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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » You are getting sleepy...very sleepy... » » Got another abreaction... (1 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Dannydoyle
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As predicted and expected we have the attack and no evidence to back up a single word. Thank you for proving my point.

A request for proof is just stupid? How lucky for you as you seem to have none in the first place.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
mindpunisher
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What evidence do you have? What you gave us isn't proof. Nothing you have said is proof or even any evidence that you know anything about what you talk about. You quote some phd as if somehow a peer review is the utlimate truth.I showed you a whole string of esteemed phd's that denounce psychology and psychiatry as being pseudo science along with their peers. That is more proof than you have offered. These guys have little credibility. If you do some research you will find that psychology and psychiatry are not scientific. They just masquerade as being scientific. What is it that you find hard to take in about that? Can't you be bothered to find out? you'd rather hold on to your pseudo proof?

But lets get back to the original thread for moment. I have seen two abreactions on stage both by well known hypnotists. Both were through skits that involved regression. one of which in no way shape or form had any language that would suggest them to go back to a traumatic event. Just that they would be back in school. They totally freaked out in a dramatic way. One person started screaming loudly that they were locked in a cupboard and started crying. you can argue that traumatic memories don't exist and that's all you are doing you don't offer any proof just argung. But common sense will tell you that people do have traumatic events in their past. The second example wasn't school it was a past life regression so that was more likely a fabricated memory. They were regressed to the moment of their death. The girl screamed the theatre down uncontrollably and the hypnotist had no control over it.

The show was stopped while he tried to get her out of the imagined scenario. So probably two examples one of each a past memory and a constructed memory. Ether way both were not very pleasant and possibly damaging for the person on stage.

~I can't be arsed digging it up but there was a hypnotist over here who was successfully sued because of an abreaction where again regression took the person back into the school years. Apparently they had been abused for a long period during their child hood. I am sure she could remember it but she went back and activated all the old baggage and was supposedly suicidal for many months after. She even crashed her car into a tree a few weeks later in an attempt to kill herself "according to the media reports".

I think I remember now why I took a break from here nothing changes... What a waste of time and energy..

But is it possible to suggest a traumatic memory? Yes I agree with you and it does happen with some hypnotists and types of therapy. But there are also people with genuine baggage that can be accessed and IS accessed. We can never be to careful or too laid back about who we have on stage.

I have never done a regression sketch on stage and wouldn't. Its also illegal now over here and you could find yourself sued for negligence if someone had a "bad reaction" from it.
hypnokid
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Funny how you're eager to quote and refer to papers and articles but you're really lethargic when it comes to providing the links to others.

When did regression on stage become illegal?

I think a lot of members probably think the same thing - "nothing changes".

HK
Too much style to be a stage hypnotist.
mindpunisher
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The links I provided were so easy to find just took 10 secs and there are plenty more. Other links would take time to find and I can't be bothered.

Regression on stage became illegal when it became part of the guidelines needed to acquire a license for a public demonstration of hypnosis in the UK. If you were to go ahead and do it and someone had a bad reaction abreaction or whatever more than likely you would be sued for negligence.

I think everybody who intends to use hypnosis in the uk public ally should get a copy of the guidelines and at least know whats in them even if they don't intend to get a license. Surely that has to be part of your "education". I don't understand why "hypnotists" wouldn't be interested in them and the history that led to them.
Dannydoyle
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You can't be bothered to back up your claims? Well then is it a shock nobody can be bothered to take you seriously?

Peer review is as close as SCIENCE has to truth detection. That is the difference in science and say what you are blathering on and on about. Now go ahead attack again I love that bit.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Dannydoyle
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Once again foe the thick, repressed memories have no foundation in science. Much like astrology, numerology, and other forms of hokum.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
hypnokid
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Quote:
On 2012-04-16 18:27, mindpunisher wrote:
The links I provided were so easy to find just took 10 secs and there are plenty more. Other links would take time to find and I can't be bothered.

Regression on stage became illegal when it became part of the guidelines needed to acquire a license for a public demonstration of hypnosis in the UK. If you were to go ahead and do it and someone had a bad reaction abreaction or whatever more than likely you would be sued for negligence.

I think everybody who intends to use hypnosis in the uk public ally should get a copy of the guidelines and at least know whats in them even if they don't intend to get a license. Surely that has to be part of your "education". I don't understand why "hypnotists" wouldn't be interested in them and the history that led to them.


I have the act. I have the guidelines. The guidelines are not part of the act.

HK
Too much style to be a stage hypnotist.
mindpunisher
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You have to ask for the guidelines they will send you everything you when you apply for a license or ask for the information. Phone your local council. My scanner went defunct few months back or I would scan them in.
mindpunisher
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Here is the link to the woman who seued the hypnotist successfully. They are not talking about "repressed memories" but "re-awakend" memories. To me that makes perfect sense. She didn't get a huge amount of money though.

