|
|
|
|||
| Go to page [Previous] 1~2~3..12~13~14~15~16~17~18 [Next] | ||||||||||
Dreadnought Special user Athens, Georgia 836 Posts 
|
I don't know why it's not true. I was in Ranger Bat and we had two women attached to us, one served in PAC and the other in supply, they were both assigned to the S shops not at company level. One was housed at 9th Avaition and the other at 9th Signal, I think that was the units they came from. One was there a year and one longer, I don't know how long as I came down on orders for Germany and she was still in PAC when I out processed. I knew of two women who wore green berets and had the 5th SF group on their shoulder. All were airborne qualified and none wore their particular unit's tab. The two women assigned to our battalion had to maintain their airborne qualification which meant, at times, a forced march with combat dress. When we went to the field, they went. If we deployed, they deployed with us.
To Santa: In terms of physical assessment.The army is the same way in terms of physical assessment, age and gender. Peace and Godspeed.
Peace
"Ave Maria gratia plena Dominus tecum..." Scott Would you do anything for the person you love? |
|||||||||
|
Dreadnought Special user Athens, Georgia 836 Posts
|
Also, Defcon levels change. I would imagine that Defcon 1 is the same. Defcon 1 (Nuclear War or invasion is imminent), during the Cold War era, called for, and I would imagine, still calls for, all able bodied citizens to include women and children. Just what role women and children would play, I have never been real sure of, be it manning a defensive position or helping out in medical and supply units.
Peace and Godspeed.
Peace
"Ave Maria gratia plena Dominus tecum..." Scott Would you do anything for the person you love? |
|||||||||
MagicSanta Inner circle Northern Nevada 5841 Posts
|
I agree with Dread we just have to give seminars on sensativity to the enemy. It can be like OSHA, we require the enemy to pass a test and they get a special wrist band to wear.
We will even change the green beret song Put rainbow bands upon their wrist It indicates they chased their bliss These burly people are Americas best Let's ignore their arse and chest |
|||||||||
|
Marlin1894 Special user 559 Posts
|
Quote:
On 2012-07-19 15:53, Dreadnought wrote: I don't know much about the Army but I believe you just explained why it's not true at the end of your comment. Someone in supply or PAC (is that personnel?) or admin in general takes the same annual PFT that everyone else does. Correct? There is no seperate PFT (I'm going say PFT because I'm not sure what the Army calls it. But I mean a Physical Fitness Test) based on MOS is there? So a woman who went to admin school has not had to meet even the same physical requirements of a male who goes to the same school. Because there are seperate PFT's for men and women. Not to mention that Infantry Training school is more rigorous physically than most admin type schools. See what I'm saying? So couldn't a person easily be attached to, or be stationed in, a "combat zone" without having met the same physical requirements as the infantry troops they are supporting? Or, in fact, not even met the same physical requirements as the men who share the same MOS? |
|||||||||
|
Dreadnought Special user Athens, Georgia 836 Posts
|
Those new lyrics make sense considering that statue they have. If you really want to pi88 off a green beret, just refer to that statue by it's nickname.
Peace and Godspeed.
Peace
"Ave Maria gratia plena Dominus tecum..." Scott Would you do anything for the person you love? |
|||||||||
|
LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1196 Posts
|
Quote:
On 2012-07-19 15:35, MagicSanta wrote: A straw man is an easy-to-defeat argument that you attribute to your opponent, even though he doesn't hold it. you put words in his mouth, and set up the straw man so you can knock it down. In this cases, Aces has repeatedly said or suggested that Bob and I believe that women in general can compete equally against men in physical contests - a ridiculous position that is easy to knock down. But the fact of the matter is that we haven't said anything of the sort. We've only ever said that SOME women are better than SOME men, and *those* women should have the opportunity. Seriously, the opposing argument to me reads like something close to: "White people are better than black people at hockey. There has never been a black player on a Stanley Cup Champion, and no team from Africa has ever won an Olympic medal. All good International hockey teams comes from overwhelmingly white countries. Therefore, there should be a rule that black payers aren't allowed to play in the NHL." For more on straw men, do a user name search from one of our dearly departed whose name I won't mention. But it rhymes with "dance." Pretty much any random post will do.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
|||||||||
S2000magician Inner circle Yorba Linda, CA 3465 Posts
|
Quote:
On 2012-07-19 16:17, LobowolfXXX wrote: That's like a clue, isn't it? |
|||||||||
Destiny Inner circle 1429 Posts
|
Must be the American accent - when you say it with an Aussie accent it rhymes with crazy duck.
|
|||||||||
|
Dreadnought Special user Athens, Georgia 836 Posts
|
The Army PT test is not designed to break down by MOS. Every soldier takes the same PT test, push ups, sit ups and a two mile run based on their age and gender. Ranger units require all personnel to pass the test at the 18 year old level and score at least 90%. So, the women had to pass the test for an 18 year old female at the 90% level. There was also a quarterly 5 mile run that had to be completed, I can't remember the time, but it was a fast paced not a leisurely jog, since there was no Army standard for a five mile run, the standard was set by the Ranger Regiment and even the two females had to meet that standard. There was also a 25 mile forced march in combat dress, again the standard was set by the Ranger Regiment ( I think that was 3 or 3 1/2 hours). The only thing MOS centered is the MOS qualification test one had to take every year.
The current PT standards are, and I believe they were the same back in the 80's. Men (18 yoa) Men (18 yoa)@90% Women (18 yoa) Women (18 yoa)@90% Push ups (2 min. timed) 49 64 25 36 Sit ups (2 min. timed) 59 72 Same Same 2 mile run (Timed) 15:12 13:42 18:06 16:24 Also, Army basic training is broken down into two phases. The first phase is basic training which is basic infantry training which everyone receives which is 8 week. The second phase is the AIT phase (Advanced Individual Training. The length of AIT training is different depending on the MOS. Advanced infantry training (those people with the specific infantry MOS) is another 8 weeks. Some schools are shorter than that, others are much longer some were a year long. Peace and Godspeed.
