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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Grand illusion » » Thin Model Sawing vs. Wakeling Sawing (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Keith Jozsef
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Having performed both...the Wakeling always received a better response...at least from my focus groups. I'm in full agreement though, that presentation is everything. (who knows, maybe my Wakeling presentation was just that much better than the thin model?) But the reason I feel it's an inherently better illusion is because of the direct participation of the audience members on stage. This is not a "too-quick" rush to judgment, as msillusions alluded. Audiences like to be up close and involved in big illusions--and it doesn't happen often. And, it instantly adds credibility to the illusion.

The thin sawing may have been the most sleek way to cut a lady in half, say, in the 70's and 80's--but the bar got raised with Clearly Impossible, and the visual cutting in half put out by Creative Illusions (it had no boxes), and lest we forget David Copperfield's Laser sawing.

I think we're holding on to the past, with too firm a grip, concerning the thin-model. That's why, I believe, when you see it performed today, it's mostly done as a "double-sawing", to mis-match the assistants. Giving a visual newness to an otherwise out-dated illusion.

Funny that Wakeling looked to the past, to help the sawing illusion's future.

Keith
magicbymccauley
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Doesn't it depend on performing conditions? If you have control of performing conditions (perfect lighting, sound, etc) than the TMS is superior, right? And if not the wakeling is better right?
"Tricks are about objects, Magic is about life."
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RyanDicharry
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In my opinion with all the technology these days I find that lay people are a bit technological smarter then they were 20 years ago. With the internet, robotics, smartphones, and Special FX available at any mall they come to expect some type mechanics when viewing illusions these days. Even in the last 15 years we have seen a drastic increase in the technology that is offered to everyday people. I tend to lean to the old adage that "Less Is More". I find that more laypeople are more amazed by vintage illusions such as the Walkling Sawing then say one of the mega illusions seen today. The sub trunk is a great example.

I do not care how deceptive a TMS is or how good the mechanics are there are some laypeople that are going to know the method right away. However, these same laypeople will be amazed by the Walkling. Mostly because they have not seen it before and the simplicity of the illusion as a whole.
i-o-f
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Ryan that is a excellent observation. I perform the Wakeling myself for about 10 Years now and I have the same feeling about it....In our technological and "artificial" time, the "back to the roots" approach of the Wakeling has the right feeling to the audience. It gets true and great reactions.

Just look at the movies, all the storytelling and production design is made more "down to earth" and realistic. F.E. compare 90s "Batman Forever" with the contemporary "The Dark Knight"....
Oliver

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MagicalMotivator
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Regarding the original question "which version do you think has a greater impact and is more magical to the audience?"

I would have to say that TMS "looks" more magical to the audience - it is a very visual effect - anybody watching it can appreciate the simplicity of what is happening without explanation - and while the performer does make the effect without question, a well made, deceptive box really helps - looking back at when Doug Henning and S & R (with the floating and circular saw) performed it, the boxes really looked (from close up on TV) really thin and unprepared - also if anyone ever would question the validity of the parts in the one box, they were always left with the question of "where did the rest of her go"?

However, I would also say that if you were addressing "greater impact" than WS would win hands down. It's simply that kind of effect. It is designed to answer all the misconceptions the public has about sawing a person in half (trick boxes, blades, fake parts, etc) and leave them with no place to go. However it is not as magical looking as TMS.

As a note, the first time I ever saw WS performed live was by the recently deceased Peter Reeven (God Rest His Soul) - and he really sold it. I still remember his line (or something like it), "this table is from a Hollywood Prop Department, and made for the Movies, it was used to sacrifice "virgins", as you can see it has hardly been used."


Rick
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MagicalMotivator
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As an added note - The Walter Blaney Sawing is a great version of the original sawing in half.

Rick
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jcsum
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Interestingly enough, I pondered the same questions that you guys had. So, I thought of a combo Wakeling/ Thin Sawing that I had built in 2006.

I have detailed the prop design, performance and presentation with photos in the Backstage section of my website.

This is password protected and usually reserved for owners of my books but I think there will be a lot of Café-goers who will be interested in this so have made the password specific for this entry and accessible by you guys.

The password is the last name of the British magician credited for performing the first version of Sawing a Woman in Half. Last name only - all in lower caps.

http://illusionbooks.wordpress.com/2013/......-design/

I think it might give you some ideas with this possible solution. I'm not saying it is the right or best solution but it is an answer I developed that I think will be useful to you to think about.

J C
J C Sum

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euroillusion
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Great idea JC. Thanks for sharing!

The backstage section is getting better and better too.

Jean-Paul
msmaster
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I've seen both Wakeling and the Thin model done well and not. I found this recent youtube thin model video kinda clever and fun.
msmaster
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http://youtu.be/ELkeE7OU6uY sorry, here's the link
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