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balducci
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Quote:
On 2012-11-20 19:09, Slide wrote:
Ha! The article is saying that unions were the demise of the LOOM industry!! LOL. Ever heard of the term Luddite?!

I get the impression that you either missed the point of the article or are vastly oversimplifying what it is talking about. Besides which, I do not think the article ever even really said what you suggest. I think it blamed greedy management structures much more than unions.
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
acesover
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.
Quote:
On 2012-11-20 17:55, Slide wrote:
"Do you believe that the employees should dictate scheduling and job duties."

Well, if you are a manager who ignores their employee's scheduling and job duty concerns, you are not much of a manager. Recently my girlfriend, who works retail, said she no longer wants to work past 9pm. The manager agreed. Then the manager poster her to work to 11:30pm. My girlfriend quit. My girlfriend is very well liked and the expert in her department. Her sales are always twice what other peoples sales are for her area. When she quit, the other employees started handing in their resignations. The manager begged her to come back and gave her exactly what she wanted.

If you ignore your employees, you are not going to be in business for long.


If you let the employees do the scheduling and set the job duties you are not needed as a manager. It is a two edged sword. You talking about a sales girl as opposed to a stock girl or a cashier. They are two completely different concepts. There are no sales people in Wal Marat. Wal Mart is a mass merchandiser there is no selling involved for 99.99% of their sales. If you want it you buy it. There is no selling up, or add on sales. Wal Mart is not that kind of store. If where your girlfriend worked is a sales oriented store that is different. You are referring to sales people not stock girls or guys or cashiers.

Why did the other employees hand in their resignation because of what happened to your girlfriend? That part I do not understand.

As you say if you ignore your employees you are not going to be in business long but if you ignore your custsomers you will not be in business at all. they need to see stocked shelves and they want fast check outa and clean stores. thatis what the employees of Wal Martr get paid for not to make management decisions or set their own scchedules. They can give what hours they can work and if needed they will be hired and if not they won't be hired. I agree with you if an employee says on her application they cannot work certain hours or days and are scheduled for those hours there is definitely a breakdown in management and it is not the employees fault. If you say you cannot work on Sat and I need a person for Sat I do not hire you. It is not rocket science. I am sure there are some managers who are for lack of a better word dicks, but I do not believe that is the rule but rather the exception and I am sure at times some managers will ask a person if they can do a favor by working on a certain shift or day. As they say one hand washes the other. But no matter what you do, you do not let the employees set their own schedules. As a manager you must schedule according to store needs and traffic and what needs to be accomplished and when it needs to be accomplished.
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LobowolfXXX
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It looks really good on your resume when you say that your reason for leaving your last job is that you were protesting another employee's hours.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

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tommy
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There is another employee?
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acesover
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I read with much interest the article balducci refrenced as I am from this area. I know Mayor Christopher Doherty very well and have had dinner with him several times and have been over his house and he has been over mine.

While this is an article about Scranton it is also an article about the way America has changed. Lace Mills. When have you seen a lace table cloth on a table lately? When have you seen lace things on tables or chairs lately? When have you purchaed a record last? My cousins used to work at capitol record years ago and lived in South Side Scranton not far from the factory in fact they walked to work.

Times are tough...for some. I do not see them mentioning anything about teacher salaries or other political plums of Scranton and Wilkes Barre. There are a lot of sad stories. Scranton and Wilkes Barre are cities in decline. They once thrived on coal yet they mention it iin passing but do give a dig to fracking where we can have hundreds if not thousands of jobs if this resource is brought to florish. Wilkes Barre once housed Planters Peanut founded bythe Obisey Family.

They speak of records, and lace mills. As I asked earlier when was thelast time you purchased a record or a lace table cloth. If you don't change then you stagnate and this area has done just that.

Oh please don't tell me how wonderful the women in sewing factories had it. You do not know what you are talking about. Ask some of them how much their union pension is after working there for 30 some years. Most do not get over $40 a month. Ask them about the working conditions they endured. The unions were crooks. The ILGWU were crooks.

While the article is right about a few things it is wrong so wrong about others and uses half truths. This is not an article of truth but rather propaganda with many half truths. I have used the phrase many times, that figures lie and liars figure. Well this is a perfect ecample.

To try and correct what these men have written would take a long long time of which I do not wish to put my time into as in this forum you will get those who will jump all over one and not know what the heck they are talking about and I will do nothing but aggrevate myself.

