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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Penny for your thoughts » » Secrets of Psychics Revealed » » TOPIC IS LOCKED (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Kondini
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What a lot of words, what a lot of hot air. Magic is an Entertainment, without it`s secrets there would be no magic, no point, the very people exposing the secrets which once put them where they are now are committing suicide,,,,,what a shame they take us all with them. The crux of the **** is MONEY and some people are easily bought.These people are called by a special name Desperate.
NB. For every fool that makes cash from exposure there are many Magicians who have been contacted in a like vein to expose on the box and refused. Including me (Ask Ch 5) !!!!!
hkwiles
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Howard Wiles
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Good on yer Kondini!

Howard
Terry Holley
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Quote:
On 2003-10-25 13:48, shrink wrote:
To be honest I think alls been said that needs to be said in this thread.


shrink:

I disagree. Why can't I get anyone to answer my question that I posted a couple of days ago and which I asked in a bit of a different way in another thread a few months ago?

Here it is again:

Hopefully, I think the following question will "cut to the chase" to some degree.

Are those of you who are mentalists/psychic entertainers/et al, uptight over "exposure" because you want to keep the mystery in the entertainment, or because you want your audience to believe you truly have supernatural/paranormal/supernormal/psychic powers, and "exposure" will show that you probably don't?

Terry
Co-author with illusionist Andre' Kole of "Astrology and Psychic Phenomena."
John Clarkson
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Terry, I think your question puts an interesting spin on the question of why we should care at all about these exposure shows. What, difference, do you think, the answer to your question would make in deciding upon what exposure is acceptable? I somehow think there would be a difference, but I can't seem to articulate it.
Smile

Quote:
On 2003-10-25 15:54, Kondini wrote:
What a lot of words, what a lot of hot air. Magic is an Entertainment, without it`s secrets there would be no magic, no point, the very people exposing the secrets which once put them where they are now are committing suicide,,,,,what a shame they take us all with them. The crux of the **** is MONEY and some people are easily bought.These people are called by a special name Desperate.
...
Well, Kondini, I am happy you declined to participate in the program. I myself am not important enough to even have been asked to participate. If I had been asked, I think I, too, would have declined. However, the fact that you and I may feel that the exposure programs are undesireable does not mean that the people involved are somehow evil, or desperate, or motivated only by money (if that is a bad thing...)

It could be that these people are just as smart, or smarter, than either you or I and that they have just as great a respect for the art as either you or I. It may just possibly be that they simply define "secret" differently, and have a different viewpoint of the effect of these programs.

I am beginning to think that the apparent, nearly obsessive, need to villainize anyone who has a different viewpoint about performance ethics or exposure damages mentalism more than most exposure itself...

Smile
John D. Clarkson, S.O.B. (Sacred Omphaloskeptic Brotherhood)
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"There is nothing more important to a magician than keeping secrets. Probably because so many of them are Gay."
—Peggy, from King of the Hill (Sleight of Hank)
shrink
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This last few weeks alone ive had at least three different occasions where direct influence from those shows has made performing conditions more difficult. And I am now including mentalism as part of personal development courses. And I do not claim psychic powers....
Jnana
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Hi Guy (and Girls) I don't perform for a living I really just like messing with people's heads. My ideas about exposure comes from what I have read in The Book of HauntedMagick by Rick Maue. I believe that I need more then just one way to do things so everything I know isn't shot down by a 1 hour TV show. No, this isn't right but that is just the way it is. I also believe I have to do everything perfect for the sake of everyone who shares ideas with me. I my not have to feed myself by doing these things but other people have to. I owe them the right to do that. I am going over everything I know in an effort to make sure it makes some kind of sense. Even if that sense is only not to look like a magic trick. Just something I happen to think. TONY
When I feel blue I start to breath again
shrink
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Chunking up is a communication style of people who score highly on intuitor on the myers briggs. They are happier playing around with concepts and ideas than specifics. Sometimes that can be helpful. On this occasion I don't think it is. I think it is distracting from the real issue and motivation for this thread. On here also the tone of a post can be misinterpreted. It was meant as a gentle rib.

