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epsilon97 Regular user 178 Posts 
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Hey guys,
I am reading through Royal Road, and specifically reading the trick Poker Player's Picnic. To set up this trick you need to put four aces on top of the deck. When you are performing tricks, do you ever set up a deck during the performance? Do you have any tips for doing this secretly? Thanks |
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Harry Lorayne 1926 - 2023 New York City 8558 Posts
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You're kidding, right?
[email]harrylorayne@earthlink.net[/email]
http://www.harrylorayne.com http://www.harryloraynemagic.com |
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Steven Keyl Inner circle Washington, D.C. 2630 Posts
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Epsilon97,
Most card guys are able to set up a stock of cards on top of the deck to prepare for a subsequent effect. Some prefer to cull the required cards into place. Others choose to "just do it". However you choose to go about it, the number of cards you can preposition is dependent on both your comfort level and skill level. Harry has spent a career setting up decks right in front of the spectators without anyone being the wiser. A 4 card setup is pretty standard stuff. As you get more experience you will find you can position more intricate setups. Buta 4 card setup is a nice place to start.
Steven Keyl - The Human Whisperer!
B2B Magazine Test! Best impromptu progressive Ace Assembly ever! "If you ever find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause, and reflect." --Mark Twain |
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Steven Youell V.I.P. 3866 Posts
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Quote:
On 2012-05-13 17:24, epsilon97 wrote: I have personally seen Harry set up a large stack right in front of the audience. And no-- they didn't have a clue. While I haven't seen Harry teach this specifically, if you watch his DVD's you'll see him do it time and time again, so it's not hard to learn. SEY |
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epsilon97 Regular user 178 Posts
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I have one of Harry's DVDs on the way.
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Cameron Francis V.I.P. 7025 Posts
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I way back when, I used to get really nervous about doing this in front of specs. Now I move cards about as I am "looking" for a selection, or, as someone said above, I just kind of do it openly between effects as I'm casually chatting. Sometimes I I'll say something to the effect of, "Let's use these cards for the next trick... On second thought, we'll use these instead..." That works great for casually sitting around with friends magic. On the other hand, if you are doing a formal show, that kind of approach slows things down considerably.
MOMENT'S NOTICE LIVE 3 - Six impromptu card tricks! Out now! http://cameronfrancismagic.com/moments-notice-live-3.html
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Gerald Deutsch Special user 526 Posts
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I have some thoughts about “Pokers Players Picnic”.
1 I’ve always liked this trick and of course it can be set up while performing or you can do this as a first effect but you MUST “shuffle” the deck first. 2 The problem that I see is that a spectator can easily reconstruct the effect of “three to the bottom and one to each pile”. 3 Harry Lorayne has published a number of “cutting the ace” effects in his Reputation Makers where he has some six versions of “To Catch An Ace”. 4 John Bannon published an excellent version of cutting the aces in his book “Smoke And Mirrors” called “Directed Verdict” 5 I’ve always liked Perverse Magic and on the Genii Forum thread back in May 2004 (can still be read) I published: “Cutting the Aces is a show of skill. How can this be presented as "Perverse Magic"? What I do is remove the aces from the deck and then insert them in different parts and shuffle the deck and say I will cut to the four aces. The first cut reveals a five of clubs. I say I will try again and the second cut reveals the five of hearts. Frustrated, I try again and cut the five of spades and finally a fancy cut reveals the five of diamonds and with disgust I say "I quit!" Of course I explain the above in that thread. 6 In that same Perverse Magic thread in September 2009 I use the above noted Bannon routine to have a spectator cut the aces but he gets – threes. But I think much of this thinking came from Pokers Players Picnic. |
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panlives Inner circle 2087 Posts
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Quote:
On 2012-05-13 21:13, Steven Youell wrote: A card worker who many years go attended one of Mr. Lorayne’s workshops told me that Mr. L set up a borrowed deck under the guise of making sure it was complete and complaining (albeit in a jovial way) about the shabby condition of the cards. The worker said it was one of the most natural, casual and exhilarating card things he had ever seen. Every aspect of Mr. Lorayne’s handling was perfectly normal. Diabolically brilliant.
"Is there any point to which you would wish to draw my attention?"