Even I my own life I have had challenging times which I "got over" But If I go back there and think about them some of the bad feelings are still there. I just don't go there anymore.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/1352057.stm


Maybe she is just making it all up I don't know so don't ask me for proof. The thing is things DO happen on stage. And some people on here are experiencing them after being introduced to hypnosis through products sold on here. To me it seems like a numbers game the more out there badly informed or trained the more likely that more of these things will happen. But then maybe I'm just thick.

I doubt we will ever get anyone asking for help in this area or posting their experiences though. Why would they --- they just get told they are thick. Nice one Danny.
mindpunisher
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The other thing is I don't work with "repressed" memories or abreactions. There are far better ways. Most people know where their problems started or have a fair idea. And they experience the consequences on a daily basis ie the negative emotional states. But they learn to live with them to a point. They learn to switch off but not totally. Taking someone back and associating them into the events makes things much worse....

Its a bit like watching footage of a roller coaster. If you watch it from a camera shot from the ground you won't feel much. If you watch it from a camera on the front seat you will experience some of the emotions of actually being on a roller coaster.

This is what people do to cope with issues they can't resolve they dissociate themselves from the event. If they are associated back into it they get the full blast and sometimes more of the original emotion.

Its not that memories are repressed they are just stored away. How many things over the years have you "forgotten" but when you see a pic or hear a piece of music it all comes flooding back?
Dannydoyle
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According to the article he was fined for doing the regression. The case didn't seem to include any testimony from a scientist of any sort. It was a legal ruling based on something that happened in 1994. Also the judge himself said there was no great flood of these cases happening.

Try to expand your horizons a bit past hundred year old concepts. Join us in the 21st century.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
RSD
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Wow these Brits have rules, laws, and regulations for everything don't they? They have all these laws, and then problems arise.It seems as if you make up a rule about it, mayhem will eventually follow.

The fact that the incident is decades old and it happened in the Uk leaves me wondering how often these things occur. I mean how many hypno shows have there been since then? How many resulted in this? I wish we could look at those odds. You can find horrible incidents in every walk of life. I'm sure if we looked hard enough we could find a story of a clown accident at a Cirque show and other oddities.
Pakar Ilusi
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Smile
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
mindpunisher
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I think you are a clown RSD.....it happens on your side too.But when it comes to rules etc we are just a bit more civilized than you... A bit more less red necked. parts of the US are so backwards.
hypnomagic
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Hypnokid,

The guidelines are issued as part of your permission when you apply to the local council to perform. The guidelines are part of the agreement with the local council when permission is granted. If you do not follow the guidelines you will have breached the licensing conditions.

Regards


DB
hypnokid
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Yes, that was my understanding. The guidelines are not the law, they are attached to the licence.

HK
Too much style to be a stage hypnotist.
Dannydoyle
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The guidelines exist as sort of a back door way to regulate things as they see fit. They can shut you down for whatever they want based on 100 year old superstition and claim it is "civilized".

Yea the U S is backwards.

Oh and punishy, RSD is Canadian. But again why let a little thing like a fact get in the way of your opinion. It hasn't stopped you yet.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Owen Mc Ginty
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I read the dirty word "psychiatry" earlier in this thread.

Psychiatric diagnoses are based on questionaires without a shred of physical evidence.

It´s slapping labels on certain behaviours so they can prescribe drugs.

I´m waiting for "Psychiatry" to be included as a disorder in the DSM - with a definition akin to "The compulsion to label others behaviour with the tags; disorder / syndrome / deficiency" etc

It´s a scam on a global scale: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qs9TLTvYFs (a tad dramatic and over the top for my liking, but it´s thought-provoking nonetheless)

L. Ron Hubbard was right about one thing!
If you never fail, you're not trying hard enough.
mindpunisher
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Quote:
On 2012-04-19 09:13, Dannydoyle wrote:
The guidelines exist as sort of a back door way to regulate things as they see fit. They can shut you down for whatever they want based on 100 year old superstition and claim it is "civilized".

Yea the U S is backwards.

Oh and punishy, RSD is Canadian. But again why let a little thing like a fact get in the way of your opinion. It hasn't stopped you yet.


Danny its pretty clear your grasping at straws if that's all you can come up with.

The guidelines are actually quite sensible as far as I can see. (The only thing I would complain about are the fees). It decreases the chances of problems arising and tries to make things safe. Just because a bunch of magicians and product peddlars want to ignore the risks involved doesn't make it right. You may have been lucky, you may have been sensible or even highly skilled but most getting introduced to hypnosis on here aren't. Even so I find it hard to believe that you haven't come across a few incidents that made you question things.

RSD can't help being Canadian...

that's right Danny America is so forward they still think they are cowboys look at their gun laws. Try telling me guns are safe too. That sort of sums it up for me.
Dannydoyle
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Wow all you have left is to attack a whole country now? Well I guess Canada and America so 2 countries.

All out of information and any semblance of a valid point so you just lash out and start that?

Well it brings into perfect focus your alleged knowledge.

All that is left is for you to tell us how great the 90s were and how great you were and are and how everyone else sucks and ruined your market and you sold out theaters. I love that bit.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
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