John if you took serous offence it wasn't meant that way. Although sometimes it does get a bit frustrating chunking up higer when something such as this program has had specific negative effects personally. I have put a lot of work into a new business venture that this exposure could harm and is harming.

If you took it another way then perhaps my communication was in appropriate on this occasion and I do apologise. Smile
John Clarkson
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Shrink, having spent about six years at Stanford in a doctoral program in counseling psychology, I am familiar with the MBTI. (And, I'll admit to a distinctly cognitive-behavioral inclination that causes me to doubt such a Jungian-based typology).....
gawd, I am raising it to an unnecessary level of abstraction! Smile

Yes, shrink, I took serious offense, but I am over it and don't feel a need to spend any more bandwidth on the issue. I respect much of what you say, and I accept your gracious apology.

I think, though, that I will retire for a few days to let others have a chance.

Smile
John D. Clarkson, S.O.B. (Sacred Omphaloskeptic Brotherhood)
Cozener

"There is nothing more important to a magician than keeping secrets. Probably because so many of them are Gay."
—Peggy, from King of the Hill (Sleight of Hank)
John Smetana
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Mr. Clarkson, are you a performer? If yes, do you perform mentalism and/or magic as a professional? (professional in this instance meaning for $$) Just curious.. with all,

Best thoughts,
John Smetana
John Clarkson
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Quote:
On 2003-10-25 19:51, John Smetana wrote:
Mr. Clarkson, are you a performer? If yes, do you perform mentalism and/or magic as a professional? (professional in this instance meaning for $$) Just curious.. with all,

Best thoughts,
John Smetana
Mr. Smetana,

I may be overly suspicious, but I've learned to be wary of people who request information with phrases like, "Just curious." (Besides, this thread is not about me. It is about a program and concepts of exposure.) I'll put aside that particular personality disorder, for the moment, however, and respond directly.

Yes, I perform. Although I have made money with it, I do not support myself with the performance of either magic or mentalism. (See note, below.) I fear, however, that your rejoinder to this will be, "Well, if you were a real performer whose existence depended upon magic or mentalism, your perspective would be different." In anticipation of that, please let me point out that many of the so-called exposers are well-known performers whose livelihood seems to depend upon magic and mentalism and that well-respected professionals have posted that they doubt that exposure (however we define it) has any long-range deleterious effect on magic or mentalism. This indicates to me that one can support him- or herself primarily by performing and still have a differing opinion about what constitutes unacceptable exposure.

And, to ward off yet another apparently common misconception: the fact that I can assume the good faith and respect the arguments of people like Rowland, Brown, Nyman, and many others does not mean I agree with them. I simply think there is value in discussing the various positions on these issues without demonizing people with whom I may not agree. (The value is that I may learn something or actually change my mind!)

Now, off for that well-deserved nap.

Smile

Note: as a dedicated vagabond, I do not support myself by any of my talents. In fact, I find the whole concept somehow repugnant. I merely polish my diamonds and eat my bonbons and have learned that, as long as I never confuse the two, I will survive.
John D. Clarkson, S.O.B. (Sacred Omphaloskeptic Brotherhood)
Cozener

"There is nothing more important to a magician than keeping secrets. Probably because so many of them are Gay."
—Peggy, from King of the Hill (Sleight of Hank)
John Smetana
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John Clarkson wrote:
Note: as a dedicated vagabond, I do not support myself by any of my talents. In fact, I find the whole concept somehow repugnant. I merely polish my diamonds and eat my bonbons and have learned that, as long as I never confuse the two, I will survive.

You and I, Mr. Clarkson, appear to ride the same kind of boat..perhaps we just go in different directions. Thanks for your well measured, if somewhat lengthy, response.

best thoughts,
John Smetana
Smile
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