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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The workshop » » Black Art finish to Dagger Chest interior (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Jim Tighe
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West Virginia
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I'm just getting to the finishing stage of my dagger head chest and want to reinforce the finish on the Black Art interior doors to withstand gouging from either arrows or daggers. Would a clear acrylic spray on finish be effective without harming the black art performance illusion? Should I use multiple coats?
Right now I have two coats of primer and two coats of rustoleum ultra flat black paint on it.

Thanks in advance.
WolfgangWollet
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I would suggest against paint and instead glue a thin black velvet (non shiny) in mine.
Jim Tighe
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Have you done it both ways? I just know that the dealer head chests that use black art have paint and figured it must either be the superior or cheaper method.
Can one find really thin flat velvet? Is it difficult to glue without forming bubbles. What is the best glue?
Magicduck
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Washington State
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Honestly, my experience is that mirrors are a much more effective way to go on this. Black art looks like what it is in that application...a way of obstructing the audience's view. Mirrors make the effect really amazing. It is not much harder to use mirrors than the black art doors and well worth the effort.
quack
Michael Messing
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Knoxville, TN
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Jim,

The reason dealers use paint rather than velvet (dead black velvet) is that it is cheaper and easier to do, not better. Magicduck is correct that mirrors are the best method, but if you prefer to stick with black art, here's a trick (no pun intended) that a magic builder gave me.

Glue your velvet to panels that you then glue into your chest. It's much easier to get it smooth when you are just gluing it to a flat piece of 1/8" masonite (tempered hardboard). Then you just glue that masonite into place.

Michael
Jim Tighe
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West Virginia
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Thanks for the replies. Unfortunately, I've already assembled the sides (including hinges and panels). I really was just considering spraying a finish to help protect against chipping (see original question).

This project may end up being a test run (my first illusion building project). The materials aren't that expensive so if I build a second one will definitely try mirrors. What type of tiny hinges will work with a mirror? Can you drill into it without cracking it?
kaytracy
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Central California
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I used the plastic/poly "glue or screw" on hinges from my local TAP-the same place I found Acrylic mirror...they cut to size for you, and the savings in weight is pretty nice! Plus the acrylic glue/solvent stuff works on them!
Kay and Tory
www.Bizarremagick.com
Magicduck
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I normally use glass mirrors, just because of the perfect reflection they provide. I epoxy the hinges on the back side. Then I take pieces of cardboard, about the diameter of the hinge, soak it in epoxy and glue that over the hinge and onto the mirror. This makes a joint that is so strong the mirror will break if you try to remove the hinge. I then glue a backing on a piece of cardboard and glue the cardboard over the back of the mirror. The plastic mirrors are tougher and lighter, but do not have as good a refraction.
quack
WolfgangWollet
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When working with the Acrylic Solvent (most likely Weldon 3 or 5) make sure that it does not come in contact with the mirrored side (back) It will "eat" the mirror coating on the acrylic mirror right off....
kaytracy
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Was just looking in a woodworking catalog the other day and they have the hinges that cup and set screw ontop glass, like for your stereo or entertainment center cabinet for a couple bucks a set.they grip on the bottoms and tops mostly, and give a fairly smooth swing.
Kay and Tory
www.Bizarremagick.com
Michael Messing
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When I worked with mirrors on an illusion I built, I attached the hinge to a piece of plywood and then glued the mirror (glass) to the plywood.
Frank Tougas
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Another interesting finish I don't hear much about is flock. As long as you are going for the black art, you could apply black flock over the paint before it dries.

Flock works much like glitter over paint or glue except it is made of fiber. It gives that fuzzy look much the same as velvet or velour. I have seen it inside magic props before.

It is best applied with a flock gun, much like a baloon pump it sort of sprays the fibers at the sticky paint where they adhere.

The one time I used it was building a stepped dispay for magic items. I used red and it looked quite good. Black would give you a great black art effect.
Frank Tougas The Twin Cities Most "Kid Experienced" Children's Performer :"Creating Positive Memories...One Smile at a Time"
Jim Tighe
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Sounds like an interesting idea. Where's the best place to find this "flock"?
kaytracy
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Try checking online at the WOODCRAFT store, http://www.woodcraft.com they have a flocking supply area, with the little hand pump only costing about $5, and 3 oz of flock for about $10 -enough to do 10-15 sq feet, depending upon how heavy you apply!
Kay and Tory
www.Bizarremagick.com
Jim Tighe
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Thanks for the info.
tboehnlein
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I have often considered building my own dagger chest as the one that are commercially available look so cheesey, does anyone know where I could find plans for one.
kaytracy
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I used the Osbourne book, I can use the stand base, or just the box, though the stand is nice, a headless person seems a bit off, but the working went well
Kay and Tory
www.Bizarremagick.com
tboehnlein
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Which Osbourne Book?
Doolah
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Grand Rapids, MI
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As far as paints go, the flat paints are the weakest link in the paint strata. When I do use rustoleum ultra flat spray (it is the best flat spray out there, there are brush-on paints that are flatter) I do it over bare wood, no primer, for adhesion. I follow that with a couple coats of flat acrylic varnish and sand that lightly but thoroughly with 320 - 800 grit sandpaper. You will find that flat black alone scuffs terribly and requires re-coating to get rid of the gray marks that come from scuffing.
When having a furniture quality finish is not a consideration, I spray several coats of black acrylic enamel over bare wood, sand, and finish with the flat acrylic varnish.
If a furniture finish is desired, use several coats of hi-build primer, sand and finish as above. The toughest primer is XIM-it even allows you to paint over glass, mirror, or tile.
The flocking idea is great. Use 3M spray adhesive over a black base coat of paint, generously shake the flock out of a pepper shaker, roll over that with a 3" rubber Formica roller and blow off the excess. The flock can be "fixed" with the flat acrylic varnish to eliminate shedding if you like.
Good Luck!
Doolah
kaytracy
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Central California
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I will have to dig it out of the workroom to check the title, but it has the head dagger box on a stand, and the palanquin illusion in it, was hoping to get to that one. It had this set of twin belly dancers.
Kay and Tory
www.Bizarremagick.com
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