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shrink Inner circle 2609 Posts |
Could you give us examples of what is covered?
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truthteller Inner circle 2584 Posts |
I posted this in anothers Coversations thread, but I think it bears repeating here:
Here is a way to evaluate cost: People with very little experience are always putting out books, DVDs and pamphlets that we don't mind spending $20-$40 for each. What we often get are minor, personal variations; outright theft; or unusable material released by the hopelessly naive. In this collection, you are getting information from REAL experts, with REAL years of REAL experience. 32 cds for $400 works out to about $13 each. Seems to me this may be UNDERPRICED if anything. Specifically to this thread, I would say that I am sure there is an idea worth at least $13 on each CD, even if one has a pretty strong background already. |
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Mark Strivings V.I.P. 290 Posts |
This set will be of benefit to everyone who obtains it legally and listens to it.
While I can only speak for myself and my own segment of the overall project (which is on Volume II), I can tell you that I was not told or even hinted to in any way, to tone anything down, to make it appropriate only for beginners, or to hold anything back. I can only assume the same to be true for all of the other guys on the discs. Guys, if I were you, I would stop getting hung up on ad copy and who it 'seems' to be aimed at. Reread the first sentence of this post. I would stop getting hung up on 'cost' and instead start to think in terms of value (take another look at Truthtellers post previous to this one). I would stop getting hung up on exactly 'what is covered' on these recordings (there is a world of information and centuries worth of experience represented here, far too vast to make a list). I would also start thinking in terms of cold hard reality, along these lines. What would it take (in terms of money, time, travel, phone expense, contact time, etc., etc., etc.) for YOU personally to be able to do what has been done for you? In otherwords, what would it take for YOU personally to sit down with each of these guys, one on one, and ask all kinds of questions (if you are now prone to immediately say, 'Well, what kinds of questions?', forget about this set and move on with your life, these recordings are not for you). What would it take for you personally to even be able to talk for more than five minutes with each one of these guys, let alone for 45 minutes to an hour or more, EACH? Guys, it's time to just make a decision and run with it. Either put the money together, get the set and learn from the mountain of information and experience that is represented there, or don't. Two other participants to the project have also appeared on this thread (both with amazing calm in their tone, BTW hi guys!). Personally I'm amazed there is even this much debate. I would think the value of this set should be obvious and I wish I had thought of it. But here's the bottom line. If you don't think you are in a position to benefit from this set (you're already way too advanced to learn from the massive experience of others), if you feel you were talked down to a bit in the ad copy (sheesh), if you think it costs too much (about $13 per cd as pointed out in an earlier post), if you think you're not ready for this material - don't get it. Pure and simple. For the rest of you, you should seriously consider obtaining this set. I'm going to catch heat for recommending this product from another online forum. Personally, I don't care. And I know there will be some who will say that my opinion is biased because I'm one of the participants of the project. Again, I don't care. I AM biased, but only because I have had a chance to experience first hand what this project is all about and I know and clearly understand the value of it. If you were to sit down one on one with the other participants and ask them about it, I'm 100% certain they would all agree with me. Oh wait, sitting down with each of these guys, that's what this is all about. And it's already been done for you. Hmmmmmmm. I stick by my very first statement from this post. It's the truth. Read it again. Mark Strivings
Mark Strivings is the owner of the largest all-mentalism mail order supply business in the world, "Mental Connections", carrying materials not available anywhere else. For complete info, drop Mark a line at MarkyApril@aol.com
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Anabelle Special user 951 Posts |
I'm interested.
Anabelle |
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bibi New user Tel Aviv 16 Posts |
How much did he pay for each conversation?
BIBI |
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christopher carter Special user 660 Posts |
Quote:
On 2003-10-11 22:06, bibi wrote: I was given a brand new Dodge Viper. I don't know about the others. I've hear rumors they got a box of brownies. --Chris |
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ESP Guy Regular user Falls View, Vermont 137 Posts |
Quote:
On 2003-10-11 22:06, bibi wrote: I've heard that it varied from person to person. Some brownies, some Vipers, some helicopter flights over the Grand Canyon, some weekends in Vegas. Even Ben's first born. Thom |
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steveroth New user 54 Posts |
All anyone is asking for is a more detailed listing of the content. $400 is a lot of money for chit chat no matter who is chatting. What is it that this set contains that is not already available in the published works? What will I learn that wil make the purchase worhwhile? Yes, those interviewed are the best in the field, but what is it that they tell us?
Regards, Steve Roth |
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MisterE21 Elite user Salt Lake City, UT 426 Posts |
Mark makes some very strong points above, in my opinion.
How many of us have dropped $50 on a book or DVD that didn't seem to be worth our while? I mean, held NO valuable information for us at ALL? I've done it at least a few times, probably more like 4 or 5 times. That's $250 down the tubes there. Kick in another $100 or so on gaffs and other things that are collecting dust in my drawer and, voila, the set is nearly paid for. We ALL spend out money on things that end up not fitting us; this is just a larger outlay, a larger risk. As I've said, however, there is no great reward without great risk. I cannot even fathom the possibility that through ALL these conversations, not ONE of them would contain some information of worth to me. I'm ordering. I'll review when I get them. E
Your EFFECT is only as good as its AFFECT.
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nimrod Special user 881 Posts |
Judging upon the little info I've managed to collect from the site, I think its for people who begin their way in mentalism.