Is Scranton and Wilkes Barre area in financial trouble? Yes. Have these gentlemen who wrote this article given any suggestions as to how to get out of this trouble? No. But they are already aganist fracking and using the resource of natural gas which is abundant in this area. Coal was what made this area prosperous not a lace mill and a record factory. There was no mention of the Knox mine disaster which just about ruined the coal industsry in this area. When the Susquenna river flooded the mines. I could go on and on but to what avail?

This is where I have lived for 69 years and have seen many changes but these changes are not just in Scranton and Wilkes Pa. Many are nationwide. Lace mills close when lace is not used any more. You are talking about a different time. Record companies shut down when replaced by tapes and later CD's. Again you are talking about a different time.

The article while well written is full of half truths. It makes for very difficult reading when you really know. My great grand fathers were coal miners from what we refer to as from the old county and both died from what we know here in the Pa. coal region as Black lung. Have you ever seen a picture of a Pa. coal miner when he came home from work? His face was totally black and all you could make out were his eyes.

I have gone so far off topic here and just rambled I apologize. I am done here.

Good luck to Wal mart and their employees and Have a Happy Thanksgiving and a great Black Friday. Shop or strike whatever makes you happy. You can do either because this is America. God bless America.
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irossall
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It looks like Hostess is going to be awarded their bankruptcy after all.
I don't twinkie's are going away for very long. Twinkie's are too popular. Someone will purchase the formula and rights and Twinkie's will be back on the shelves (they might even be a better product than before).
I hope that Suzy Q's make a comeback but I am afraid they are not very popular, so they will vanish Smile
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Quote:
On 2012-11-20 21:24, Payne wrote:
Quote:
On 2012-11-20 20:26, FatHatter wrote:

So I repeat:
Isn't the linchpin of a union the ability to stop others from taking the jobs their members walked out on?



No, the linchpin of a union is the ability to represent its membership and provide them with the best negotiated contract it can. As well as to protect its memberships positions and give them an avenue to pursue and rectify grievances. It empowers the employees of a company and allows their voice to be heard. One of its powers is calling a strike. Not just of the employees in the company they are having labor difficulties with. But any other union shop that has dealings with the company. Other union members would support the striking workers by refusing to cross the picket lines. Thus Wal-Mart, to use an example, would find its store running out of merchandise as Longshoremen and Teamsters would refuse to off load or ship their merchandise. They could also call strikes at other related union shops in an attempt to pressure the company into fair and equitable negotiations. There isn't a single linchpin, but a toobox of many tactics.


So in addition to stopping someone else from working a job they choose not to, they also have others that will deny a business goods and services the business has agreed to pay for? Are there any constructive tactics used or only threats and violence?
Payne
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Quote:
On 2012-11-21 14:13, FatHatter wrote:

So in addition to stopping someone else from working a job they choose not to, they also have others that will deny a business goods and services the business has agreed to pay for? Are there any constructive tactics used or only threats and violence?



Whatever it takes to stick it to the man Smile
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balducci
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A list of Union-made Thanksgiving products. Buy / eat them or not, according to your leanings. Smile

Turkey
Boar's Head—UFCW
Butterball—UFCW
Foster Poultry Farms—UFCW
Thumann's—UFCW [...]

Side Dishes
Ocean Spray Whole Berry Cranberry Sauce—IAM
Birds Eye vegetables—UFCW
Betty Crocker Specialty Potatoes—BCTGM

Bread
Pillsbury crescent rolls, frozen and bake rolls/breads—BCTGM
Pillsbury pie crusts—BCTGM
Stroehmann bakery products (for stuffing)—BCTGM

Dessert
Sara Lee pumpkin, apple pie—BCTGM
Mother’s Kitchen pies and cakes—BCTGM
Nabisco cookies—BCTGM
Make America Great Again! - Trump in 2020 ... "We're a capitalistic society. I go into business, I don't make it, I go bankrupt. They're not going to bail me out. I've been on welfare and food stamps. Did anyone help me? No." - Craig T. Nelson, actor.
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Quote:
On 2012-11-21 15:15, Payne wrote:
Quote:
On 2012-11-21 14:13, FatHatter wrote:

So in addition to stopping someone else from working a job they choose not to, they also have others that will deny a business goods and services the business has agreed to pay for? Are there any constructive tactics used or only threats and violence?




