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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Did you hear the latest? » » Idiot Trying To Sell Teller's "Shadows" Secret (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Dannydoyle
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Oh wait. Why no outrage for the Professor? Oh no we save that for Penn and Teller. Why is it you are not just "not sold on" them? Selective moral outrage is not becoming.

Vernon also exposes loading the cups as you lift them. Where is your outrage again? No he gets a pass. Expose the false.transfer and loading while lifting and you have the whole thing. You should be apoplectic about it if you were consistent. But no Vernon gets a pass. why is that?

All I am asking for is.a.smidgen of consistency.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
Zombie Magic
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I think vernon or anyone else doing the cups and balls, did/is making a BIG mistake exposing the 'move' in the context of leading them down the garden path to bigger things.

I happen to know that people feel a let down when it happens. It's like showing them any magic and telling how it was done.

Would you explain the DL because next you'll fry them with a pass? OF course not ( I hope not ).

The cups and balls can be done without showing that one technique and the routine is not diluted in any way.
Terry Holley
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Quote:
On 2012-04-21 00:30, Dannydoyle wrote:
Oh wait. Why no outrage for the Professor? Oh no we save that for Penn and Teller. Why is it you are not just "not sold on" them? Selective moral outrage is not becoming.



I think because you hypnotized me when I took you to dinner in Branson.
Co-author with illusionist Andre' Kole of "Astrology and Psychic Phenomena."
Dannydoyle
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I just think people paint with a pretty wide brush is my point. What about gambling routines that expose a second or a bottom or hand mucking? Those are the PUREST form of exposure are they not? Yet many who want to nail the bad boys let it go. How about the bent corner dealio? It is exposure.

I can list many examples nobody cries about that are used nightly in the Magic Castle. This is what drives me nuts. One does it and gets a pass and is revered. Others reviled. I don't think that helps our art at all.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus
<BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell
critter
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Just a few effects I've seen the Amazing Johnathan expose during his comedy/magic act: Black Art, Zombie, and (I forget the correct name of the trick, but they even used A.J.'s name in the ad to sell the trick after he exposed it) the one with the cell phone.
Feel free to criticize him, but I wouldn't recommend it.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
Decomposed
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Can't believe this is happening............again.
Banester
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I would have to agree with GaryLee. The method (in my opinion) is not protected while the presentation would be. If he is selling just the method without the presentation it shouldn't fall under any copyright infringement. That was the problem with the masked dude, he just showed the method and did nothing with the presentation, or very little with it. I still think it is rotten, but most likely legal.
The art of a magician is to create wonder.
If we live with a sense of wonder, our lives
become filled with joy
-Doug Henning-
tristanmagic
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He is peforming the same routine as Teller and is now selling the props + the routine!
He even mention Teller in the ad and is also offering this with a rip-off of Losanders table as a 2 in one deal.
Teller should have no problem winning this case against this thief!!!
lynnef
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This really is one for the jury (ie a lay audience) isn't it? In music, the copyright laws are also complex ... eg many bands have the same name, write songs with the same title etc. ... however if you copy a certain number of notes with their time values from another song in order to write your own song, then this is copyright infringement. Just don't put me on the jury. Lynn
Dove84
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I think it's great someone like Teller who can afford to take a ripoff artist to court does so. Hope he wins.
Slim King
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No one is saying..."but it will make him a better performer" ... That's what they said to me after some knuckleheads stole some of my favorite routines... Just sayin...
THE MAN THE SKEPTICS REFUSE TO TEST FOR ONE MILLION DOLLARS.. The Worlds Foremost Authority on Houdini's Life after Death.....
Merenkov
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It’s interesting to me that one hears nary a complaint regarding Penn & Teller from our most accomplished professional magicians. And that's because most of them like and respect the duo (and if you’ve never seen their brilliant act live, get thee to their theater and then try to tell me they don't have a deep respect and love for the art). They're one of the best things that ever happened to magic (they made magic entertaining for people who hated magicians). I haven’t heard anyone complain about their so-called “exposures” since the late nineties, I thought we were far past that. And the few people that do complain about them always seem to be people I’ve never heard of.
Mr. Mystoffelees
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So, who are you Merenkov?

