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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Ever so sleightly » » Cup through Cup (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Pete Biro
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1933 - 2018
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Great... will try it, THANKS
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
Rainboguy
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Lawrence O:

I just tried this with my Johnson Cups and it's BEAUTIFUL!

Thank you so much~!

I think I'm going to do this as the 3rd cup-through-cup move......I've always done the 2 traditional cup-through-cup moves, but the entire sequence will be stronger with this as a 3rd move.

GREAT STUFF!

<just a note to other magii: If you have a few sets of different cups....try them all with this move....some may have a better "balance and feel" for the "toss in air" move than others do....my Johnson's are PERFECT for this move, methinks~!

Now on to the Mendozas!!

(Tossing a Charlie Miller Cup in the air......just plain SCARES ME!)
cirrus
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I will not do this with my brad new sisti cups...
Motley Mage
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Rainbowguy--I agree that a three-part build would be a great use for this move. 1. Push the cups through each other--2. Toss/drop one cup through the other--3. one-handed toss through. As I picture it in my mind, if you did this move without first setting the idea of cups passing through cups well into the spectators' minds, it could instead look like you attempted to catch the cup and missed!
Rainboguy
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Motley Mage:

Exactly...and for some mystical reason of Magic Mojo....good Magic comes in sets of "3's".
Magicmike1949
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For some reason the illusion of a cup passing through another has never looked good to me. Even when I was a layman, it looked just like what it is, and it was being one by some of the experts. For some reason it's just never been a strong illusion for my brain. Am I the only one?
tomsk192
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You're not the only one, MagicMike1949. For me, as a layman, it worked as a gag. In a way, the whole routine is one, skilful gag. Passing the wand through a cup, passing a cup through a cup, inertia spins [for the less muddled], these are all gags. The bit they can't see, hopefully, is what happens with the balls. But they know what is happening, and what is about to happen. The pleasure is a charm.

$0.02
Ray Haining
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The purpose of the cup through cup illusion is not the illusion itself--although we want to make that as nice as possible--it is to subtly show the cups empty.
Motley Mage
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I just recently tried out the cup through cup cleanly for tye first time and gound it surprisingly convincing. As is often the case, we must remember to see what the audience sees, not what we know to be the case.
Ray Haining
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We must also try to see what the audience sees and not what we would like them to see. The purpose of the illusion is to show the cups empty (which they may not actually be) without calling attention to the fact, not the illusion itself, which doesn't fool anyone, only makes them chuckle.
kentfgunn
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No negative reflection on any performer choices here.

I don't understand why you would want to include the cup-thru-cup sequence in a routine.

I believe if the vast majority of magicians do a sequence like this in their routine, that alone, is reason to NOT use it. I suspect it actually fools no one. It's a bit of by-play that implies the cups have hinges or can pass through one another. Why give the audience an explanation? Even the wrong explanation, I believe detracts from the performance.
Al Schneider
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I personally do not use the move. Here is why.
Early in my magic career I started doing the cups.
I was at a party with a lady I was dating.
In a quiet moment after I had performed, she made a comment about the move.
She said, "Al, that's beneath you."
Welllllll, I never performed it after that.
Al Schneider
Magic Al. Say it fast and it is magical.
Woland
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Hi Mr. Schneider,

The comic relief implied by the move is certainly not the "virtual magic" to which you have taught me to aspire.
Ray Haining
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Quote from "The Dai Vernon Book of Magic," by Lewis Ganson, Chapter Thirteen: "In addition to providing some amusing by-play, the above moves [cup through cup, done twice] have proved the cups to be empty without a statement of fact having been made."
kentfgunn
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Ray,

Great quote. It's because of that quote I toss each cup into the air, briefly, before setting it down, to show them unmistakably empty, without having to say it.

I fear because The Professor did it, too many magicians copy him. If nearly every magician you see does it, it has become hackneyed. Hanging out with the masses simply isn't for me. I hear the beat of a different drummer.

Still it's a great quote.

KG
Donnie Buckley
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I've always viewed the "cup thru cup" illusion as a throw-away gag. It will produce a groan from an intelligent spectator.
I like the way Tommy Wonder presented it in his L&L performance: he sort of dismisses it with a wink and a nod.
It's not a bad thing to do IF you present it right - it can make the audience feel clever and help set you up for getting them on your side. And yes, it shows the cups empty.

There are step by step instruction on how to perform this illusion in this thread, in an open forum, but it's not exposure because I can't imagine a real person actually searching Google for "how does a magician put one cup through another?".
Learn the form, but seek the formless. Learn it all, then forget it all. Learn the way, then find your own way. Rings-N-Things
Pete Biro
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Don't forget my mechanical "Tiger Wand" for the wand thru cup.
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
malaki
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My wife also criticized me for the cup thru cup move, saying it looked too obvious.

After reading the posts here and the description of the move in Ammar's works (and others), I found that moving the hand that sent the cup down to catch the cup is the way to make it look real. Something about the hand movement helps to give it more congruent movement, but the audience seems to buy it.

I look forward to trying the method described here as well.
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