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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Penny for your thoughts » » Derren Brown on 'The One Show' is this a trick or NLP? (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Mark Timon
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On 2012-07-13 10:19, MatCult wrote:

[/quote]

Yeah, that's 'cause Steve Jobs used advanced NLP from beyond the grave to plant that idea in your feeble human mind. Derren is simply the medium.

Easy.
[/quote]

It's the first time ever that someone in the magic Café while posting had a riot of neurons in his brain at the same time!! The people from American Scientist magazine will contact you shortly.

Take care and get well soon.
Paul Shirley
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Quote:
On 2012-07-12 18:59, mastermindreader wrote:
The point is that we shouldn't even be discussing PS in a public forum.


Thank you Bob. And yes... if you MUST discuss me, I would prefer it happen in 'Inner Thoughts'. Thank you. Smile
IAIN
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I dread to think what your inner thoughts are mate...
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SubconsciousSymbols
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I don't think I was rude to anyone in particular IAIN, some just choose to take it that way.

You have met me in person and so are better placed to make a judgement on me than most and if you found my post to be rude then I will acknowledge that and take it on board.

I must add though that I do not consider my post to be outright exposure. I was merely trying to point people in the right direction, towards achieving their OWN effects.

In hindsight perhaps dropping the PS word was a bit much, although I still think that someone would have to be pretty determined to get to the solution from my words alone. Even worse trivialization and exposure occurs here on a daily basis.

Look forward to seeing you again tomorrow and I hope we can share more pleasant conversation, the likes of which was had last time.

Aw
'The most beautiful experience we can have is the mysterious'
IAIN
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Imagine if you had a show, or were on the telly...you did your thing...

someone pops on here and goes "oh did you see him? it was *this* and *this* mixed with *that*..." - I personally would think - "blimey, and he's supposed to on MY side cos he loves this thing we do? imagine what people must do to one another when they hate each other!"...

its just a forum...no need to get so het up over someone else's opinion...and there's nothing to prove either...

the only thing to be mindful of is, we should always take care of, and respect the methods and techniques we may or may not employ...

I mean, I'm ok - I fell of the same ladder that peter hurkos did so my psychic powers are well potent...
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mastermindreader
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Here's the thing. A guy performs a great effect on TV. Somebody comes on the board and asks how he did it. No one answers directly BUT someone says, "It's all P** S**."

The casual surfer, who also loved the show and wonders how the effect was done, Googles the performer's name and finds this thread.

He reads the comments. "Hmm," he thinks. "P** S***. I get it! It's all a setup! What BS!"

Doesn't matter if the guy's right or not or if he understands what PS really is. He thinks he's got it all figured out and his opinion of the performer and his skills has been diminished accordingly.

And so has the art of mentalism.

If that's "holier than thou" you may feel free to call me Saint Bob. Smile
Mindpro
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Beautifully stated, I couldn't agree more. I think we all need to reminded of this once in a while.
Mark Timon
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Quote:
On 2012-07-13 15:33, Mindpro wrote:
Beautifully stated, I couldn't agree more. I think we all need to reminded of this once in a while.


Maybe I'm crazy but whats the difference between We all that know what PS is and guy googling the web to find it out? or are we in the know a selective club of PS knowers?

Regards
mastermindreader
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Mark-

You kind of missed my point. In my example, the guy isn't googling the web to find out what PS is. He's googling because he saw a guy do something on TV, typed his name into the search engine and was directed here.

But, as I've said earlier, this is one of the reasons that I have decided to no longer post anything involving substantive methods anywhere on the Café.
Mark Timon
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Quote:
On 2012-07-13 16:30, mastermindreader wrote:
Mark-

You kind of missed my point. In my example, the guy isn't googling the web to find out what PS is. He's googling because he saw a guy do something on TV, typed his name into the search engine and was directed here.

But, as I've said earlier, this is one of the reasons that I have decided to no longer post anything involving substantive methods anywhere on the Café.


I respect Mr Cassidy till the end of the Universe, though I think that you overvalue the damage that internet can cause to a such great performer and it's totally impossible to measure. I wish you were my mentor!! but I'm too old now, I think...

Regards
mastermindreader
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Mark-

It's not the damage the Internet can do to great performers like Derren. It's the damage by trivialization that it does to mentalism as a whole.

Thanks for your kind comments.

Best-

Bob
DickDaze
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There's a certain inevitability to this trivialization. Derren Brown does a performance, people are naturally curious. They go online, find the magic Café. Ask a question. Get mocked or told that they this isn't a site for revealing secrets. Someone thinks the poster is getting an overly hard time and throws them a bone. That somone gets jumped on and there ensues a conversation just like this current one about the justified limits of public and semi-public discussion - which serve only to clarify the original 'bone' that was thrown.

When, as in this case - someone with experience in magic asks the elementary question that he did, it seems only fair to give him a nudge in the right direction.

