On May 22, 2014, ZachDavenport wrote:

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On May 22, 2014, Jeff Wassom wrote:
Zach invest 20+ years in something first before asking 'what's the big deal?' lol

I'll get back to you 20 years from now.

On May 22, 2014, Jeff Wassom wrote:

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On May 22, 2014, ZachDavenport wrote:

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On May 22, 2014, Jeff Wassom wrote:
Zach invest 20+ years in something first before asking 'what's the big deal?' lol

I'll get back to you 20 years from now.

My fault for thinking you were interested in learning something from these good folks.

Nevermind. =)

On May 22, 2014, Mindpro wrote:
Zach, I'm sorry but you don't get it. That was my point earlier, is that when you think you do, you will stop being open to the things that will eventually allow you to actually start to get it.

Statements like "I get it. Magic and mentalism is very different from each other. But when it comes down to it, it is all an illusion. The difference is that mentalism is real seeming, while magic is obviously a trick" and "the only difference between mentalism, and mental magic is the performance" is not just incorrect, but to others it shows your ignorance (not meant as a slam or as in being stupid, but as in being new, uneducated and uninformed, and believing something to be true that is not).

I have a saying you can't hear if you're always talking. Meaning you can learn if you are always speaking, making bold statements and positions based on minimal knowledge and lack of study and information.

After all of these professionals have taken the time to try to assist you for you still not being able to comprehend it (which no one expects you to do yet without study, research and experience) and make such inaccurate statements from a perception of fact, is indeed annoying to many.

My suggestion is rather than thinking you know, come to the realization that you don't or that what you think you know may be incorrect. That would be my first step. Then, once you truly believe and understand that, then and only then will you even be open and at a position to begin to listen and learn from others. You have a rare and unique tool that you have access to some great talented professional performers and their lifetime of knowledge and experience. They are not your peers, they are your elders that you should look up to, respected and realize the opportunity of what they are sharing with you. This was never available to previous generations, so my next piece of advice is to use this unique tool and resource sparingly and wisely.

Next would be stop thinking and relating everything to a magician. Many of us treat mentalism separate and individually as it is and should be. You seem to be focusing on the 5% that you seem to see as similar rather than the 95% that is completely different.

A magician think of tricks, mentalists don't. It's not about the effects, it's about so much more - mentalities, emotion, personal investment, process, impact, authenticness, the experience and much more. It's much more than just the end result. It's not about "look at what I can do", that too is magic, it's much deeper and personal, which is why so many would believe it is real even if you tell them it's not.

You also seem to have a limited understanding that mentalism is mental tricks or effects, when many mentalsist here have regularly done full 90 minute stage shows without a single trick, effect, prop or anything related to magic but with 100% true, real and authentic abilities doing everything legitimately and for real. This again is not in any way magic and is offensive for those that do so to be told by anyone, yet alone a 14 year inexperienced kid, that it is the same as magic.

My last bit of advice you will likely also not understand but it would be this...at your position as a beginner, be careful and wise about who you choose to be influenced by, who you study and who you choose to listen to. Start with the foundational information and the classics (and I don't necessarily mean old stuff). So many of newbies your age are impressed with these newfangled, young hot shots, which while they may or may not be good for mentalism, they are not what you need at this point in your process. Some will get bent out of shape by this but it is true. These young guys that want to be Derren Brown, Peter Turner. Atlas Brookings, etc. have taken their foundational studies and have gone to a specific direction and level. They have grown and evolved to this point and level. That is not for beginners. It is nothing against these guys but hurrying to be like them will only cause you to skip the important and crucial foundational process and levels that is so important and necessary if you sincerely and truly want to learn mentalism. I think even these guys would agree and tell you this themselves. Look down in the for sale section, there are currently 9 Peter Turner items for sale. Is it because they are not any good? No, it is more likely because Peter's advance thinking and level is beyond those that purchased them or that they are not their style. My point is go through the process properly, it will save you time, and probably thousands of dollars, not to mention a ton of frustration.

I'm not sure you'll get this but to me it was worth the time and effort to try to better explain what you seem to be having so much trouble with.

Shhhhh, listen....learn.....study......then slowly jump in and ask questions. It's a much clearer and more enjoyable journey.

On May 22, 2014, Mindpro wrote:
These young guys that want to be Derren Brown, Peter Turner. Atlas Brookings, etc. have taken their foundational studies and have gone to a specific direction and level. They have grown and evolved to this point and level. That is not for beginners. It is nothing against these guys but hurrying to be like them will only cause you to skip the important and crucial foundational process and levels that is so important and necessary if you sincerely and truly want to learn mentalism. I think even these guys would agree and tell you this themselves.

On May 22, 2014, mastermindreader wrote:
Swamister-

Stop ripping me off- I created that effect in 1979.

Seriously, when are you going to get your real name back? At least tell the guys here who you are and what happened to your other account, so they don't think you're just a newbie here.

Mike, you are entitled to your opinion, we just disagree. Mentalsim is meant to be performed for a body of people simultaneously. I too do radio to promote my stage shows, I would never in a million years consider these appearances "shows". I know for a fact Kreskin doesn't either. Doing something one on one is not a show, it's just that a one on one personal experience, exactly like a reading. That to me is not performance mentalism. Performing on the fly or casually in a pub is not a "show" or "performance" to me but rather a "check out what I can do" or "let's try a little something", again to me not a performance.

A performance or a show has specific elements and qualities. If they are not present it is not a show or a performance but likely a demonstration. This goes much larger than just with mentalism, as it more widespead. We have a whole youtube generation that thinks just because they record something that they are a performer or an entertainer. They're not, again huge difference.

Those that do such types of "performing" of course think and believe it is performing and entertainment. Most that do the actual type of performing I mentioned (mentalism or otherwise) often will feel the same as I.

Even a strolling entertainer is not doing a show, he is doing a series of one on one or small group of "a little something" and then moving on to do another. They may feel like they are performing or doing a show, but again by definition it is the same as the point I've made.

You can call it elementray if you'd like and if it makes you feel better or somehow justifies it to yourself that's fine, but what is truly elementary is someone that "does a quick little something" on youtube or an ambush on the streets and somehow thinks he is a entertainer.

On May 23, 2014, insight wrote:
Seems like you agree that a performance can be done for one person.

quote]On May 23, 2014, Gumar Oz DuBar wrote:
Rich Ferguson? Really? The guy who did the This Is Mentalism DVDs? Rip-offs abundant in that set.