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jay leslie V.I.P. Southern California 9498 Posts |
•The show was outside.
•Very windy. •They asked If I had a sound system because theirs didn't work "too good" but if it "went out" the custodian could wiggle the wires. •The custodians were setting the stage in place AS 1200 kids started walking to the playground (all carrying chairs 800 feet) •Someone didn't get the memo about NOT being behind me, because half a dozen classes initially started to put their chairs behind the stage. •The kids ended-up siting in a huge semicircle (1200 of them) so they were at least 40 feet away. •I was lifting my tables on the stage while being introduced because the custodians started late. •The sun was behind me and many of the kids were holding their arms above their eyes. •Immediately after the show, school let out SO I had to cart 3 loads of stuff through the campus because I couldn't drive my car there. •The principal told me the check was in the office a quarter mile away (but didn't bring it) What was the good part? Two kids said that they weren't sure the magic was real BUT they knew I didn't try to fool them when I escaped from the Straitjacket. So my thought is, when you perform magic, sometimes the audience feels like you "pulled one over on them" but when you perform an escape they accept it as skill and actually root you on. I have never had anyone root me on, when the die re-appears in the hat. Have you else had kids root for you, when you fooled them?
Jay Leslie
www.TheHouseOfEnchantment.com |
MagiCol Special user Dargaville, New Zealand 929 Posts |
Well, at a youngster's birthday party [turned 5] I had a mixed group of kids watching. I did the Magic Colouring book, and as is my habit after it gave out a look-alike colouring book to the birthday child for her to have. After the show her big sister of 10 or so came to me and said, "I didn't get the colouring book."
I answered "Well, it's just for the birthday child,sorry." She said, 'I didn't get it. What I mean is, I figured out how most of the magic was done [I guess she thought she did, being at that know-it-all stage], but I didn't get the colouring book.' The penny dropped for me. She meant she hadn't been able to figure out how it worked. Of course, I didn't tell her.
The presentation makes the magic.
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Mary Mowder Inner circle Sacramento / Elk Grove, CA 3659 Posts |
I've had kids "root" for mismade Jack-O-Lantern to work and Butterfly Blendo as well. It's not like chanting or anything but I can hear and feel their good will.
I really feel they want my Book Test to work. I have several effects where it would seem they are causing the Magic so of course they are behind me there. Whenever I do a knacky juggling thing the kids root me on. Like build up to juggling three with some silliness or Toss a Knot in a rope or throw a ball over my shoulder while juggling. This is kind of a build up thing. -Mary Mowder |
jay leslie V.I.P. Southern California 9498 Posts |
But was she happy that you fooled her?
Jay Leslie
www.TheHouseOfEnchantment.com |
Mary Mowder Inner circle Sacramento / Elk Grove, CA 3659 Posts |
I go to a show feeling that they want to see Magic and that it is a group effort to make that happen.
I mention stretching their imagination to see the Magic and such. So when they see Magic it is partly by their good efforts. I think that comes across in my show and they respond that way to some extent. -Mary Mowder |
jay leslie V.I.P. Southern California 9498 Posts |
I agree on juggling. I was just wondering about older kids, teenagers and adults.
Jay Leslie
www.TheHouseOfEnchantment.com |
Michael Baker Eternal Order Near a river in the Midwest 11172 Posts |
I think much depends on the posturing of the performer. Define the protagonist and the antagonist in any magic effect and you should have a pretty clear answer as to whom the audience will lend their alliance.
~michael baker
The Magic Company |
TonyB2009 Inner circle 5006 Posts |
No one ever roots for me, because there is no adversarial element to my performance. I am not trying to fool the kids. That is completely immaterial. I am there to entertain them. So we are all on the same side.
Check out Tony's new thriller Dead or Alive http://www.amazon.co.uk/Alive-Varrick-Bo......n+carson
http://www.PartyMagic.ie |
jay leslie V.I.P. Southern California 9498 Posts |
See
That's the spirit. I guess the subtext to my initial thought is that the public occasionally assumeS it's an "us against them" dynamic. Overcoming that by putting entertainment first should be the goal. I've just noticed that performing something physical, possibly seen as a stunt, can not be misconstrued as a trick and therefore you and your act are not something to be conquered. (figuratively speaking)
Jay Leslie
www.TheHouseOfEnchantment.com |
Potty the Pirate Inner circle 4632 Posts |
In my shows, there are very few "tricks" in which I apparently "make the magic happen". When the magic works, it's almost always after multiple failures, and it's the kids in the audience, or a kid helper, who are required to actually effect the magic.