"To the curious incident of the dog in the night-time." "The dog did nothing in the night-time." "That was the curious incident," remarked Sherlock Holmes. |
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epsilon97 Regular user 178 Posts
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@panlives That is the kind of thing you can only learn by performing. But, it is great to know that magicians do this. I think that when I initially asked the question, people don't realize that beginners don't truly know what magicians actually do. I did not know if magicians ever arranged cards while in the middle of a performance. I thought there was a possibility that the magician set the deck before the performance, but then made his routine off this initial set up. This seemed too restrictive to me.
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Hideo Kato Inner circle Tokyo 5649 Posts
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I would first bury the Aces in the deck (Multiple Shift and Flase shuffle), then I produce them by 'PPP' or other ways to reveal them. (I don't perform 'PPP' any more as I have more effective ways to produce four of a kind).
Hideo Kato |
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BarryFernelius Inner circle Still learning, even though I've made 2537 Posts
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I went back and took a look at the Royal Road to Card Magic. Poker Player's Picnic is in the first chapter (The Overhand Shuffle I), and it's the second trick taught in the book.
The text describes a reasonable way to secretly bring the four Aces to the bottom of the deck. The key to the procedure is being casual and making sure that you're not acting guilty. Once the Aces are on the bottom, you can cancel the idea that you could have set up anything by doing a casual OVERHAND SHUFFLE. The shuffle will also bring all four Aces to the top of the deck.
"To achieve great things, two things are needed: a plan and not quite enough time."
-Leonard Bernstein |
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EldonFowler Regular user 110 Posts
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In "Anytime Anywhere" by Jay Sankey, he suggests a method to get a small impromptu stack by
-Openly taking the cards out without the participants seeing what they are -Placing them on top. -Apparently changing your mind. This is important. -Shuffling(false shuffling and keeping on top) them back into the pack. -The motivation for this is "Actually, could you help me out with this?" or "We'll try something different instead." It won't be noticed if your false shuffle is good. Also, some time misdirection between "shuffling" them back in and producing them helps too. I hope you like this solution. |
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Ross W Inner circle UK 1779 Posts
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Epsilon97: for this sort of simple stack, you might try simply starting with the four aces together anywhere in the deck and perform another trick or two first. Unless the cards are very thoroughly shuffled, they're still likely to be roughly together, and much easier to bring to the top.
As for the trick itself, IMO it's a bit meh. That said, I dislike remembering the time I was performing casually in a pub, and a well-oiled spectator grabbed the deck and said the heart-sink phrase, "Here, let me show you a trick.' He proceeded to do PPP. To my lasting horror and shame, everyone LOVED it and thought he was brilliant. |
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epsilon97 Regular user 178 Posts
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Quote:
On 2012-05-14 11:09, EldonFowler wrote: That's a tip that I think I can use. I like the idea of faking like you are changing your mind. |
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Hideo Kato Inner circle Tokyo 5649 Posts
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I like Ross Welford-san's solution most among solutions posted so far. Changing mind solution maybe OK in a casual performance, but looks very suspicious anyway.
If you want to produce four of a kind when the deck is not set, I recommend to do Larry Jennings' 'Prefiguration'. It can be done with the deck spectator shuffled. And it is much more entertaining than 'PPP'. Hideo Kato |
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metaljohn Loyal user Montreal, QC 280 Posts
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Epsilon, Royal Road describes a quick and effective way of doing such a thing right before or right after that trick is explained. In fact, I still use that method even after learning the spread cull
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epsilon97 Regular user 178 Posts
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Quote:
On 2012-05-14 23:05, Hideo Kato wrote: Thanks Hideo Kato. I will have to look up Larry Jennings' Prefiguration. |
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Vu Nguyen New user 26 Posts
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Quote:
On 2012-05-14 23:49, metaljohn wrote: What does spread cull mean? |
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mlippo Inner circle Trieste (Italy) 1227 Posts
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Quote:
On 2012-05-16 01:18, simplethinking wrote: It's a very useful sleight and not too difficult either. It's explained in detail in Card College vol. 1 for example. mlippo |
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metaljohn Loyal user Montreal, QC 280 Posts
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Quote:
On 2012-05-16 03:35, mlippo wrote: Yup, that's where I learned it from actually. |
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Posted: May 13, 2012 09:24 pm 
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