Peace
"Ave Maria gratia plena Dominus tecum..." Scott Would you do anything for the person you love? |
|||||||||
|
Marlin1894 Special user 559 Posts
|
Precisely Dreadnought.
That's why the statement "however they are already assigned or attached to those units in a merely support role, which means they have to meet the same and more strenuous physical requirements as the men." is incorrect. There are women attached to infantry units in support roles who have NOT met "the same and more strenuous physical requirements as the men". That's all I'm saying. I'm not trying to give you a hard time, believe me. |
|||||||||
|
Dreadnought Special user Athens, Georgia 836 Posts
|
Okay that table didn't turn out as readable as I thought it would, here it is again.
Push ups (2 min. timed) Men (18 yoa) 49 / Men (18 yoa)@90% 64, Women (18 yoa) 25 / Women (18 yoa)@90% 36 Sit ups (2 min. timed) Men & Women (18 yoa)59 / Men & Women (18 yoa)@90%72 2 mile run (Timed) Men (18 yoa)15:12 / Men (18 yoa)@90% 13:42, Women (18 yoa)18:06 / Women (18 yoa)@90% 16:24 Peace and Godspeed.
Peace
"Ave Maria gratia plena Dominus tecum..." Scott Would you do anything for the person you love? |
|||||||||
|
Dreadnought Special user Athens, Georgia 836 Posts
|
Quote:
On 2012-07-19 16:36, Marlin1894 wrote: Not incorrect, just semantics. Peace and Godspeed.
Peace
"Ave Maria gratia plena Dominus tecum..." Scott Would you do anything for the person you love? |
|||||||||
|
Marlin1894 Special user 559 Posts
|
No. Not semantics. It's actually incorrect, but I will drop it.
Peace and Godspeed to you Sir. Thanks for your Service. |
|||||||||
|
acesover Special user I believe I have 821 Posts
|
Quote:
On 2012-07-19 14:25, mastermindreader wrote: Alright lets me understand you. You are saying women should be allowed in combat situations with men as long as they qualify. Hmmmm as long as they qualify. What standards are the qualifications? Are they different then the men? Please answer. By your logic we can accept 11 year olds into combat situations. All we havea to do is lower the standards or as you say qualifications. Now they are as you say qualified. Seriously now does that make sense? When you passed your bar exam did they have lower standards for people not as smart as yourself? Do you think they should? I mean those people who want to be lawyers just as badly as you did. They went to college received the education but for some reason or other they could not make the grade. So by your logic those people should have a different set of standards to be judged on because they are having a hard time passing the bar exam. So lower the standard so they can pass. Let them defend the innocent. So what if they mess up...so let them back up their fellow soldiers in combat along with themselves so what if they are not quite as good as they should be. Lower the standards. Then they qualify. Well I certainly don't want a lawyer defending me that can't pass the bar exam. Nor do I want help from someone in a combat situation who does not pass the same qualifications as I did but are there because they lowered the bar so they can be a combat soldier. If the womanis capable of doing everything their male counterpart can do fine. But as soon as you make exceptions because they are women it is off the table. However what went on in Nam I personally do not think many women could handle what we encountered and how we responded.
If I were to agree with you. Then we would both be wrong. As of Apr 5, 2015 10:26 pm I have 880 posts. Used to have over 1,000
|
|||||||||
mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts
|
How many times do you want me to answer the same question? I have said at least a half dozen times that they should have to meet the same physical and mental qualifications as the men.
|
|||||||||
|
acesover Special user I believe I have 821 Posts
|
Quote:
On 2012-07-19 17:31, mastermindreader wrote: But they don't have to. That is the issue.
If I were to agree with you. Then we would both be wrong. As of Apr 5, 2015 10:26 pm I have 880 posts. Used to have over 1,000
|
|||||||||
|
LobowolfXXX Inner circle La Famiglia 1196 Posts
|
Quote:
On 2012-07-19 17:20, acesover wrote: If you're seriously asking the question in your first paragraph, you aren't reading the replies.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley. "...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us." |
|||||||||
|
mastermindreader 1949 - 2017 Seattle, WA 12586 Posts
|
JEEEZ! You asked for our opinions about whether women should be in the infantry or not! I gave you mine.
My position has nothing whatsoever to do with whether or not standards are currently different for women. That wasn't the question. You've already agreed with my entire argument when you wrote, "If the woman is capable of doing everything their male counterpart can do fine." |
|||||||||
|
Marlin1894 Special user 559 Posts
|
Quote:
On 2012-07-19 17:33, acesover wrote: Ok, now I'm lost. At present women can't serve in the infantry at all. By any standard, right? I thought this was a theoretical discussion at this point. Did I miss an annoucement from the Pentagon or something? |
|||||||||
critter Inner circle Spokane, WA 2653 Posts
|
Quote:
On 2012-07-19 16:29, Destiny wrote: This doesn't help because you people pronouce crazy as "cry-zee." At least, Crocodile Dundee does.
"The fool is one who doesn't know what you have just found out."
~Will Rogers |
|||||||||
| The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Not very magical, still... » » Interesting Poll: Should women join the infantry (0 Likes) | ||||||||||
| Go to page [Previous] 1~2~3..12~13~14~15~16~17~18 [Next] | ||||||||||
Posted: Jul 19, 2012 07:53 pm 
| [ Top of Page ] |
|
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2024 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved. This page was created in 0.08 seconds requiring 5 database queries. |
|
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic. > Privacy Statement < 
|