Never heard of me? Well, I am a working magician but just one of the unwashed masses. Sorry, that, but I accuse Penn and Teller of exposing effects that WERE a valuable part of some unwashed magicians act. So, can I expose Shadows as long as I first call it "cheesy".

Sorry to snipe, but get over your hero worship...

Jim the unknown magician...
Also known, when doing rope magic, as "Cordini"
critter
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Submitted for consideration:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSvcqeOrDw0
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
Jonathan Townsend
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Look for similar (false transfer) actions in the routine before that show-tell of the false transfer and the load... it even feels like a false explanation and right after that come the revelations of the large loads. IMHO not a problem unless you really do a false transfer that looks as hokey as what he demonstrated.

IMHO there's a consensus opinion about learning the rules and exploring working within them before transgressing... IE making mindful and informed choices.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
critter
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The first time I saw P&T's C&B was before I had studied magic seriously.
Two seconds after the part where they "explained" the routine, they fooled me with the routine.
Of course, it's easy to follow it now that I've read and done, but back then I had no idea what was going on.
Hero worship? Heck yeah! Because it was awesome!
As a Muggle, I was fooled and entertained.

Anyways, just offering that as a different perspective for consideration. Not trying to convince anyone of anything.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
Mr. Mystoffelees
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Yeah, me too! That is cool, critter. I would suggest you play the rest of the thought, rather than a sound bite that doesn't give the full picture. As to P&T, no argument, they are great performers. But is that all they need to do to get your admiration? I won't bore you with myriad comparisons of how bad that can be.

What I want to know is this:

1. Is ANYTHING Penn and Teller do to make money exposure?
2. If NO then stop.
3. If YES do you ENDORSE exposure?
4. If NO then stop.
5. If YES then stop.

Simple...
Also known, when doing rope magic, as "Cordini"
critter
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It wasn't my soundbite so I can't play more, unfortunately. I'm pretty sure it's from Revelations.

Well, my thoughts weren't to say P&T are the greatest people in the world or anything.
I was just sharing a memory of what it was like watching that particular routine without any prior knowledge. Like I said, wasn't to convince anybody of anything.
When I said "hero worship" I meant back then as a Muggle I wanted to be able to do something that cool. I was trying to sum up what my thoughts were at the time.
That routine and Teller pulling lit cigarettes out of the air on Comedy Central were some of the things that made me want to learn magic.
Obviously, I have a different perspective now (and quickly learned that Teller wasn't the first to pull lit cigarettes out of the air), but I still enjoy their performances. "Silverfish" is my favorite routine in magic.
And I still like them, but I wouldn't say that I still "worship" them.
I disagree with many of the things they've each said and done.
It's certainly not my intention to paint them as saints or make excuses for them.

So, as I said, I was only offering a perspective that hadn't been expressed. As something to ponder and nothing more.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
Mr. Mystoffelees
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I think your comments are well thought out, critter, and give me an enjoyable exercise in rethinking this whole issue. I also feel that P&T have many good qualities, and hope I am not overstating my aversion to exposure.

I fully realize the P&T have deliberately sought out the "bad boys of magic" title, and I don't think it was tongue in cheek. They have made it into a fortune, and they are successful way beyond what anyone could have predicted. Props to them for doing what they do so well that many magicians make excuses for them.

Times change, and we need to change with them. Perhaps exposure is not so bad. I have read posts that said entertaining exposure was better than boring magic. Maybe this is the future...

I like your balance...

Jim
Also known, when doing rope magic, as "Cordini"
critter
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Thank you Jim, and I enjoy your posts.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers
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