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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Penny for your thoughts » » Derren Brown on 'The One Show' is this a trick or NLP? (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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mastermindreader
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Anyone care to make a guess about the frequency of posts that basically ask- "I just saw Derren Brown do X? Is it a trick or NLP?"
IAIN
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Cos of the new stageshow and his tv appearances, I'll go for a fever pitch of 17 different threads started in here and elsewhere about his latest stuff...
I've asked to be banned
Mindpro
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I really don't want to know, but I guess it shows how many UK members are represented here, and how many newbies come here just to learn how.
mastermindreader
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Quote:
On 2012-07-06 13:52, IAIN wrote:
Cos of the new stageshow and his tv appearances, I'll go for a fever pitch of 17 different threads started in here and elsewhere about his latest stuff...


I'd say that over the past year there have been at least a few dozen first time posters asking that very question here on the Penny forum.
dmoses
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"STICKY" time!
"You're a comedian. You wanna do mankind a service, tell funnier jokes."
TPR by Dave Moses and Iain Dunford
DJ Trix
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXFz9hsWhFg&feature=relmfu

Some more effects from Derren on similar lines.
The Lone Stranger
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It is a shame that people these days cannot enjoy an effect without having to know where it can be learned or where it can be bought. It will unfortunately be the same for the trick performed by Dynamo whose new TV series was aired here in the UK last night. As Mastermindreader has correctly highlighted within a few days there will be loads of new posts/posters asking how and where they can by some of these effects.

I am afraid you have to learn to crawl before you can walk, so I would suggest if the original poster has a genuine interest in learning about mentalism they at least learn the basics and then develop thing one step at a time from there, otherwise you will just become another trick monkey.
Sorry if this seems a rant but over the last few days a lot of the people whose work and knowledge is priceless to newbies have posted about exposure and the very same thing that this post is about, and how they are no longer willing to share this knowledge as freely as they have in the past.

I for one wil be gutted as I have learned such a lot from these people and still am and to lose knowledge such as this from the forum does not bear thinking about.

I obviously made the mistake of taking the time to learn instead of getting my post count up.
jeggintonfilms
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Quote:
On 2012-07-06 13:53, Mindpro wrote:
I really don't want to know, but I guess it shows how many UK members are represented here, and how many newbies come here just to learn how.


Whilst I appreciate this probably wasn't soley aimed at myself, with due respects It's slightly naive of you (and several others) to assume I'm a newbie because I happened to ask a question regarding Derren Brown.

Forgive me but is this not a place where fellow magicians, mentalists and performers in general share experiences and learn from one another?

Whilst I am new to the art of mentalism (just intrigued at this stage), I am by no means; as stated in my initial post, new to magic. I have been performing close-up for over 8 years and up until about 2 years back I was a member of the magic circle (probably adds little credibility) so fear not, I am not 'another' YouTuber 'Chris Angel' wannabe who's simply fishing for secrets. I am here to talk with others, listen to their experiences / advice as well as giving the same in return where I can.

regards

Jonty Smile
Mindpro
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Quote:
On 2012-07-06 15:03, The Lone Stranger wrote:
It is a shame that people these days cannot enjoy an effect without having to know where it can be learned or where it can be bought. It will unfortunately be the same for the trick performed by Dynamo whose new TV series was aired here in the UK last night. As Mastermindreader has correctly highlighted within a few days there will be loads of new posts/posters asking how and where they can by some of these effects.


This is one of my concerns about our industry, is today audiences, especially the younger generation, automatically seem to know or believe it somehow can be done or is a trick. They don't even have the thought process that it could be real. This as I see it is a detriment to Mentalism.

I remember the first time seeing Kreskin, Uri Geller, and another great of the time who's name escapes me (Peter? maybe Bob could help me I know he probably knows who I'm talking about - a t.v. mentalist of the 60's and maybe 70's) on Mike Douglas, Sullivan, The Tonight Show, Merv Griffin, Hollywood Palace, Virginia Graham, Joey Bishop and other talkshows, you were automatically blown away with amazement at what these guys did, and believed they had special powers and abilities. It was never even a though or idea in your mind of how it was done, or it being magic or trickery.

Today everyone automatically seems to think "how" or that it is a trick that can be learned.
Peter_turner
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I enjoyed the footage here, thanks for posting Smile

I like how relaxed Derren is, his pacing is lovely!

Pete
Shrubsole
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I have found over the years that apart from being a part of the act/routine, it matters little what I say in the way of any claims or lack of them. It's more what's in their minds before I appear than anything I say, no matter how convincing.

I've had all types: One who thought that I do have special powers, one who butted in and said "no he doesn't he uses body language reading/NLP" only to get countermanded by someone else interjecting with "No he...." (Add the most ridiculous and impossible to do explanation here). In fact they seem to be able to argue without me saying a word.