Whatever it takes to stick it to the man Smile


Yea these people are brilliant. Biting the hand that feeds them. They definitely sound like Wharton School graduates.

About as brilliant as Payne with his remark "Whatever it takes to stick it to the man". This is the mentality we deal with on a daily basis. Jeeez.

I know I want to hire these people after they leave Wal Mart. They sound like great employees to me. They will really help my company. Sigm them up with all kind of benefits and vacation days and throw in a bonus because I see how well they treated their last employer. Start them at $25 per hour. They have already proven themselves.
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Payne
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Quote:
On 2012-11-21 23:11, acesover wrote:

I know I want to hire these people after they leave Wal Mart. They sound like great employees to me. They will really help my company. Sigm them up with all kind of benefits and vacation days and throw in a bonus because I see how well they treated their last employer. Start them at $25 per hour.



If only Wal-Mart was as generous an employer as you seem to be. You recognise the value of your employees and see that are people, not just entries on a spread sheet. So you see the value that they bring to your business and reward them accordingly. You treat them as stakeholders in your company not just a commodity that can be discarded and and abused. Wal-Mart could learn much from your generosity and progressive views. If only they had adopten them. They wouldn't be havig the difficulty they are currently having with their employees.
"America's Foremost Satirical Magician" -- Jeff McBride.
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Walmart already has a union ... its called the United States Government. After the last round of negotiations, they agreed to pay all employees a minimum wage of at least $7.25 an hour.

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LobowolfXXX
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Quote:
On 2012-11-21 23:31, Payne wrote:
Quote:
On 2012-11-21 23:11, acesover wrote:

I know I want to hire these people after they leave Wal Mart. They sound like great employees to me. They will really help my company. Sigm them up with all kind of benefits and vacation days and throw in a bonus because I see how well they treated their last employer. Start them at $25 per hour.



If only Wal-Mart was as generous an employer as you seem to be. You recognise the value of your employees and see that are people, not just entries on a spread sheet. So you see the value that they bring to your business and reward them accordingly. You treat them as stakeholders in your company not just a commodity that can be discarded and and abused. Wal-Mart could learn much from your generosity and progressive views. If only they had adopten them. They wouldn't be havig the difficulty they are currently having with their employees.


Apparently more generous to their employees than any other employer in their area, or those employees wouldn't choose to work at Walmart.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
Payne
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Quote:
On 2012-11-22 01:31, LobowolfXXX wrote:

Apparently more generous to their employees than any other employer in their area, or those employees wouldn't choose to work at Walmart.



In some areas they have little choice as Wal-Mart is the major employer in the region. The few people that I know who work for Wal-Mart only do so because there are no other jobs to be had in the area. They would quit if they could. But there is no place else to go and no other jobs available.
"America's Foremost Satirical Magician" -- Jeff McBride.
ed rhodes
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Quote:
On 2012-11-21 02:18, acesover wrote:
.
Quote:
On 2012-11-20 17:55, Slide wrote:
"Do you believe that the employees should dictate scheduling and job duties."

Well, if you are a manager who ignores their employee's scheduling and job duty concerns, you are not much of a manager. Recently my girlfriend, who works retail, said she no longer wants to work past 9pm. The manager agreed. Then the manager poster her to work to 11:30pm. My girlfriend quit. My girlfriend is very well liked and the expert in her department. Her sales are always twice what other peoples sales are for her area. When she quit, the other employees started handing in their resignations. The manager begged her to come back and gave her exactly what she wanted.

If you ignore your employees, you are not going to be in business for long.


If you let the employees do the scheduling and set the job duties you are not needed as a manager. It is a two edged sword. You talking about a sales girl as opposed to a stock girl or a cashier. They are two completely different concepts. There are no sales people in Wal Marat. Wal Mart is a mass merchandiser there is no selling involved for 99.99% of their sales. If you want it you buy it. There is no selling up, or add on sales. Wal Mart is not that kind of store. If where your girlfriend worked is a sales oriented store that is different. You are referring to sales people not stock girls or guys or cashiers.

Why did the other employees hand in their resignation because of what happened to your girlfriend? That part I do not understand.

