There is vitriol coming in ONLY ONE direction on this thread. And it's not from people who have signed up. Incorrect. It's true that those who've been critical or skeptical of RS have unfortunately included the likes of sirbrad and GaryLee...but the pro-RS side has its own aggressive, vitriolic silliness. Ray's post may have gone over the top...but your own response to him is really condescending in its own right. I think most people on both sides of the RS fence have been fairly even-handed. The problem has been a lot of hot air coming from a vocal minority on each side with tendencies toward dramatic overstatement.
"A great magician has said of his profession that its practitioners '… must pound and rack their brains to make the least learning go in, but quarrelling always comes very naturally to them.'” -- Susanna Clarke, Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrell
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Jim Sparx Inner circle Far Out, Texas 1144 Posts
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I don't think I've ever been in a forum, since the 80s, where people have gotten away with name calling. I hope newcomers, especially children, are not visiting this thread and seeing what might happen if they expressed an opinion that not everybody agrees with. I thought someone just got banned for name calling? Oh well...
Et tu, Spartacus?
https://fineartamerica.com/profiles/chispadeelpaso.html |
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Zombie Magic Inner circle I went out for a beer and now have 8733 Posts
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Real Secrets sent an e-mail with info for us. AND...the price is now $180. I'm glad I joined early.
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Brad Burt Inner circle 2675 Posts
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Quote:
On 2012-04-07 11:50, newguy wrote: No question, but if the Magic Makers folks really wanted to get hold of each thing as it was released how hard do you think that would be? Not very. They just sign up under an alias and stay quiet, etc. Actually, the ONLY possible reason from a marketing stand point to take the position they took....IF all the items are difficult to duplicate?......would be FOR the controversy. I have no trouble with that, but it can backfire. If on the other hand future releases will be easy to duplicate, then that alone explains their caution and I applaud it. Don't know, but truly I'm looking forward to the next release. Best,
Brad Burt
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sevenup Regular user South Carolina 180 Posts
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Quote:
On 2012-04-07 15:29, Zombie Magic wrote: You beat me to it, it's now $180/yr. I'm so glad the website is back up and running and the new tips on the blog are very good.
Pick a card, any card at all. Just don't pick a RED spade.
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Magicsquared Inner circle 1262 Posts
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Quote:
On 2012-04-07 15:02, Tom Jorgenson wrote: What on earth are you talking about? What was I supposed to keep a secret? That the website was updated? |
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BrucUK Regular user UK 163 Posts
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Quite happy with mine in the UK thanks.
Have bought "sight seen" products that have turned out to be useless from 1st read, and this is certainly not useless. I'm not being "smug", or "better than you" - just different. No more different than the performances I give, or the views I take. Nothing Earth-shattering, but fun/magical nonetheless. Bruce |
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FrenchDrop Inner circle I can name that tune in 1647 Posts
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Quote:
On 2012-04-07 15:59, Brad Burt wrote: I think you're missing an obvious angle: The "magic for magicians" angle. If the secrets are kept, a Real Secrets subscriber can show a trick to a non-subscribing magician, and it'll at least theoretically be something that second magician has never seen before (or at least a variation he's never seen before on an existing trick). You can show a layperson Aaron Fisher's Panic, and you can be pretty well assured that layperson's never seen or heard of it before...but if you're looking for magic for magicians -- stuff your fellow magician probably hasn't seen -- you may be attracted to a source that goes to considerable lengths to ensure that most magicians haven't seen the material. (There's also the idea that, if the material's not widely known, a curious spectator won't be able to Google it and find out the secret...but I really think the problem of laypersons poring over the Internet to find out how a trick was done is not the epidemic many magicians think it is; I think it's blown way out of proportion.)
"A great magician has said of his profession that its practitioners '… must pound and rack their brains to make the least learning go in, but quarrelling always comes very naturally to them.'” -- Susanna Clarke, Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrell
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Posted: Apr 7, 2012 03:06 pm 
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