I'd love to be proven wrong though. I would be willing to risk 13$ for one of those cds, see how it goes, and then for another one if I like what I see, like in Ron's Private Studies series (I even did that with Osterlind's dvds). but 400$ in one shot? nope. I've got beaten too many times folks, we all were. as Mark said, I won't get it for that price, pure and simple. Nimrod , Israel |
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bibi New user Tel Aviv 16 Posts |
So you gave him your best magic for a a box of brownies?
Strange. bibi |
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shrink Inner circle 2609 Posts |
I agree with nimrod. I really wonder what other info is out there apart from the material I've been studying for years. I don't know but I get the feeling a CD for $13 isn't going to have much value to me. So why would I buy 22 of them. But I would be willing to risk the $13.
Money would be better spent buying videos of performances. Or going to see them perform. Like Nimrod Ive been taken to many times in the past. |
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xersekis Special user 591 Posts |
I haven't read all of the posts on this subject. Suffice to say this product is not for everyone.
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restlessplots Regular user 124 Posts |
I was talking with a friend who is trying to raise the money for these cd's. I asked him why, he was willing to spend such a great deal of money on an unknown unproven product. He told me, he was getting them not for their preceived value, but rather their real vaule. I did not understand this statement? so, he went on,
"There will be many who want them for their Preceived value thinking in terms of, this being a limited edition, so they must have some secert knowledge on them, which will make me a super cold reader, so I better buy it." The problem is this is the preceived vaule not the real vaule. Many of us can and have made a decent living without these cd's and will continue to do so. Many mentalist's spend untold amounts of money on the next ebook Bob's next ebook and only to find out, it is not their style, while many others make a living straight out of the 13 steps and PME, again preceived value. The real value of those cd's for me is, they give you a glimspe into the thought process of working professionals, how they think, not so much the effect or methods. Give a man a fish and he eats for one meal, teach a man to fish and he eats everyday. These cd's have insights and perceptions of the person which is the real value, not the preceived value. Is it worth the outlay of cash? maybe--maybe not, but if you are buying it,ask yourself this, "What is it real value to me?" I have seen many items sell out fast because of the preceived value, only to end up in the trade section of the Café. Do not get caught up in the moment and buy something you will not use. If you are looking for usable material and far less expansive read Riggs material--you know the real value in that." (as told by Sir T) RP |
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christopher carter Special user 660 Posts |
Quote:
On 2003-10-13 12:53, bibi wrote: But they were REALLY good brownies. I was trying to make the point that, to my knowlege, those interviewed have no financial stake in the program. Also, most interviewed are not teaching tricks, (again to my knowlege, but I could be wrong), most are talking about performance. These are interviews, kind of like the Martin Breese interview with David Berglass, except that there are a lot more of them. I don't think any one person, other than Ben, knows what's on all the interviews. We mostly just know our own. So if mine is any example, we talked about how I structure my show, story telling, stuff like that. I didn't teach or reveal any tricks. Others may have, because some people interviewed are more trick creators and others are more performers. Personally, I enjoy listening to performers talk about how they do their jobs. I'd rather do that than read a 'how to' book any day. If you are of a similar bent these CDs could be a great experience for you. But other than the fact that I like Ben and I hope he does well, I'm not of a mind to either encourage or discourage people to buy this product. --Chris |
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shrink Inner circle 2609 Posts |
All value is perceived value. The price is what the market will bare. Simple as that. Not the trouble that went into making them not even the contents.
Personally I would like to listen to at least a few of them but to get 22 straight off is something that I really don't want to do. |
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D J Hawkins Veteran user Reading, UK 351 Posts |
Am I right in thinking that only the contributors have actually heard any part of these CDs ? I'm very tempted to part with the cash but would REALLY like to hear an unbiased review before paying.
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brownbeauty Regular user 112 Posts |
I have placed my order and have been told that they will be shipping in several weeks. Only 500 sets of volume 1 will be sold and only 250 sets of volume 2.
Rudy |
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truthteller Inner circle 2584 Posts |
Given the conversational nature of the CD's I think it would be impossible, or at least impractical, to put together any sort of meaningful index. Further, I know from attending lectures that sometimes it is one sentence or one anecdote or a tiny finesse on a move that gets me thinking, and who is to say that same kernel of words will have the same import for everyone else in the room.
I know in my interview that we did talk about methods some, structure, power, scripting, cold reading (as I have a book on it coming out this month), and many other issues. I can say that I have rarely been asked so many interesting and important questions at one place and at one time. Many, I'm afraid, may get this course and be dissapointed because they are not developmentally at a level where the importance of these issues is obvious or applicable to them. I only hope that in these cases the CD's at least open the door to some of the more key issues when it comes to presenting mind reading effectively. There will be some who get these CDs and are at a level where these issues are being pondered in their own work. They may not agree with everything presented, but there is value in having their ideas challenged. To close, I studied trumpet with one of the greatest players in the world. He told me something that has stayed with me to this very day. If you can listen to a CD of a great player and can hear the difference between you and that player, then you have the potential to become as great as that model. The danger is when you are unable to hear the difference. Think about the number of magicians who watch Copperfield and honestly cannot see the difference between themselves and him, less the money he has to put on a show. For these people, no book or CD set will do any good. |
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D J Hawkins Veteran user Reading, UK 351 Posts |
Anyone actually received these cds yet?
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