As you say if you ignore your employees you are not going to be in business long but if you ignore your custsomers you will not be in business at all. they need to see stocked shelves and they want fast check outa and clean stores. thatis what the employees of Wal Martr get paid for not to make management decisions or set their own scchedules. They can give what hours they can work and if needed they will be hired and if not they won't be hired. I agree with you if an employee says on her application they cannot work certain hours or days and are scheduled for those hours there is definitely a breakdown in management and it is not the employees fault. If you say you cannot work on Sat and I need a person for Sat I do not hire you. It is not rocket science. I am sure there are some managers who are for lack of a better word dicks, but I do not believe that is the rule but rather the exception and I am sure at times some managers will ask a person if they can do a favor by working on a certain shift or day. As they say one hand washes the other. But no matter what you do, you do not let the employees set their own schedules. As a manager you must schedule according to store needs and traffic and what needs to be accomplished and when it needs to be accomplished.


When you are hired at Walmart, you are asked for your hours of availability (with the understanding that the more time you put down, the more hours you'll be given.) I put down that I was available until 10:00 pm because the last bus left at 10:06. A couple of years ago, I checked the schedule during Christmas week when we were open until 11:30, my manager put me in for 11:30. I told him I wasn't available that late and he looked at me blankly and said; "That's how late we're open." Later, while checking my schedule and trying to figure out how I was going to get home, he came up at the same time as another manager and said (sarcastically, I felt); "Ed said he has to leave at 10:00 and doesn't know how he's going to get home if he has to work 'til 11:30." The other manager said; "Of course Ed has to leave at 10:00. He has to take the bus. We knew that when we hired him." At which point MY manager back-pedeled like crazy and said; "Oh. Of course Ed has to leave. His safety is important." So I had permission to leave at 10:00.

Happy ending? Not quite, because for the rest of the Christmas season, the manager kept scheduling me for 11:30! Which meant I had permission to leave at 10:00, but I would lose an hour and a half of pay getting there.

This was one of the several reasons I finally wrote a letter to the general manager of the store asking to be transferred to any other department. They made me a cashier, where I was perfectly happy for about six months. Until the re-organized the assistant managers and MY ex-manager was put in charge of the cashiers and the back end! To be fair, he doesn't micro-manage the front end as much as he did hardware... but he's still there.
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Ain't life unkind?"
JoeJoe
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Quote:
On 2012-11-22 01:54, Payne wrote:
In some areas they have little choice as Wal-Mart is the major employer in the region. The few people that I know who work for Wal-Mart only do so because there are no other jobs to be had in the area. They would quit if they could. But there is no place else to go and no other jobs available.


So Walmart moves into a economically depressed area and creates a bunch of jobs ... gee Payne, you said that like it was a bad thing?? [rolling eyes]

If a caveman didn't hunt or gather food ... he didn't eat ... period! Manna is not going to start falling from the heavens anytime soon.

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Slide
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"So Walmart moves into a economically depressed area and creates a bunch of jobs "

at what cost? Local businesses are wiped out because they can't compete and we increase our dependance on China. That is what Walmart does.
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Walmart moved into my area and it has not been "wiped out", in fact the area is booming.

And who is to say that an area wouldn't have been wiped out if Walmart hadn't moved into it??

And Walmart is hardly to blame for our dependence on China, we were dependent on them long before Walmart became the #1 retailer.

-JoeJoe
Amazing JoeJoe on YouTube[url=https://www.youtube.com/user/AmazingJoeJoe]
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Joe

I suggest you do some research into walmarts relationship with their suppliers
JoeJoe
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I am very familiar with walmart and how they do business. I also know a lame excuse when I hear one.

Since Walmart opened here, so has Big Lots, TGIF's, and Gino's Pizza ... not to mention a little mom and pop "party store" that sells the same things walmart sells in the same shopping center. Lots of business have opened since Walmart came to town.

Walmart was selling "squirmles" for $2.89 at the register ... the same product I sold at the flea market for $5. Did I ***** and complain about it? No ... I adapted. I matched their price and put it in my pitch - "you can buy one for $3 or two for $5 - that's cheaper than walmart, nobody sells things cheaper than walmart". I even kept a picture I took of their display - one day a lady tried to claim they were only a dollar at walmart, so I pull out my picture and say "no mam, they are $2.89 at walmart" ... she walked off all ticked off like, yet the two other ladies snatched them up. The irony is she was somewhat correct, as walmart had rolled back the price to $1.50 to clearance them out ... and they no longer sell them at all now. Tell me again who "can't compete" with walmart??

It is not that local business "can't compete" with walmart ... they are unwilling to.

-JoeJoe
Amazing JoeJoe on YouTube[url=https://www.youtube.com/user/AmazingJoeJoe]
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