In the very rare moments where I've managed to do the magic "myself", I'm always just as astonished as the audience. Or, I pretend to have no idea how it happened. This means that I almost never "pull one over" on my audiences, so they don't feel stupid for not "getting it". |
billappleton Inner circle Los Gatos, California 1154 Posts |
Even with a die box I am the one who doesn't know which door. They are trying to help. Teach them to yell out the answers at your peril.
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KC Cameron Inner circle Raleigh, North Carolina 1944 Posts |
Jay, in your escape it is still an "us against them" dynamic, it is just "Us" is you and the audience and "them" is the straitjacket.
I think the "adversarial" component is great, it just doesn't mean you and the audience have to be on opposite sides. One side can be a prop, or as in my show, it is the kids and me against the dads (in a very funny way). In it I make fun of myself, and I make fun of dads, and everyone finds it very funny. If it is between you and the kids, it is almost always better when you lose. |
jay leslie V.I.P. Southern California 9498 Posts |
The strait jacket is a device. The drama is "man against machine". It's the same plot as any movie where a person is restrained and the drama occurs when they escape. Sometimes the good- guy is restrained, sometimes the bad- guy. In both oppsing cases it's not a "us against them" scenario. It's all about the device and weather the actor does or does not escape (and the good or evil that comes from it).
In a live show, the people doing the restraining may or may not be members of the audience therefore the struggle is not connected to personality. The struggle is related to the ability of the person to escape. Adding a penalty is yet another layer. The penalty can be self- imposed such as a burning rope, and if the performer does not escape the hanging jacket in time, they fall on their head. Again there is no "us against them" motivation so theatrically speaking, the struggle is "man against machine". Escapes may begin with a challenge but the audience comes over to your side when they realize you are trapped. In the case of select tricks, the only way the magic can happen is if the magician looks good but the audience does not. Many sucker tricks work like that. Incidentally I perform sucker tricks at parties all the time so I'm not degrading them. I'm just saying that adding an escape, shows the audience you are not taking advantage of them. Oh, you might be... But the perception is that you are not. If you would be interested in the psychology of escapes then please join us in the " all tied up" section. Perhaps others there can explain it better.
Jay Leslie
www.TheHouseOfEnchantment.com |
KC Cameron Inner circle Raleigh, North Carolina 1944 Posts |
Wow, I didn't realize I was pushing your buttons Jay. You obviously did not read my post well before you blew up and tried to take me to the wood shed . . . because you said the same thing I was saying:
Quote: You are getting all in a fluster over semantics.
so theatrically speaking, the struggle is "man against machine". I know you like to be considered the "escape guy" here in "lil Darlings", but others of us have done our share of escapes too. BTW, what is your most daring escape? Here is mine: Chained, handcuffed, neck shackled, bagged, tied to concreate blocks and pushed through 6 inches of ice into a flowing Alaskan river at -33° (yes, 33 BELOW ZERO, into a flowing river through 6 inches of ice . . . ) I know people like to disbelieve, so here is a video of it: http://youtu.be/VvHCwXeI20s |
jay leslie V.I.P. Southern California 9498 Posts |
Nope, you didn't push my buttons. Just a friendly discussion. You wrote a statement that was incorrect but you didn't push my buttons. A jacket or a device is not capable of acting on it's own so the plot-line is "Man against machine" not Us Against Them. Us Against Them is a feeling or an emotion. The plot-line of Man Against Man might be Good vs. Evil, Alien Vs Human ex-cetera. If it were "Man Against Man" that would involve outthinking someone else, as in a race using different courses OR possibly an arm wrestling match. When you were under water, you were on your own so there couldn't have be a "them" in that case either. You didn't escape from people you escaped from the restraints.