That's a good time for me to remain silent and let them hype me way beyond any advertising I do put together.

...but it's really because of that as to why I personally chose to be a little vague in the area of claims and false explanations. If I have asked someone to think of something and after some overacting I name the thought of item, then I think that they will call that mind reading all by themselves. And to me it doesn't really matter what I call it as they will make up their own minds. Same if I bring down a big envelope that has been in view the whole time... it's a prediction!

As another point: After doing Osterlinds AI, they called it mind reading and I once corrected them and said "No, actually it was a more prediction, followed by a spot of clairvoyance". Blank looks followed. I explained that I didn't ask the first two to think of anything until after I had written something down so I couldn't read what they were thinking of before I had asked them to think of it. Blank looks continued. I said that what I did was to predict what the person(s) was going to name as their friend and then date-of-birth. I then went on to explain clairvoyance as no one had seen the card in the man's pocket...

That was when I learnt never to do that again! (The explanation not AI) it only confused them further and really if they want to call the whole thing mind reading and they go home happy, LET THEM!

I also don't mind if they think I used NLP or mass hypnosis. It's all good and they talk about it for days arguing away.

Sorry this post had a point when I started it, but got lost somewhere....
Winner of the Dumbringer Award for total incompetence. (All years)
Shrubsole
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Quote:
On 2012-07-06 15:20, Mindpro wrote:

This is one of my concerns about our industry, is today audiences, especially the younger generation, automatically seem to know or believe it somehow can be done or is a trick. They don't even have the thought process that it could be real. This as I see it is a detriment to Mentalism.
Today everyone automatically seems to think "how" or that it is a trick that can be learned.


I see that reaction a lot with younger people when they watch it on TV and have never seen an actual live performance of anything. They are good to do an effect on which is ultra clean and where they really do have a free choice. It's great to see their faces when I have done nothing, no moves, all above board and ending clean and yet the impossible has happened. I get a real kick when I see them shut up and question their own beliefs in reality.
Winner of the Dumbringer Award for total incompetence. (All years)
LBP MAGIC
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I might suggest that in GOOD mentalism and magic there are no tricks. the "trick" is the last thing that any self respecting magician is worried about. tricks are for school girls and boys without imagination.

or is it possible that the real trick of SUCCESSFUL magicians is tricking all the other boys without imagination into believing that it is all about the trick?
innercirclewannabe
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Quote:
On 2012-07-06 16:16, LBP MAGIC wrote:
I might suggest that in GOOD mentalism and magic there are no tricks. the "trick" is the last thing that any self respecting magician is worried about. tricks are for school girls and boys without imagination.

or is it possible that the real trick of SUCCESSFUL magicians is tricking all the other boys without imagination into believing that it is all about the trick?


Actually I think that for most Magican's the "trick" IS everything! Whereas,the "effect" in Mentalism should always be secondary...
Tá sé ach cleas má dhéanann tú sé cuma mhaith ar cheann.
LBP MAGIC
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Quote:
On 2012-07-06 16:22, innercirclewannabe wrote:
Quote:
On 2012-07-06 16:16, LBP MAGIC wrote:
I might suggest that in GOOD mentalism and magic there are no tricks. the "trick" is the last thing that any self respecting magician is worried about. tricks are for school girls and boys without imagination.

or is it possible that the real trick of SUCCESSFUL magicians is tricking all the other boys without imagination into believing that it is all about the trick?


Actually I think that for most Magican's the "trick" IS everything! Whereas,the "effect" in Mentalism should always be secondary...


effect trick hocus pocus use whatever word you want but 95% of "magicians" and "mentalists" are focused on the wrong thing. Its the same reason that 95% of this crap sucks.
mastermindreader
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I would argue that the 95% of "mentalists" you refer to aren't mentalists at all.
Peter_turner
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Quote:
On 2012-07-06 16:49, mastermindreader wrote:
I would argue that the 95% of "mentalists" you refer to aren't mentalists at all.


:D

Pete
Shrubsole
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That mentalist Richard Osterlind taught me everything I needed to know about The Linking Rings!

(Let's see who bites Smile )
Winner of the Dumbringer Award for total incompetence. (All years)
Mindpro
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Quote:
On 2012-07-06 17:19, Shrubsole wrote:
That mentalist Richard Osterlind taught me everything I needed to know about The Linking Rings!

(Let's see who bites Smile )


Troublemaker.
thedebonair
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Is it not a sign of a successful performance if people want to know how you do something? If I ever get to that point I'd take it as a huge compliment that folks wanted to know. I'm starting to learn slowly and I take great delight in the fact that I know things and others don't, I wouldn't get offended by it, it makes me smile. I'll probably get shot down in flames for saying that........you lot can be quite scary!

Not watched the DB 'The One Show' thing but I think I'll have to now!
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