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JRediens Regular user Roma, Italy 147 Posts |
Hi,
I have to do The cups and balls with an hard sobstitute (Nuts or walnut) I was looking for suggestions about how reduce the sound. I was thinking about covering the inside of the cup (I don't know the right word to express this) with something. Any piece of advice? |
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RS1963 Inner circle 2734 Posts |
Depending on how loud the sound is the noise around where you will be performing may cover the sound. That is unless you are using a metal cup. Cups and Ball's can be done with just about any type of glass or cup, They can be metal, Paper, Plastic, leather, clear glasses wrapped in newspaper. It just depends on what type of routine you want to do.
You could even make up a set of cups that are made of felt. Such as the ones that are used for the routine that was described in Lewis Ganson's Unconventional Magic. |
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Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24312 Posts |
Look at the cups and balls routine in Paul Gertner's Steel and Silver.
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
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JRediens Regular user Roma, Italy 147 Posts |
Unfortunately I will perform during a Theatre act, and I have to match my character, and fit my presentation, my props and my routine to it. So despite it is a controlled situation, I am terribly restrained about what can I use and do. I think I will refrain from doing any move that would be influenced by the noise, and take advantage of it, for example as a convincer for 2-0-2 part.
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RS1963 Inner circle 2734 Posts |
JRediens Bill Palmer just gave the best advice. If you look at Gertner's Routine I'm sure you will find an answer to what you are looking for. Or at the least be starting point for coming up with your own fix to the problem. I really don't think it's that hard of a problem to tackle. Even if you don't have any of Gertner's work to study.
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Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24312 Posts |
Quote:
On 2012-05-05 06:34, JRediens wrote: I'm not advising you to DO Paul's routine. I'm advising you to look at it to see how he handled the noise. Why are you doing the 2-0-2 part, anyway? It's old. It's tired. It's been done to death. Leave it out. Nobody will miss it.
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
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JRediens Regular user Roma, Italy 147 Posts |
I think most of my spectators has never seen the 2-0-2 part, in fact I dare to say that most of them has never seen a Cups and Balls routine. Moreover it fits perfectly the the story. (I have to sum up the first act of "Arlecchino servitore di due padroni" / "Servant of Two Masters" by Goldoni).
On the other hand I think everyone knows the inerzia principle, the nested ball and the penetratrion of three balls you do with them. Since it comes explained, and so poorly done, in any "Young Magician Box". Thanks for pointing me the steel balls routine I will study it! I was telling about my limits not as an excuse to do not study tle Gertner routine, but to not change props as advised in the first answer. |
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Pete Biro 1933 - 2018 18558 Posts |
If you want to use walnuts.... look at my video on you tube. NUTTY SURPRISE is a one cup routine using a clear glass and a cover.
Here's link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AAc6PVfn4c
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
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Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24312 Posts |
If you have a real justification for it, which you apparently do, then there is nothing wrong with the 2-0-2 segment. I've just seen too many people who do it because Vernon did it. That's not necessarily the best reason to do something.
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
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gdw Inner circle 4884 Posts |
What about fake nuts? Rubber ones.
If, for some reason, you feel you need an audible convincer of their authenticity, Tommy Wonder had a great idea for banging two large rubber balls together and having them make a "clack" noise sounding like billiard balls. Could be applied to your nuts.
"You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one."
I won't forget you Robert. |
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Donnie Buckley V.I.P. Cleveland, Ohio 1123 Posts |
JR, congrats on getting the cups and balls included in your theater act!
If you are using walnuts for a cups and balls routine, they must be some pretty big cups. Cover the sound: Gertner's handling will certainly assist you with your problem. Change the nuts: Pete's and gdw's advice is good too. Nutty Surprise includes real walnuts and a silent walnut which you should be able to use in the routine when a silent walnut is necessary. Or you could just do the Nutty Surprise routine in lew of cups and balls. Modify the cups: Find self adhesive felt in your craft store or fabric store. Trace a pattern with ordinary paper of the inside surfaces of the cup that you want to cover and then cut out the felt and stick it inside. Your cups must be pretty big to accomodate walnuts already so you probably have the space for the felt. I would not apply felt all over the inside - this would cause the cups to stick when nested. Most cup sets are designed to stack with little wiggle room so you would want to keep the felt between the saddle and the shoulder bead. You might still get some noise when the cup is turned mouth down, or when the walnut is between two cups. |
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Woland Special user 680 Posts |
Excellent advice on modifying the interior of the cups, Mr. Buckley. There are at least two manufacturers of "silent" walnuts mentioned in recent discussions in this forum. I have examples of both, and I think either would work well in a theatrical situation.
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JRediens Regular user Roma, Italy 147 Posts |
My cups are 3 inch deep and 2.9 wide. Not so big I presume, but they do their job.
I have structured my routine so that I do not worry about sound (no sound missing when it should be there, no sound when it shouldn't), taking ispiration from gerter. Cups aren't so big but I had no intention of nesting, only problem was when I wanted to retain a walnut out of two in the cup with the pinky, so I eliminated this move, so it's ok. I am quite short in time to manage to obtain fake walnuts (no idea where to buy it in Rome and fear of structuring and practicing the routine waiting for it to come from america, just discovering they won't be here in time. If I can find the time to adapt my cups with felt, I will do it. I'm pretty happy with my routine, when it will be accetably smooth I'll post here. |
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Pete Biro 1933 - 2018 18558 Posts |
Wack-O (or I) can express you silent walnuts practically overnight...
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
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funsway Inner circle old things in new ways - new things in old ways 9982 Posts |
One the flip side, you can use the "sound" to produce some additional sleights. Once the audience knows that a Cup with a nut inside makes a certain rattle sound that an empty Cup does not ...
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst
eBooks at https://www.lybrary.com/ken-muller-m-579928.html questions at ken@eversway.com |
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howlinhobbit New user Seattle, WA 53 Posts |
While I am glad that the OP came up with a solution for his dilemma, I'm very happy to hear that folks are still presenting Commedia del Arte shows!
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Gary T. Veteran user 375 Posts |
If you're on stage why not coat the nuts in some sort of clear rubbery glue or something? seems like that wold go a long way to reduce sound and shouldn't be noticible from a distance
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Lawrence O Inner circle French Riviera 6811 Posts |
For noise handling, you should follow Bill's advice but complete it with the descriptions of Conus moves by Robert Houdin (in his balls section) and by Jean Nicholas Ponsin (in his cups section). Conus was using large copper balls and there are advice in these two books that you won't find in Paul Gertner's excellent routine.
Magic is the art of emotionally sharing live impossible situations
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Lawrence O Inner circle French Riviera 6811 Posts |
Quote:
On 2012-05-10 04:08, funsway wrote: I devised a routine with Josh Superfluous where three rubber balls are painted with steel paint (spray from a car dealer) and one steeel ball is painted the same color. The steel ball is held between the fingers and supplies the noise as a rubber ball is placed on the bottom of a cup, Now naturally when the balls are sneaked under the cup, their rubber nature avoids any betrayal of the secret move.
Magic is the art of emotionally sharing live impossible situations
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Alan Munro Inner circle Kentwood, Michigan, USA 5952 Posts |
One of the guys in the local club would produce cue balls from his cups - no noise at all. He smeared clear latex caulk on the inside of the cups, to dampen sound.
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