My avatar has a jacket. Last year I had a fuzzy little bunny 5 years ago I had 4 eyes and maybe the next time I might change to me in clown make-up. That escape you've posted on Youtube should be seen by everyone. You should have had, a half-hour TV special built around it. I bet if you posted the link in the All Tied Up section everyone would go crazy. There are so many magicians who are motivated to be magicians because they read about Houdini but not that many who understand the way in which audiences give respect after an escape is performed. All the time. I hear people mutter (in the halls of the Magic Castle) "What did he do with his hands? - He tricked us. - I know he did something but I don't know what it was. _ He was slick". In our touring illusion shows, people would say things like. I know all those big tricks work by hiding the girl in the base of the illusion. (It's especially funny when they've said it about the shadow box) then they would counter with 'But when you escaped from the rope OR you got out of that jacket, I knew you weren't tricking us, that it was real. All I'm doing in this thread, is pointing-out that if you have the possibility of adding an escape to another style of show, that might be a good thing. I don't need to convince you of that because you have obviously "Made the grade" and yes, I know there are inherit problems like; If the kids are under 7 (and are not completely logical yet) if they are handed your handcuffs and put their hand through them (because they are small), they assume you also slipped out. So I accept that escapes are not always the best great add-on but anytime you can have adults tie you up, or lock you in, the kids more readily accept the restraint as real. My credits in escapes; I'm in the encyclopaedia of handcuffs, Published two DVds on escapes and am one of 5 or 6 living people to do this. http://jayleslie.com/pages/Escape%20Arti......4B0.html It's funny though.... I used this escape as a promotional video to schools and my business dropped-off immediately. The PTA would make comments like "We can't have a criminal come to our school OR We're trying to teach the kids about values and you're not". That's funny because the entire promotion was about doing the impossible - about NOT being held-back, that the human spirit can overcome all obstacles. but they didn't get it. All they saw was a guy being locked-up and the entire Houdini, escape, nothing's impossible concept went out the window. Another plot-line that occurred to me is that certain magic tricks and illusions have the same motivation and Sub-script as escapes. It is "The human spirit can not be held back" A popular sub-plot in many movies where people are trapped, yet they overcome. In this instance the Sword basket and the Strait jacket have the same sub-plot "Even though I am restrained, I will overcome". The sword basket because the assistant is poked, sat on, stomped on and yet she reappears triumphant - the strait jacket escape for the same reason "Even though the performer is restrained they emerge triumphant". You can't say that about an Asrah. In an Asrah the sub-script is one of dying and rebirth. many of the old illusions have roots in ancient traditions and are theatrical reproductions of those ancient ceremonies (without people actually getting hurt). Anyway. I really think you should wander over to the "All Tied Up" section and say hello. Most of those guys never post in other sections. And that's another reason I started this thread right here. I sometimes post in various sections involving a process or effect the members would never consider. I try to cross-thread (my term). For example: I've noticed the people in Workers rarely post anything in Ballooning so I might take a balloon trick and post it in the card workers section, if it's related to cards. It's good to get different perspectives.
Jay Leslie
www.TheHouseOfEnchantment.com |
KC Cameron Inner circle Raleigh, North Carolina 1944 Posts |
You are arguing semantics. I know who you are Jay, I bought your straitjacket video back when it was VHS and again earlier this year on DVD. I wasn't referring to your picture, but your interests.
As for that video, it was on TV, just state level, not national. It was part of a promo of a larger show I did for a Fairbanks charity nearly 25 years ago (as shown on my t-shirt). Anyway, I posted that just because you were schooling me like a kid - over semantics - and still seem to be! As for escapes, I did them for a while, but they don't interest me anymore. I really don't like watching them or doing them. That is not a comment about escapes, it is a comment about me. We all have our interests. Anyway, I have to wear a back brace now if I get very physical at all, so I couldn't do escapes if I wanted too. I tried this year to do a comedy straitjacket escape again, and ended up writhing in pain on my living room floor. I did a lot of stunts, fire eating, bed-of-nails, block head, walking on broken glass, and they generally have a similar presentation as escapes, but I'm not doing them anymore either. I did traditional stage for a while too, but wasn't thrilled with it either. I really like the crowd interaction, and escapes, stunts, and traditional stage don't have enough of what I like. I like comedy magic, and that is about it. As for kids liking escapes, I wouldn't think so, but I know as soon as I say that someone will pop up with a really creative way to do an escape that will cause kids to go bananas. I don't think it is so much that they aren't logical, but it does not move fast enough, or is flashy enough for kids - unless you go all out, which is generally not possible. Of course, you will always have a PC parent ready to raise a ruckas too. . |
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