Its all very well saying that we're supposed to all be on the same side; or that wont post anything substantive - but to newbies and many intermediates that is actually a counter productive approach in my view.

Other than vague notions of pushing the art forward, what has Derren Brown done for the average newbie or intermediate mentalist? When was the last time they had a chat with him and got some benifit from being on the same 'side'? It seems you are asking people to 'help' mentalism/professionals in exchange for nothing. People that are looking for broad methods are going to find them. If they don't get an answer, they'll ask again, or google some more. That's not an ideal situation - but that IS the situation. The internet IS here and so is the magic Café and there will never be an end to people being amazed and turning to the internet to learn how it happened.

So the question is. Do you stonewall people and moan (and in the process drag out a discussion that exposes even more); or do you engage them in a spirit of co-operation where they feel included from the start. I know that if I'd come here with a background in magic and asked a question - do I study NLP stuff or look into conjuring and got the run around, I'd think you were a bunch of jerks who might know more than me - but who certainly aren't on my 'side'.
Richard Daze
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John Raff M
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Forgive me in advance for this controversial post.
Am I the only one who thinks that threads like this one and this one http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......um=82&77 go nowhere? "How did Derren do this?" "How did Derren do that?" People get offended. They fight. They get hurt. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE lets leave it and be friends again.

John.

ps. For the record I think Derrens terrific and the really great thing about the clip is his casual almost imromptu syle.
mastermindreader
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Funny, isn't it, how many of us managed to learn the ropes of mentalism in the days before the instant gratification of the Internet? It required much more effort and dedication and, hence, instilled a great deal of respect for the art.

Suggesting that new posters first introduce themselves (to establish exactly what kind of background they have in magic or mentalism), asking that they read the sticky post at the top of the forum and then advising them that methods aren't discussed in the public areas of the forum, is hardly an indication that we are a bunch of jerks.

Quote:
It seems you are asking people to 'help' mentalism/professionals in exchange for nothing.


Really? In exchange for nothing? Have they read my "39 steps" which I've provided free in the sticky topic? Have they read any of my books or Derren's or Richard's (or the many other works that are readily available to anyone who has a sincere interest in the art)?

Sorry you feel we've contributed nothing to newcomers. Perhaps we shouldn't have bothered.
DickDaze
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I'm not saying you are a jerk, nor that you've not/don't contribute anything to newcomers. Rather, I can understand from the pov of a newbie that they might feel that way.

Certainly in the context of the original poster who was asking a very basic question - should he take path a, or should take path b - the response that he got wasn't in my view deserving - and certainly (5 pages later) not effective in the non-trivialization of the art.
Richard Daze
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mastermindreader
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It's not the original poster's question that I was objecting to. It was about the open references to method that followed.
IAIN
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Nothing wrong in asking questions, however if you ask for help, I think we have to listen to the answers properly...people like bob are sharing their experience and knowledge to us louts (for free, because they want to help)...so the very least we can do is to accept it when those answers are somewhat "hard"...and by hard I mean it being something we might not want to hear or do...like "study more..." (for example)...

I have learned a great deal from this place, from all kinds of people in a myriad of ways...its all about respecting the answers we get, respecting the rules and terms of engagement, and working within the framework of this forum...

we should all be INVESTING in mentalism...not financially, but in making sure it is fit and healthy as an artform...which means we have to take care of it...

it is a balancing act between encouragement and safeguarding secrets...sometimes it goes wrong...we're human...

I've found if you are polite, thank people for their time if you've asked a question and got a response, and if new, LISTEN to the requests made by other members...listen to bob, its not out of ego he says something, (dont wanna speak for you bob!) but its out of love of mentalism - he says it out of love for mentalism...

forums are strange places, we all get things wrong at times - one of my major bugbears is the spoonfeeding of links (got a link for that? where do I get so-and-so?) whenever I see that, I think "oh? is it hard to find? lets see...", then I find it via google straight away with basic, common sense search terms...ggggrrrrrrrrrrrrrr! see? pointless rage...

if you think a thread is pointless, ignore it...move on...

buy books, read, make notes, contemplate...go for a walk, think, do other stuff too, watch movies, comedians, absorb...experiment and test ideas out...perform as best you can...rinse, repeat, learn, ask for help, thank them, if you're lucky you end up gaining friends along the way...share with those you trust, invest time and energy into the things you love...rinse, repeat, grow...

</rant>
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boydy
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Can't wait for Derrens ultimate book. It will go down in history like Berglas's and probably cost $34 million on the after market.
IAIN
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Quote:
On 2012-07-14 04:19, boydy wrote:
Can't wait for Derrens ultimate book. It will go down in history like Berglas's and probably cost $34 million on the after market.


I doubt he'd do one...he'll dissapear like Canasta did and just paint...or become a self-help style guru...
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parmenion
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He'll doesn't need to write one, everything he does is already explain on the Café! lol
"Nitchevo" sign of time surely...
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